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Things not going well in Venezuela

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  • Carrizo Chorizo
    Carrizo Chorizo

    Trump has focused heavily on foreign policy to his own detriment. I wish he would focus more domestically, but what can I do? Let's go way back to January 2025. What was one of the first big push

  • So, just so we're clear on your logical consistencies: Supplying weapons and funding to a sovereign nation who was invaded unprovoked by a country with a heavily vested interest in destabilizing the

  • Fudge Nuggets
    Fudge Nuggets

    We need the War Crimes tribunal to send the dotard a fake letter asking him to show up in The Hague to receive his Nobel Peace Prize like the cops do with  free TVs for crooks with outstanding warrant

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44 minutes ago, Ted Lange said:

Well, I had this same question.

There are some laws that make a drug conspiracy that ships into the US but is otherwise extraterritorial, a US crime. We knew this. It's how we got El Chapo and los chapitos, etc.

18 USC 924 makes it an enhancement to an offense to possess (or brandish, more of an enhancement, or fire, even more of an enhancement) a firearm during commission of a drug offense. So, as long as the crime is "chargeable" in the US, the gun actitivy doesn't have to take place here, apparently.

It's a pretty standard international drug conspiracy charging tactic.

So, I had wondered if this was more Trumpian incompetence, but it seems not.

Not sure about the conspiracy to possess a machine gun, though. That looks like it has to be done on US soil.

1 minute ago, El Mas Chingon said:

He said it. Monroe Doctrine. Endless handwringing in this thread over the reason for why we were pursuing this. It was obvious. It’s spelled out in national security strategy documents. National security. It’s great that Maduro is gone. I look forward to following what’s to come.

A shit show, that's what's coming. An expensive humanitarian shit show.

We'll get some oil and a lot of Chevron and Conoco workers are gonna get dead. And then we're gonna have boots on the ground.

44 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Maybe you should post another YouTube video of a dude rambling for 17 minutes to educate us.

Sorry your childlike attention span couldn't handle a topical five minute video. T&Ps for your favorite anti-American dictator.

39 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

WWIII.

I am not being totally flippant. The board is played by the great powers, and there are lots of pieces being held to the board by strings atm.

WWIII? LOL! Russia and China didn't start WWIII over Ukraine or Iran, but they're going to start it over the arrest of a tin-pot dictator in the western hemisphere? Great analysis...

alright-jennifer-lawrence.gif

BTW we're arguably already in a 21st century World War/Cold War, and arguably have been since about 2005/2008/2014.

15 minutes ago, CowboyFred said:

It doesn’t allow a fucking invasion, that is for sure. Or drummed up charges against a foreign leader. Kinda funny our president can’t be charged for crimes he committed in the US but a foreign president can.

What invasion? Define invasion in this context. "Drummed up charges"? Were the "charges" drummed up when they were imposed by Obama Bush or Biden? Are you implying that foreign politicians are immune from American justice? Or only immune when presidents you don't like pursue them?

For the morons: *Not a Trump endorsement*

Trump just announced Venezuela will be placed under US control. So, yes, it was an invasion.

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Trump invoking the Monroe Doctrine and renaming if after himself all but confirms his intent to pursue American Imperialism, which will OF COURSE need a singular leader or emperor to steer. We are in mid/late 1930s Germany's posture asserting it's need for lebensraum and chasing resources, while pursuing the demonization and "solution" for a significant ethnic group in the country.

Buckle the fuck up buckaroos, he told us in 2011 that a desperate president would start a war to make electoral prospects better.

This is 100000% a "Wag the Dog" situation

7 minutes ago, El Mas Chingon said:

He said it. Monroe Doctrine. Endless handwringing in this thread over the reason for why we were pursuing this. It was obvious. It’s spelled out in national security strategy documents. National security. It’s great that Maduro is gone. I look forward to following what’s to come.

Please, do tell: how was Venezuela threatening our national security?

2 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Please, do tell: how was Venezuela threatening our national security?

It's GRUhorn. Just report him and don't help hit his metrics so he'll get sent to the front in Ukraine

4 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

A shit show, that's what's coming. An expensive humanitarian shit show.

We'll get some oil and a lot of Chevron and Conoco workers are gonna get dead. And then we're gonna have boots on the ground.

@InkaUtexas will have more info but I think it’s more likely that the remaining security services heads are ready to do a negotiated regime change in exchange for some type of immunity. They just watched the last president get black bagged.

This isn’t Iraq or Syria, there’s no Iran to funnel in arms and exploit sectarian/clan divides. There’s no hardcore devoted to Maduroism as an animating and religious force among the peasantry. There’s just exhausted Venezuelans cowed by a brittle regime and if most of them believe they can just fade away quietly, they will do it.

Edited by 956 Worldwide

17 minutes ago, Laxtonto said:

Next is Cuba...

It will take 4-6 months, but Venezuela provided Cuba with most of its petrol, a vast majority of iron and iron ore, and was the vacation spot for the Cuban elite. Venezuela provides 70% of the Cuban crude and petrol, and it will take just a few months for the Cuban economy to completely shut down. From there it will be food riots, local stupidity and the fall of Canel...

Cuba has beautiful beaches. Make Trump Hotel Casinos Great Again in Cuba ! ! !

Considering I’ve taken shits longer than 30 minutes, I’m a little impressed here.

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

A shit show, that's what's coming. An expensive humanitarian shit show.

We'll get some oil and a lot of Chevron and Conoco workers are gonna get dead. And then we're gonna have boots on the ground.

Venezuela had been an "expensive humanitarian shit show" going on two decades. What are they going to do? Flood our borders with poor migrants and drugs? Give western hemisphere bases to Muslim shit heads like Hezbollah and Iran? Prop up an anti American staging base miles off Florida in Cuba?

And you think the motivation is oil? Hahahaha! Are you mentally stuck in the early nineties? The only oil we would use is their sour crude, and we get all we need from the Canadian tar sands, and our own largest production in the world fields. Their oil is useful and valuable to them, but it is far down the list of motivations for us.

7 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Please, do tell: how was Venezuela threatening our national security?

I mean .... narcoterrorism (made-up word) .... duh, ya stoopid ag!

1 minute ago, MagicSoccerSpray said:

And you think the motivation is oil? Hahahaha! Are you mentally stuck in the early nineties? The only oil we would use is their sour crude, and we get all we need from the Canadian tar sands, and our own largest production in the world fields. Their oil is useful and valuable to them, but it is far down the list of motivations for us.

Wait until you listen to the press conference.

It is clearly a top motivation.

Canada gonna wish they had that Keystone XL.

3 minutes ago, MagicSoccerSpray said:

Venezuela had been an "expensive humanitarian shit show" going on two decades. What are they going to do? Flood our borders with poor migrants and drugs? Give western hemisphere bases to Muslim shit heads like Hezbollah and Iran? Prop up an anti American staging base miles off Florida in Cuba?

And you think the motivation is oil? Hahahaha! Are you mentally stuck in the early nineties? The only oil we would use is their sour crude, and we get all we need from the Canadian tar sands, and our own largest production in the world fields. Their oil is useful and valuable to them, but it is far down the list of motivations for us.

I encourage people to read the NSS, the shift of language from energy independence to energy dominance is a key one. De facto control of Venezuelan reserves means is the difference between petroleum not being a tool that can be wielded against us and one we can begin to wield. This is all in line with that doc.

7 minutes ago, MagicSoccerSpray said:

And you think the motivation is oil? Hahahaha! Are you mentally stuck in the early nineties? The only oil we would use is their sour crude, and we get all we need from the Canadian tar sands, and our own largest production in the world fields. Their oil is useful and valuable to them, but it is far down the list of motivations for us.

Just amazing how arrogant some people are in their ignorance nowadays, apparently you haven’t been paying attention to this situation at all and then mock others who actually have been.

10 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

@InkaUtexas will have more info but I think it’s more likely that the remaining security services heads are ready to do a negotiated regime change in exchange for some type of immunity. They just watched the last president get black bagged.

This isn’t Iraq or Syria, there’s no Iran to funnel in arms and exploit sectarian/clan divides. There’s no hardcore devoted to Maduroism as an animating and religious force among the peasantry. There’s just exhausted Venezuelans cowed by a brittle regime and if most of them believe they can just fade away quietly, they will do it.

The shift will be subtle. And yes there is. It is called Chavez. Police is the key. Get food and medicine in asap. Watch Curacao.

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

A shit show, that's what's coming. An expensive humanitarian shit show.

We'll get some oil and a lot of Chevron and Conoco workers are gonna get dead. And then we're gonna have boots on the ground.

Funny enough, this will probably cause a reverse immigration from a humanitarian standpoint. One, right now 1/2 of Venezuela lives in "extreme poverty" based on the ENCOVI data and 80% in "general poverty". This is significantly worse than the 25% and 10% that was the historical baseline from the early 2000's. Not great, but significantly better than what it is now.

One of the significant aspects of the US oil expansion into South America was the amount of cash it flooded the region with. Lots of cash to be made in the pursuit of the black gold in the ground. Lots of outside investors had other reasons to spend in Venezula and a large segment of their population directly benefited from it. The issue of late is the "privatization" of Venezuelan oil production and how they both skimmed off all of the profits and destroyed daily production. They stopped drilling new wells and did limited preventive maintenance on what was there.Because of this, daily production in Venezuela is 1/3 of the production in 2000. Its less than 1/2 of what it was in 2013, when Maduro took over. They, in essence, killed the golden goose.

Don't get me wrong, Chevron, Exxon, and ConoccoPhillips, are about the eat, but there will be cash flooding the region and the pitiful standard of living they are currently living under will rise.

27 minutes ago, Laxtonto said:

Next is Cuba...

It will take 4-6 months, but Venezuela provided Cuba with most of its petrol, a vast majority of iron and iron ore, and was the vacation spot for the Cuban elite. Venezuela provides 70% of the Cuban crude and petrol, and it will take just a few months for the Cuban economy to completely shut down. From there it will be food riots, local stupidity and the fall of Canel...

Thats Good Donald Glover GIF

4 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Wait until you listen to the press conference.

It is clearly a top motivation.

Canada gonna wish they had that Keystone XL.

People that take what he says, instead of what he does, deserve all the anxiety that brings. He is a moron who judges everything by a forty year old paradigm. This isn't over, but it's a good start.

And the Canadians already regret that mistake. Here's hoping they can reverse it.

Edited by MagicSoccerSpray

How about we take care of the pitiful standard of living most people live with here first....

7 minutes ago, Debris said:

Considering I’ve taken shits longer than 30 minutes, I’m a little impressed here.

Hey those initial attacks in Afghanistan and Iraq were impressive too. If I could only remember how well they worked out in the long run.

Just now, Laxtonto said:

Funny enough, this will probably cause a reverse immigration from a humanitarian standpoint. One, right now 1/2 of Venezuela lives in "extreme poverty" based on the ENCOVI data and 80% in "general poverty". This is significantly worse than the 25% and 10% that was the historical baseline from the early 2000's. Not great, but significantly better than what it is now.

One of the significant aspects of the US oil expansion into South America was the amount of cash it flooded the region with. Lots of cash to be made in the pursuit of the black gold in the ground. Lots of outside investors had other reasons to spend in Venezula and a large segment of their population directly benefited from it. The issue of late is the "privatization" of Venezuelan oil production and how they both skimmed off all of the profits and destroyed daily production. They stopped drilling new wells and did limited preventive maintenance on what was there.Because of this, daily production in Venezuela is 1/3 of the production in 2000. Its less than 1/2 of what it was in 2013, when Maduro took over. They, in essence, killed the golden goose.

Don't get me wrong, Chevron, Exxon, and ConoccoPhillips, are about the eat, but there will be cash flooding the region and the pitiful standard of living they are currently living under will rise.

Oh, very likely true.

But I suspect there are enough foreign influences active in Venezuela to undermine US efforts there in a way that will tempt further intervention.

Just now, El Mas Chingon said:

Thank you.

It is all laid out pretty clearly. A lot of posters here could save themselves a lot of time wasted theorizing or spouting inaccuracies if they just read it. I think it’s great we have an administration that has a coherent geopolitical strategy and is enacting it.

I think in a lot of places the coherence falls apart and it makes a lot of assumptions on the mechanics especially in Europe and the Indo-Pacific. It’s clear that they think a lot about economics and this hemisphere.

5 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

I encourage people to read the NSS, the shift of language from energy independence to energy dominance is a key one. De facto control of Venezuelan reserves means is the difference between petroleum not being a tool that can be wielded against us and one we can begin to wield. This is all in line with that doc.

Yeah there's no other choice but American imperialism and reliance dependence on oil.

Edited by Chopper

14 minutes ago, MagicSoccerSpray said:

Venezuela had been an "expensive humanitarian shit show" going on two decades. What are they going to do? Flood our borders with poor migrants and drugs? Give western hemisphere bases to Muslim shit heads like Hezbollah and Iran? Prop up an anti American staging base miles off Florida in Cuba?

Yknow what, life was a shitshow in Iraq and Afghanistan, too.

We sure fixed them right the fuck up.

Nicaragua, El Salvador, and Honduras, too.

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3 minutes ago, El Mas Chingon said:

I mean they just decapitated a hostile socialist regime with minimal bloodshed. I’d say that was a hell of an operation.

TDS is an incredible thing to witness on days like this. This is a good thing that happened. No one can admit it.

So, just so we're clear on your logical consistencies:

Supplying weapons and funding to a sovereign nation who was invaded unprovoked by a country with a heavily vested interest in destabilizing the United States without putting any U.S. boots on the ground = bad

Using the entire weight of the United States military to force a regime change to a country that poses no direct threat to the U.S. under the guise of stopping "narcoterrorism" to greatly enrich our oil interests = good

Pathetic, dude.

3 minutes ago, MagicSoccerSpray said:

https://c.tenor.com/eB1XhgprvgkAAAAC/tenor.gif

People that take what he says, instead of what he does, deserve all the anxiety that brings. He is a moron who judges everything by a forty year old paradigm. This isn't over, but it's a good start.

And the Canadians already regret that mistake. Here's hoping they can reverse it.

What are we seeing that he is doing that makes us think it isn't about oil? He mentioned oil like 50 times in the PC and there's no reason to say "oil war" and do something else.

1 minute ago, MagicSoccerSpray said:

Venezuela had been an "expensive humanitarian shit show" going on two decades. What are they going to do? Flood our borders with poor migrants and drugs? Give western hemisphere bases to Muslim shit heads like Hezbollah and Iran? Prop up an anti American staging base miles off Florida in Cuba?

So how was Venezuela, a country in South America, flooding our borders? And if we give a shit about drugs, why are we pardoning other South American presidents that were CONVICTED of smuggling 400+ TONS of cocaine?

Good lord you've got too much fox news in your brain if you think Hezbollah is coming into Venezuela lmfao

I called it. This is about Maracaibo. Meanwhile the opposition is moving fast. Food and Medicine.

Fuck my Saturday.

6 minutes ago, Laxtonto said:

Funny enough, this will probably cause a reverse immigration from a humanitarian standpoint. One, right now 1/2 of Venezuela lives in "extreme poverty" based on the ENCOVI data and 80% in "general poverty". This is significantly worse than the 25% and 10% that was the historical baseline from the early 2000's. Not great, but significantly better than what it is now.

One of the significant aspects of the US oil expansion into South America was the amount of cash it flooded the region with. Lots of cash to be made in the pursuit of the black gold in the ground. Lots of outside investors had other reasons to spend in Venezula and a large segment of their population directly benefited from it. The issue of late is the "privatization" of Venezuelan oil production and how they both skimmed off all of the profits and destroyed daily production. They stopped drilling new wells and did limited preventive maintenance on what was there.Because of this, daily production in Venezuela is 1/3 of the production in 2000. Its less than 1/2 of what it was in 2013, when Maduro took over. They, in essence, killed the golden goose.

Don't get me wrong, Chevron, Exxon, and ConoccoPhillips, are about the eat, but there will be cash flooding the region and the pitiful standard of living they are currently living under will rise.

I guess it would be nice if all we had to do was bomb a country and imprison its leader in order to make the world a better place. wcgw

2 minutes ago, El Mas Chingon said:

Location, location, location.

Everyone should ask themselves this question. Do we think China is happy this morning? Absolutely not.

Think about that for a minute.

I know for sure that I live to piss off China.

Especially in a way that may embolden their territorial ambitions.

Just now, TwiceHorn said:

I know for sure that I live to piss off China.

Especially in a way that may embolden their territorial ambitions.

Yeah, China for sure won't use this as justification for action i.e. Taiwan

17 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

The shift will be subtle. And yes there is. It is called Chavez. Police is the key. Get food and medicine in asap. Watch Curacao.

I’m realizing that everything about this from the operation to the PC ro the “law enforcement” angle is a master class in hybrid warfare.

Lots of growth opportunities for people to write think pieces on US gray zone tactics

5 minutes ago, El Mas Chingon said:

Do we think China is happy this morning?

Certainly don't think that Taiwan is particularly overjoyed.

28 minutes ago, MagicSoccerSpray said:

Venezuela had been an "expensive humanitarian shit show" going on two decades. What are they going to do? Flood our borders with poor migrants and drugs? Give western hemisphere bases to Muslim shit heads like Hezbollah and Iran? Prop up an anti American staging base miles off Florida in Cuba?

And you think the motivation is oil? Hahahaha! Are you mentally stuck in the early nineties? The only oil we would use is their sour crude, and we get all we need from the Canadian tar sands, and our own largest production in the world fields. Their oil is useful and valuable to them, but it is far down the list of motivations for us.

"We're gonna be running it (Venezuela) as a group. We're gonna run it properly. We're gonna invest billions in the oil infrastructure."

"We're not afraid of boots on the ground, we don't mind saying it. We're not afraid of running it properly."

Lmao

Trump is motivated by democratic principles!

tell me GIF

50 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

Wait—so now we’re going to “run” Venezuela? Like occupy it?

…or is that to say that we have no fucking plan.

images.jpg

Edited by elfenix

I heard rumors there was a trans basketball player on a middle school girl's team. So this is all worth it. Sorry.

6 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yknow what, life was a shitshow in Iraq and Afghanistan, too.

We sure fixed them right the fuck up.

Nicaragua, El Salvador, and Honduras, too.

You're right, the US should give up defending its interests, and enacting it's foreign policy objectives for the foreseeable future, because it did so poorly in the past. Isolationism has always been an effective and viable policy going back centuries. MTG whole-heartedly agrees.

5 minutes ago, SimonBolivar said:

What are we seeing that he is doing that makes us think it isn't about oil? He mentioned oil like 50 times in the PC and there's no reason to say "oil war" and do something else.

He's a moron. If there was a deep state plan to control Venezuelan oil, he'd be the last to understand it. And even if there was, it'll take 10-20 years just to get Venezuela back to pumping what it was when Chavez first started looting it, if that's even possible.

4 minutes ago, Captainant said:

So how was Venezuela, a country in South America, flooding our borders? And if we give a shit about drugs, why are we pardoning other South American presidents that were CONVICTED of smuggling 400+ TONS of cocaine?

Good lord you've got too much fox news in your brain if you think Hezbollah is coming into Venezuela lmfao

Poor Venezuelans have been trying to immigrate because the socialists have turned their country into a basket case, they've been doing it heavily for the last 5-10 years. And Trump pardoned that president because he's a moron who cares about himself first, second, and third. The country comes after.

I don't watch Fox BTW, and if you don't know that Iran and Hezbollah have had a presence in South America generally, and Venezuela specifically, going on thirty/forty years, I suggest you do a little googling.

14 minutes ago, Orange-4-Life said:

Cuba has beautiful beaches. Make Trump Hotel Casinos Great Again in Cuba ! ! !

There has been a long-standing, steady echo of the need to make the resort owners whole in South Florida. Bigger yet are the sugar plantations and nickel mines that were nationalized. This would be billions of dollars and would radically change Cuba.

Think about how different the Caribbean would be if Cuba were the playground of the US. Make it a rival to Las Vegas with year-round beaches and beautiful Cuban beauties. Make Havana the destination for those looking for a beach vacation instead of Cozumel, the Caymans, or Jamaica. This would hurt Mexico significantly from a tourism standpoint and provide a huge boost to the Gulf economy. It would most likely lead to more stability in the Caribbean and freeze out many of the ideological movements in the region. Lots of the revolutionary mindset and corruption in the Caribbean are byproducts of Cuba's safe haven.

8 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

I’m realizing that everything about this from the operation to the PC ro the “law enforcement” angle is a master class in hybrid warfare.

Lots of growth opportunities for people to write think pieces on US gray zone tactics

Master class? What are you even talking about?

3 minutes ago, Laxtonto said:

There has been a long-standing, steady echo of the need to make the resort owners whole in South Florida. Bigger yet are the sugar plantations and nickel mines that were nationalized. This would be billions of dollars and would radically change Cuba.

Think about how different the Caribbean would be if Cuba were the playground of the US. Make it a rival to Las Vegas with year-round beaches and beautiful Cuban beauties. Make Havana the destination for those looking for a beach vacation instead of Cozumel, the Caymans, or Jamaica. This would hurt Mexico significantly from a tourism standpoint and provide a huge boost to the Gulf economy. It would most likely lead to more stability in the Caribbean and freeze out many of the ideological movements in the region. Lots of the revolutionary mindset and corruption in the Caribbean are byproducts of Cuba's safe haven.

TEAM AMERICA - Alex Hajdu

56 minutes ago, El Mas Chingon said:

He said it. Monroe Doctrine. Endless handwringing in this thread over the reason for why we were pursuing this. It was obvious. It’s spelled out in national security strategy documents. National security. It’s great that Maduro is gone. I look forward to following what’s to come.

Goddammit @immamac

2 minutes ago, El Mas Chingon said:

Venezuelans happy. People here should be too. Get over yourselves for a day.

Demogorgons could rip President Trump’s limbs apart on national TV and you would assuredly be able to get countless interviews with people happy that he’s gone.

One’s opinions on regime change does not necessarily mean there’s a blind support to get there by any means necessary.

Maduro fucking sucks, but there are obvious ramifications to this shit to anyone who dares live in the real world.

4 minutes ago, Chopper said:

Master class? What are you even talking about?

Think of this in comparison to Crimea or what China might do to Taiwan. Blockade, lots of strikes on drug boats just to get people used to our presence and slowly shift the norms. A series of conflicting but also self-reinforcing demands and explanations. Cultivating ties with opposition figured to boost credibility.

A large military force comes in, grabs the President, and takes him to NYC. We announce its a “law enforcement” operation.

Then we say we will “run the country” but don’t explain how or what except that we will get the oil fields running. We leave it open to interpretation what that means and maybe we haven’t even decided, leaving ambiguity.

Did we go to war? Did we do a regime change? Did we just arrest a criminal? All of those? Something else?

Very Russian vibes. Hybrid/gray zone. We just didn’t use little green men, we used “FBI and DEA agents” that are clearly not FBI or DEA. And an amphibious assault ship that also doesn’t belong to the DEA.

1 minute ago, El Mas Chingon said:

Venezuelans happy. People here should be too. Get over yourselves for a day.

Perfect post, especially coming from CBS News. No notes. LMAO.

Fits with my theory that most people who left their home countries due to authoritarian regimes think the answer to a bad dictator is a good dictator. They have trouble thinking one second past getting the bad guys out of power. The (understandable) desperation clouds their judgment.

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