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Olympics, better late than never


Michael Knight

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Watching the swimmers underwater techniques off the start and turns reminds me(flashback music)... I was on deck at Eddie Reese's 1st practice at the Texas Swim Center and he got in the pool and talked about how that shimmy was the future of swimming. 

Soon the rules were changed to limit the distance spent underwater because it is so efficient.

Thank you for your time.

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Simone Biles is not the GOAT. You don't get to be the GOAT when you let your teammates and country down. If I had a daughter who watched this I would use it as a talking point about mental toughness and perseverance in the face of adversity.

As I got older I never seriously considered it when people said this generation is soft or wont be prepared for the real world because I never saw things like this happen. There is an entire generation now seeing first hand that it is OK to quit when things get tough. And it isn't just this example. Others have happened recently too and this attitude is spreading. Everyone feels at one time or another that the weight of the world is on their shoulders especially in sports growing up. You use that experience to become a stronger person. Playing sports has helped me immensely throughout life because there is always adversity and it isn't always going to be easy.

Most importantly I was taught you never leave your wingman, you never let your teammates down. Ever.

And now not only is it OK to do that, it is celebrated. 

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9 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:

If a pitcher who normally throws 99 goes out there in Game 1 of the World Series and suddenly his fastball is 87, what should he do?  Power through it and let the other team tee off in the name of "toughness"?

Perfect analogy. She doesn’t have it. She knows it. She’s letting the alternate take her place. This isn’t complicated 

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Posted (edited)

People attacking her personally are ridiculous, but it’s a big deal because the  face of the games just quit. Not hurt, just quit. 
 

We can say it’s fear of getting injured, or we can say it’s fear of getting embarrassed by competing and losing. If she competes and gets beat in each competition, her money/legacy take a hit. This way she can try to preserve both of those while receiving cover from the media. Brave, heroic. Bullshit. 
 

Athletics at the highest level are often separated by the mental toughness. Physical is one part, mental the other and she crumbled mentally on the biggest stage. 

Edited by ChickenSandwich
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12 hours ago, ztejas said:

That's a little bit harier than what Biles faces in competition.

Yeah it really isn't though. She would risk being dead or a paraplegic just as much as those two.

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2 minutes ago, G650 said:

Yeah it really isn't though. She would risk being dead or a paraplegic just as much as those two.

I've never heard of an elite gymnast dying or becoming a paraplegic as a result of an accident in competition.  I'm sure it has happened but I seriously doubt it has happened as regularly as in auto racing before the safety era.  As for Honnold, he is dead if he falls.  Gymnasts fall every day and the vast majority aren't injured at all much less dead.

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2 minutes ago, alincoln said:

I've never heard of an elite gymnast dying or becoming a paraplegic as a result of an accident in competition.  I'm sure it has happened but I seriously doubt it has happened as regularly as in auto racing before the safety era.  As for Honnold, he is dead if he falls.  Gymnasts fall every day and the vast majority aren't injured at all much less dead.

The vast majority are injured. How do you think Larry Nassar had such a prominent role within the organization? They were/are expected to power through it. 

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22 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

Perfect analogy. She doesn’t have it. She knows it. She’s letting the alternate take her place. This isn’t complicated 

I have no issue with her making that decision, it's certainly her right. She's not the only athlete to face this type of pressure, and she chose the path that she chose. But let's fucking stop with the hero worship, which I realize is mostly being driven by the media, and she can't control.

Women's gymnastics at that level is a fucked up, exploitative sport, which I prefer to ignore. Now I have to listen to about 300% more bullshit than usual about it. Why isn't anybody concerned about my needs and concerns? I'm putting you on notice, NBC....

 

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7 minutes ago, alincoln said:

I've never heard of an elite gymnast dying or becoming a paraplegic as a result of an accident in competition.  I'm sure it has happened but I seriously doubt it has happened as regularly as in auto racing before the safety era.  As for Honnold, he is dead if he falls.  Gymnasts fall every day and the vast majority aren't injured at all much less dead.

Happens every few years. I believe one of the US girls died from it back in the 90's.

 

But the comparison isn't over the top is the point. Anyone who believes otherwise is welcome to go stand on a  roof and imagine diving head first into the ground. Because that's essentially what we are talking about.

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The people shitting on Biles can fuck right off. I am ok with some criticism, and maybe she could have handled it bette (but frankly her teammates support her and she doesn’t owe us shit, so she can handle it how she wants).  
 

But those saying she simply quit or are disparaging her character can get bent.  It was discussed upthread in a stupid Formula 1 comparison but she has the yips.  Which is a real thing in gymnastics.  I competed many …. Many …. years ago and went through it on floor exercise.  And it’s not like you are going to hit the cart girl or throw the ball over the pitchers head on a routine throwback.  You could get severely injured. The team probably does worse than Silver if she tries to go out there.  

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23 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

The Biles headlines are putting quotes about medical issues. If the issue is non-physical but she comes back for the individual events, the media will struggle on to report on it. If Durant decided to go home or hand out towels because the Olympics are causing him some mental strain, would we congratulate him on taking care of his health? 

And I'm in agreement that mental strain/illness/anxiety is a real condition. It's just unfortunate when that occurs in the middle of a competition when your teammates are stuck.

Tough subject.

Aaron Rodgers has decided the pressure is too much and he's not coming out in the second half, good for him he's a hero for prioritizing mental health!

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5 minutes ago, G650 said:

Happens every few years. I believe one of the US girls died from it back in the 90's.

 

But the comparison isn't over the top is the point. Anyone who believes otherwise is welcome to go stand on a  roof and imagine diving head first into the ground. Because that's essentially what we are talking about.

OK let's now do free soloing deaths in the 2000's

Quote


Dwight Bishop fell (19 July 2004; age 49) while climbing alone and unroped along the Grand Traverse route on Grand Teton peak in Wyoming.

Jimmy Ray Forester fell (24 November 2006; age 43) while free-soloing in El Potrero Chico, Mexico. Forester, an experienced, talented climber, failed to return to camp after setting out on The Scariest Ride in the Park, a 40-pitch 5.9 ridge route known for loose rock. He was found the next day at the base of the wall.

George Gardner fell to his death (25 July 2008; age 58) while free soloing in Grand Teton National Park.

John Bachar died (5 July 2009; age 52) in a free solo accident at Dike Wall near Mammoth Lakes, California.

Akihira Tawara died (13 September 2011; age 27) while free solo climbing the Directissima 5.8 route on Yamnuska.

Michael J. Ybarra died (July 2012;[24] age 45) climbing solo on The Matterhorn Peak in California's Sierra Nevada Mountains.

Brad Parker fell (16 August 2014; age 36) about 300 feet to his death while attempting to climb Matthes Crest Traverse in Yosemite, California.

Andrew Barnes died (12 June 2015; age 46) falling 50 ft (15 m) free solo climbing in New York's Shawangunk Mountains.

Angus Moloney died (27 September 2015; age 22) falling 100 ft (30 m) free-solo climbing from the Fifth Pinnacle above the Gregory Canyon Trail, Boulder Open Spaces and Mountain Parks.

Austin Howell died (30 June 2019; age 31) after a fall while free soloing at Shortoff Mountain in North Carolina.

I'm also guessing there are orders of magnitude more participants in gymnastics every year. Sure, gymnasts can get injured as they throw themselves around. But let's not compare the risks of gymnastics to free soloing for fucks sake. 

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, A-Tex Devil said:

The people shitting on Biles can fuck right off. I am ok with some criticism, and maybe she could have handled it bette (but frankly her teammates support her and she doesn’t owe us shit, so she can handle it how she wants).  
 

But those saying she simply quit or are disparaging her character can get bent.  It was discussed upthread in a stupid Formula 1 comparison but she has the yips.  Which is a real thing in gymnastics.  I competed many …. Many …. years ago and went through it on floor exercise.  And it’s not like you are going to hit the cart girl or throw the ball over the pitchers head on a routine throwback.  You could get severely injured. The team probably does worse than Silver if she tries to go out there.  

The yips are embarrassing. She owes no one anything. I feel sorry for her, but she choked on the biggest stage. Like great athletes across all sports. She is not unique. 
 

But she did quit. 

Edited by ChickenSandwich
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56 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:

1.  I. still don't understand the big deal.  

2.  If a pitcher who normally throws 99 goes out there in Game 1 of the World Series and suddenly his fastball is 87, what should he do?  Power through it and let the other team tee off in the name of "toughness"?

Withdrawing at that point was the best move to help her team win. 

3.  Side note: why do some of y'all care so much?  Most of the people berating Simone are the same people actively rooting against our soccer and basketball teams, so it's obviously not a country pride thing.

4. The need for every single issue to become political warfare is fucking insanity

1.  It’s because how many people have done this before in the past?  They are all scared, nervous,  a little off sometimes but they do what professional athletes that train non stop always do, go out and given their best. 
2.  Her 87 mph pitch is going to better then the rest of the team at some events, if she pulls from all of them that will really be disappointing.  Also from before with the nascar comparison, she’s been doing this since she could walk I doubt she was so off she was going to badly hurt herself.  
3.  Not me and I’m not berating, I just think she just didn’t have her top top stuff so she chose to not participate instead of taking a L.  Which is not a good example to set. 
4.  This 100%!!   People openly cheering for us to lose in women’s soccer on Facebook because some of them kneeled is just pathetic and sad but everything form a virus’s to the price of beans that day is now and it just seems crazy to me.  

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2.  Her 87 mph pitch is going to better then the rest of the team at some events, if she pulls from all of them that will really be disappointing.  Also from before with the nascar comparison, she’s been doing this since she could walk I doubt she was so off she was going to badly hurt herself.  
See, this is where I think people are only paying attention to the headlines.  Her vault was bad.   
I know this is hard to believe, but she was actively hurting her team. 



Nobody would think Justin Verlander was honorable if he gives up 7 runs in the first, obviously is having technical issues, and refuses to let his coach go to the bullpen because he's "tough."
It just seems like people feel like they need to form a hot take, and end up twisting themselves into saying that "continuing to bring your team down in the name of toughness is less selfish than giving someone else a chance to compete."
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Basketball power Latvia just won the men's 3x3 gold.  They had some guy blowout the sole of his shoe halfway through but he taped it back on and finished the game.

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1 hour ago, Chuckie Finster said:

I still don't understand the big deal.  

This isn't like she took someone's spot then refused to get off the plane.  She went out there, competed, realized something was off and then did the thing that most helped her team at that point.  Sure, it would have been better for her to peer into her crystal ball before she left for the Olympics and see that this was going to happen, but unfortunately she isn't magic.  If a pitcher who normally throws 99 goes out there in Game 1 of the World Series and suddenly his fastball is 87, what should he do?  Power through it and let the other team tee off in the name of "toughness"?

Withdrawing at that point was the best move to help her team win.  Her withdrawing this morning gives another American a shot at a medal in the individual event.  All of the criticism seems like it's from people who only have read the headline and don't understand what is actually happening.

Side note: why do some of y'all care so much?  Most of the people berating Simone are the same people actively rooting against our soccer and basketball teams, so it's obviously not a country pride thing.

The need for every single issue to become political warfare is fucking insanity

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18 minutes ago, Hook1997 said:

2.  Her 87 mph pitch is going to better then the rest of the team at some events, if she pulls from all of them that will really be disappointing.  Also from before with the nascar comparison, she’s been doing this since she could walk I doubt she was so off she was going to badly hurt herself.  
3.  Not me and I’m not berating, I just think she just didn’t have her top top stuff so she chose to not participate instead of taking a L.  Which is not a good example to set. 
 

Sorry, but why is it so hard to believe that she could be seriously injured? What is the frame of reference that some on here are speaking from? Contrast that with people who have competed in gymnastics and diving which induces the same level of disorientation saying the risk is very real. How does your take trump their opinions? Not to mention that she has added routines that are considered dangerous enough even when she was at the top of her game that there was a very real controversy about the scoring with the implication being that gymnasts were strongly discouraged from attempting them.

 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
38 minutes ago, A-Tex Devil said:

But those saying she simply quit or are disparaging her character can get bent.  It was discussed upthread in a stupid Formula 1 comparison but she has the yips.  Which is a real thing in gymnastics.  I competed many …. Many …. years ago and went through it on floor exercise.  And it’s not like you are going to hit the cart girl or throw the ball over the pitchers head on a routine throwback.  You could get severely injured. The team probably does worse than Silver if she tries to go out there.  

They were mentioning this on the broadcast last night and I'm glad you brought it up.

Most of us don't think of gymnastics much except every four years but it appears to be a real thing in that sport just like golf, baseball, etc. 

1 hour ago, ChickenSandwich said:

The hero worship for quitting is a little over the top. 

I agree with this. Also agreed with it in regards to Osaka. 

I mean, it's not like Biles had never won anything and just pulled a massive choke job her first time in the spotlight. She's the defending olympic champion in four events and has won 19 gold medals in world championships over the last eight years. This isn't her first rodeo. If she says something's wrong and she can't compete then she deserves the benefit of the doubt. 

Edit to add this article: https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/olympics/2021/07/28/twisties-gymnastics-simone-biles-tokyo-olympics/

The "twisties" are what they call the "yips" in gymnastics. A good read for anyone who thinks she just "quit". 

Edited by The Dog
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