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2020 Presidential Election -- Biden v Trump: Sleepy Joe vs Dopey Don [Results begin on page 409]


Patrick Bateman

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18 hours ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

Police and the district attorney’s office are investigating after Ku Klux Klan flyers were distributed in parts of Greene County.

William DeForte, the Greene County Regional Police Department captain, said the flyers started showing up in the county about two weeks ago, with the most recent distribution on Tuesday.

“Every officer here was offended and extremely motivated to find the individual passing out this information,” DeForte told KDKA.

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The political effect of the recent Covid 19 diagnosis is good for Biden as long as he doesn’t test positive. Biden social distanced from a Trump the whole time so I think he’s going to be safe, but I guess we’ll see. 
 

Trumps whole premise with his campaign was to try and project some semblance of normalcy. He acts like a tough guy for “ helping” bring football back when they pretty much did it all on their own. He’s tried so hard to pin any inconveniences on the democrats and he’s largely failed at it. He wanted the voters to get used to high case numbers and high deaths. He wanted them to accept it as some kind of “ new normal”.

now......Trump has the virus and Covid 19 will be in the news constantly. It’s going to shed light on the fact that the president hasn’t taken this pandemic seriously. Literally the whole time he has downplayed it and said it would randomly go away many times. He said we would open by Easter. This guy was in over his head the whole time. The vast majority of America knew if this reality TV president actually had to manage a crisis that there would be trouble. Well here we are. 
 

we need Trump to survive. We need Biden to be negative. Trump’s odds are going to continue to deteriorate as the election gets closer. There is no upside for this guy because of how he’s managed the coronavirus so far.

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This is a fascinating scenario that has never happened in American history.  What if a nominee dies?  If the nominee dies after being nominating but before being on the various state ballots then the party can nominate someone else.  That can be anyone they want and it does not have to be someone who has won delegates.  That part is simple.

This is very murky now.  We're not "before the election."  We're in the middle of the election with early voting.  The ballots haven't just been printed, they've been filed.  The nominees are who they are.  Now, if a candidate dies but later wins, the party in question can nominate anyone as a stand in.  (Does not have to be the VP candidate.)  The various state electors can then vote on whoever that is.  They likely would since electors are party loyalists.  For example, Trump dies and the Republicans put forward Marco Rubio.  Those states that Trump won would throw their electors to Rubio but they're under no obligation to do so.

The myth is that the VP candidate becomes the automatic fall back and that's not the case.  

If Trump were to lose and then die before 1/20, then Pence is obviously the stand in president.  

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In short: Everything Trump tried to avoid in the stretch run of the 2020 race is now coming to pass. And it's all because of him (and his positive test).

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He tried to hide it because it's the last thing he wants to talk about. So what if the Proud Boys are not high up the list of talking points? That's what he wants to talk about. Law and Order. He wants to come to Houston and anywhere else that will let him have a rally because he's got to get an ego fix. He can't now. At least for a while. This is horrific for his campaign. 200k plus dead is now the focus again. 

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1 hour ago, Aqua Buddha said:

This is a fascinating scenario that has never happened in American history.  What if a nominee dies?  If the nominee dies after being nominating but before being on the various state ballots then the party can nominate someone else.  That can be anyone they want and it does not have to be someone who has won delegates.  That part is simple.

This is very murky now.  We're not "before the election."  We're in the middle of the election with early voting.  The ballots haven't just been printed, they've been filed.  The nominees are who they are.  Now, if a candidate dies but later wins, the party in question can nominate anyone as a stand in.  (Does not have to be the VP candidate.)  The various state electors can then vote on whoever that is.  They likely would since electors are party loyalists.  For example, Trump dies and the Republicans put forward Marco Rubio.  Those states that Trump won would throw their electors to Rubio but they're under no obligation to do so.

The myth is that the VP candidate becomes the automatic fall back and that's not the case.  

If Trump were to lose and then die before 1/20, then Pence is obviously the stand in president.  

The GOP cannot put anyone else forward for the ballot. I assume that ship has sailed. And if Trump does eventually die from COVID, that would even be closer to the election which would make it more impossible to switch.

With the case of Trump dying and wins, some of the electors have the ability to vote for others. Some are required to follow the election results by law. varies state to state. Anyway, if enough faithless electors acted by not voting for Trump, then no one gets 270.  Say they switched to Pence. Then Trump, Biden and Pence would be the top 3 in electoral votes, the House decides between the top 3.

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2 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

The GOP cannot put anyone else forward for the ballot. I assume that ship has sailed. And if Trump does eventually die from COVID, that would even be closer to the election which would make it more impossible to switch.

With the case of Trump dying and wins, some of the electors have the ability to vote for others. Some are required to follow the election results by law. varies state to state. Anyway, if enough faithless electors acted by not voting for Trump, then no one gets 270.  Say they switched to Pence. Then Trump, Biden and Pence would be the top 3 in electoral votes, the House decides between the top 3.

Yes, some states ban faithless electors but I'm not sure how they enforce that.

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2 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

The GOP cannot put anyone else forward for the ballot. I assume that ship has sailed. And if Trump does eventually die from COVID, that would even be closer to the election which would make it more impossible to switch.

With the case of Trump dying and wins, some of the electors have the ability to vote for others. Some are required to follow the election results by law. varies state to state. Anyway, if enough faithless electors acted by not voting for Trump, then no one gets 270.  Say they switched to Pence. Then Trump, Biden and Pence would be the top 3 in electoral votes, the House decides between the top 3.

I would think that it's a vote for Trump, then if he wins Pence becomes president via the rules of succession. So it's a de facto vote for Pence rather than Trump in that scenario. 

But there are others on this board who know a lot more than I do about this...

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1 minute ago, The Dog said:

I would think that it's a vote for Trump, then if he wins Pence becomes president via the rules of succession. So it's a de facto vote for Pence rather than Trump in that scenario. 

But there are others on this board who know a lot more than I do about this...

Without a doubt, Pence becomes president if Trump dies. There are a few arguments that there are conflicting laws but I don't think anyone serious would not agree Pence becomes President. But Trump winning the electoral college and dying in whatever order, doesn't pass the baton to Pence remaining President.  He didn't win the electoral college in that situation.

I actually would think the logical change is that the Speaker takes over as POTUS on Jan 21. Then whether the constitution agrees, I think we should run another POTUS election in Nov '21 to complete the term.

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1 minute ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Without a doubt, Pence becomes president if Trump dies. There are a few arguments that there are conflicting laws but I don't think anyone serious would not agree Pence becomes President. But Trump winning the electoral college and dying in whatever order, doesn't pass the baton to Pence remaining President.  He didn't win the electoral college in that situation.

I actually would think the logical change is that the Speaker takes over as POTUS on Jan 21. Then whether the constitution agrees, I think we should run another POTUS election in Nov '21 to complete the term.

The thing is, you are voting for electors for Trump and Pence or Biden and Harris - they are on the ballot as a pair. 

So my line of thinking is that Pence would remain president as he would just "move up" since the office is vacant and the winner wouldn't be available to take office. 

This is all likely moot as Biden is probably going to win anyway, but it's an interesting discussion and we probably need to have a solution for it since we are facing it today.

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2 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Without a doubt, Pence becomes president if Trump dies. There are a few arguments that there are conflicting laws but I don't think anyone serious would not agree Pence becomes President. But Trump winning the electoral college and dying in whatever order, doesn't pass the baton to Pence remaining President.  He didn't win the electoral college in that situation.

I actually would think the logical change is that the Speaker takes over as POTUS on Jan 21. Then whether the constitution agrees, I think we should run another POTUS election in Nov '21 to complete the term.

The electors would still meet on Dec 14th and whoever they decide on is president on 1/20.  If they can't get to 270, it goes to the House and what not.

If Trump were to die this weekend, the RNC would then unofficially nominate Rubio or someone and then the electors in states that Trump won could vote for Rubio and he would be president on 1/20 and in the meantime, Pence would move into the slot.

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1 minute ago, Hawndoh said:

Once Biden is cleared, they should immediately run ads with debate footage... Trump: I don't wear a mask! Cut to "the president has Covid" cut to debate Trump: "he always wears a mask" cut to "Biden does not have Covid"

Please somebody do this.  I'm sure Lincoln Project is already on it, but please do this.  I'm sure it'll jinx Biden at some other point down the road......but seriously...he just got done shouting about Biden's mask and acting like he was foolish for wearing it.  

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