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Posted
7 minutes ago, Mikey4 said:

I don't doubt that some of it is justified, but a lot of times people just neg when they see a view that's different from their own. It's also the style of discourse -- for example, attacking people with personal slurs rather than debating their positions. It's not appealing to me.

It's always funny to read posts like this then go and see the types of posts that actually get dogpiled in CR.

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Posted
Just now, Dahobbs said:

Yeah, also this. The rest of it is an interesting legal discussion. This is the primary point. 

Abbot's motivation was wrong.  He knows it.  He was going for cheap political points with his base.

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Posted
1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

Jesus Christ, have you never seen dozens and dozens of people laying out on the South Mall?  THEY'RE TAKING UP MORE THAN THEIR ALLOTED SPACE.

Come on, be a bigger pussy, I dare you.

Never dare a man to do something he's looking for justification to do.

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Posted
1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

Jesus Christ, have you never seen dozens and dozens of people laying out on the South Mall?  THEY'RE TAKING UP MORE THAN THEIR ALLOTED SPACE.

Come on, be a bigger pussy, I dare you.

Tents take up more space than a person.  You could literally buy and set out as many as it take to occupy the entire space.  They are not needed to protest.  They also look like shit.  It is an entirely reasonable rule.  And I am pretty damn sure a court will agree.

Posted
3 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Yeah, also this. The rest of it is an interesting legal discussion. This is the primary point. 

This is my main beef with Hartzell - that the governor of the State publicly supported the arrests of ALL of the protestors based on the content of their message. And Hartzell just fucking sat there. THAT is the moment when a University President is supposed to lead.

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Posted
Just now, Frank Drebin said:

Tents take up more space than a person.  You could literally buy and set out as many as it take to occupy the entire space.  They are not needed to protest.  They also look like shit.  It is an entirely reasonable rule.  And I am pretty damn sure a court will agree.

Am I surprised you missed the point?  According to you, anyone taking up more than approximately 1 sq foot of space (i.e., a standing man) IS OCCUPYING SOMEONE ELSE'S SPACE!  OH NO!

People laying down on the mall should be prosecuted, full stop.  Unless they're wearing a sun dress.  And female.

Posted
2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Am I surprised you missed the point?  According to you, anyone taking up more than approximately 1 sq foot of space (i.e., a standing man) IS OCCUPYING SOMEONE ELSE'S SPACE!  OH NO!

People laying down on the mall should be prosecuted, full stop.  Unless they're wearing a sun dress.  And female.

I never said that so stop lying.  Or don't and keep beating up that strawman.

Posted
5 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

You're confused about what "less restrictive measures" refers to. In constitutional analysis, it refers to government action, not the actions of the public, i.e., the government could choose an action less restrictive than outlawing the use of tents entirely. Here, that would be time limits and registration/reservation. Further, the solution to a problem caused by government restriction of free speech in a public forum cannot be "go someplace else". Literally, the place people are suppose to be able to go is the public forum. That said, I agree that a no tent policy isn't extremely restrictive and that so long as other government restrictions aren't in play, free speech is only marginally affected by the restriction. As I said, maybe no tents is a reasonable restriction. But because less restrictive options are available to the government, I'm not entirely sure that conclusion is obvious. 

My point is that the *government* allows a range of alternatives that address the concerns you raise (e.g., protection from the elements) while also ensuring that  the public space will be available to others. I'm not saying they need to go somewhere else. Protest right there. You don't need a tent to do that.

Posted
5 minutes ago, Mikey4 said:

I'll check it, thank you. I've been posting on the football board for 6+ years, and shaggy before that, and hornfans before that. I've had no problems with negs or hostility on there.

 

4 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

It's always funny to read posts like this then go and see the types of posts that actually get dogpiled in CR.

I'm not saying negs or fatwas don't happen in the CR, but it's not nearly as commonplace as perceived. It's mostly restricted to posters persistently spouting disproven lies, stating malignant opinions as facts without evidence, or saying racist/homophobic kind of shit, just like anywhere else on this board. The difference is that, by its political nature, the CR attracts people who like to stir the pot with that stuff.

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Posted
6 minutes ago, Leeroy Jenkins said:

He makes a good point.  There are still students on campus who wear masks to class.  That isn't nonsense.  

There are still students who wear masks going into the 7-11 also.

Posted
1 minute ago, Smax said:

Great pic 

 

2ovb8lhulnxc1.jpg

 

stolen from reddit 😛

ARREST THAT STUDENT HE IS TAKING UP MORE GROUND SQUARE FOOTAGE THAN HE NEEDS TO AND IS BLOCKING OTHERS FROM USING THE SPACE!!!! 

 

/s

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Posted

So much tent talk. Sheesh. Personally, I think camping tents indicate that protesters are setting up camp and plan to sleep/live there for the duration. It's not about getting out of the sun, etc. It's to antagonize. Let them set up canopies if they must but break them down or vacate them at a certain time each day. There is middle ground on this deal -- and I say that with full realization that Abbott/Hartzell and his goons may not give two-shits about finding middle ground and are reverting to fascist tendencies.

But the minute "infintada" or "pro-Hamas" shit comes up on the West Mall, this thing needs to be shut down with extreme prejudice (no head-cracking, just clearing them out peacefully) as it's no longer simply support for the innocent Palestines in Gaza. (I also say this with full-on hatred of Netanyahu and what the opportunism 10/7 has given him to -- in his mind -- eradicate as many Palestinians as he can reasonably get rid of before he's told to stand down or else.)

This is a gigantic shit sandwich and is threatening to take our collective eyes of the real (and scary) issues that our country is facing if we allow it.

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Posted
51 minutes ago, Hank Scorpio said:

I have no sympathy for Hartzell and wouldn’t mind him getting run out of town, but god damn can you imagine the psycho Abbott and the regents would appoint to replace him. Meet your new university president, the Navy Seal who murdered those Iraqi civilians and Trump pardoned. 

Nah, would be some ex drone operator addicted to Mt. Dew and Skoal. Got out of the military and went to work for General Atomics as their liaison to the IAF.

Posted
8 minutes ago, Bevo said:

There are still students who wear masks going into the 7-11 also.

Yes? 7-11 is free to restrict that if it wishes. It isn't bound by Constitutional restrictions. 

Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, Captainant said:

ARREST THAT STUDENT HE IS TAKING UP MORE GROUND SQUARE FOOTAGE THAN HE NEEDS TO AND IS BLOCKING OTHERS FROM USING THE SPACE!!!! 

 

/s

I mean what is a beach towel other than a really flat tent?

Keanu Reeves Matrix GIF by Coolidge Corner Theatre

 

13 minutes ago, C-Man said:

So much tent talk. Sheesh.

Was about to make a joke about this, but you beat me to tent talk...

REI stock to the moon right now tho

Edited by Evil Bill Obrien
Posted (edited)
30 minutes ago, C-Man said:

But the minute "infintada" or "pro-Hamas" shit comes up on the West Mall, this thing needs to be shut down with extreme prejudice (no head-cracking, just clearing them out peacefully) as it's no longer simply support for the innocent Palestines in Gaza.

To be honest, the law that abbott signed in 2019 was done so for this exact case. A no-shit white supremacist was going to speak at ATM and the student body revolted and it eventually escalated into clashes between the pro and anti fascists in attendance that the cops had to break up. In response, ATM created a policy that only university-sanctioned visitors could speak on campus from then on. 

SB18 was passed in direct response to this event.

Edit: I've linked it already but I'm sourcing from this Georgetown FSP article

Edited by Captainant
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Posted
36 minutes ago, Leeroy Jenkins said:

He makes a good point.  There are still students on campus who wear masks to class.  That isn't nonsense.  

A college-aged kid wearing a mask outdoors due to covid fears in 2024 is really a thing? 

Or do you think there might be another reason they are wearing a mask at these outdoor protests?

 

Posted
22 minutes ago, C-Man said:

 

But the minute "infintada" or "pro-Hamas" shit comes up on the West Mall, this thing needs to be shut down with extreme prejudice (no head-cracking, just clearing them out peacefully) as it's no longer simply support for the innocent Palestines in Gaza. (I also say this with full-on hatred of Netanyahu and what the opportunism 10/7 has given him to -- in his mind -- eradicate as many Palestinians as he can reasonably get rid of before he's told to stand down or else.)

This is a gigantic shit sandwich and is threatening to take our collective eyes of the real (and scary) issues that our country is facing if we allow it.

I came across a livestream a couple of hours ago and it looked like a "pre-protest" or overall discussion was going on of some sort.   Apparently led by 2 UT profs.  All incredibly peaceful and non-disruptive (no tents!) so no issue there.  A few items stood out in the 20 mins or so I was listening (until it wrapped).   There were some jewish students listening in as well that raised their hand to engage and they were ignored.  Someone in the crowd asked if she considered Hamas a terrorist organization and she said something like I'm not answering that and moved on.  Then, the kicker, for some reason she noted that IDF forces trained the APD.  First of all - is there any truth to that?  Second, no wonder these kids show up angry.  Zero dialogue or room for discussion of alternative viewpoints and then you tell the students "the enemy" is training the APD.  For what purpose? To get them riled up?  Disappointing for a UT prof but maybe not surprising.   It then panned over to the Jewish students getting interviewed by media after this session where they expressed their concerns about some of the rhetoric (and, by the way, praising the UT administration for efforts to help make them feel safe which gets lost in all of this).  One mentioned he had politely sat down next to this professor on campus to talk to her about some of these issues, but again, refusal to engage in any discussion.   So much for the free exchange of ideas and all that.

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Posted
10 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

A college-aged kid wearing a mask outdoors due to covid fears in 2024 is really a thing? 

Or do you think there might be another reason they are wearing a mask at these outdoor protests?

 

Is it your claim that an N95 mask disguises someone's identity?

Posted
1 minute ago, Skipper said:

I came across a livestream a couple of hours ago and it looked like a "pre-protest" or overall discussion was going on of some sort.   Apparently led by 2 UT profs.  All incredibly peaceful and non-disruptive (no tents!) so no issue there.  A few items stood out in the 20 mins or so I was listening (until it wrapped).   There were some jewish students listening in as well that raised their hand to engage and they were ignored.  Someone in the crowd asked if she considered Hamas a terrorist organization and she said something like I'm not answering that and moved on.  Then, the kicker, for some reason she noted that IDF forces trained the APD.  First of all - is there any truth to that?  Second, no wonder these kids show up angry.  Zero dialogue or room for discussion of alternative viewpoints and then you tell the students "the enemy" is training the APD.  For what purpose? To get them riled up?  Disappointing for a UT prof but maybe not surprising.   It then panned over to the Jewish students getting interviewed by media after this session where they expressed their concerns about some of the rhetoric (and, by the way, praising the UT administration for efforts to help make them feel safe which gets lost in all of this).  One mentioned he had politely sat down next to this professor on campus to talk to her about some of these issues, but again, refusal to engage in any discussion.   So much for the free exchange of ideas and all that.

Haven’t seen the video you’re referencing (would be great if you could post it), but I don’t think you will get much push back here that a UT professor ignoring a Jewish student attempting to participate in a discussion is a chickenshit move. Also, not acknowledging that Hamas is a terrorist organization. That professor should be publicly shamed if that’s true. 

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Posted
15 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

A college-aged kid wearing a mask outdoors due to covid fears in 2024 is really a thing? 

Or do you think there might be another reason they are wearing a mask at these outdoor protests?

 

There was literally a photo posted of a kid crossing a campus street last week, wearing a mask.  @Anastasis made his usual snarky response.

Posted
5 minutes ago, Skipper said:

for some reason she noted that IDF forces trained the APD

huh?  As in active IDF military takes time to rotate across the ocean to work with Texas LEOs?  Or maybe retired military do training classes paid for and sponsored by municipalities like they do with retired SEALS, SF, etc?

Posted
15 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

A college-aged kid wearing a mask outdoors due to covid fears in 2024 is really a thing? 

Or do you think there might be another reason they are wearing a mask at these outdoor protests?

 

It is still a thing.  I saw several a few weeks ago when I was visiting my daughter.  I am not stupid and I agree that many are wearing them to help conceal their identity during these protest.  

Posted
5 minutes ago, royiv said:

Haven’t seen the video you’re referencing (would be great if you could post it), but I don’t think you will get much push back here that a UT professor ignoring a Jewish student attempting to participate in a discussion is a chickenshit move. Also, not acknowledging that Hamas is a terrorist organization. That professor should be publicly shamed if that’s true. 

Unfortunately it was just a livestream.  I was doing a search to see if anydrama was occurring today and came across it and got sucked in for a bit. Will look to see if any video later.  To be clear, most of what I could hear was very tame but definitely not open to any discussion around the edges and the point about the IDF and APD was just WTF.  The audio wasn't great so maybe I missed some context.

Posted
11 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

There was literally a photo posted of a kid crossing a campus street last week, wearing a mask.  @Anastasis made his usual snarky response.

The one about the individual wearing a poor fitting N95 around while they walk outdoors with no one around them being performative? Yeah, that was me. 

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Posted
Just now, Anastasis said:

The one about the individual wearing a poor fitting N95 around while they walk outdoors with no one around them being performative? Yeah, that was me. 

Just two more weeks and bro is going to stop the spread!

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Posted
5 minutes ago, Skipper said:

Unfortunately it was just a livestream.  I was doing a search to see if anydrama was occurring today and came across it and got sucked in for a bit. Will look to see if any video later.  To be clear, most of what I could hear was very tame but definitely not open to any discussion around the edges and the point about the IDF and APD was just WTF.  The audio wasn't great so maybe I missed some context.

I don't know the extent of it or its history, and I can't speak to its veracity, but a very quick (and cursory) Google search led me to this article, which mentions Austin as one of the participating police forces. This is the first I can ever recall hearing about any of this.

https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/israel-us-police-training-end-knee-neck-protests

 

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Posted
1 hour ago, Mikey4 said:

My point is that the *government* allows a range of alternatives that address the concerns you raise (e.g., protection from the elements) while also ensuring that  the public space will be available to others. I'm not saying they need to go somewhere else. Protest right there. You don't need a tent to do that.

I understand. And in my post I acknowledged that other mechanisms exist for protesters to address those concerns. That said, I want to focus on the bolded portion of your statement as it has the structure of our system of government backwards. It isn't for the government to decide what freedoms we are "allowed" to have. Rather, it is for us decide what power the government has to restrict those freedoms. By phrasing it as you've done, you've implicitly suggested the government is being generous by letting us do certain things. I'm not saying this is intentional, but this sort of phrasing can color how one views the issue. My suggestion is that the proper view recognizes the government is curtailing our ability to do something because that is ultimately how the exercise of power here works. And, in doing Constitutional analysis we're generally more focused on whether what government restriction was reasonable and necessary for the purpose it sought rather than whether the government could have taken even more restrictive action. 

Posted
18 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

Just two more weeks and bro is going to stop the spread!

I mean, if you have to put on the stupid to make your point, quit while you're behind.  Kid could have had the flu, or an immune issue, or it could have been performative.  The point is, it isn't illegal to wear a fucking masks, but fascists like you and Annie like to slice and dice when things are OK and when they aren't.

Posted
2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I mean, if you have to put on the stupid to make your point, quit while you're behind.  Kid could have had the flu, or an immune issue, or it could have been performative.  The point is, it isn't illegal to wear a fucking masks, but fascists like you and Annie like to slice and dice when things are OK and when they aren't.

It's silly and rare at this point.  People who wear masks in 2024 are either the occasional socially awkward misfit or the rare soul who might be sick or have immune issue.  In contrast, there is a very, very large percentage of protesters wearing masks.  The organizers encouraged protesters to mask up. And it has zero to do with Covid.  It is to disguise their identity.  You know this.  You aren't that stupid.

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Posted
12 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

People who wear masks in 2024 are either the occasional socially awkward misfit

I would also add people that wear golf pants to the office to this list.

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Posted
18 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

It's silly and rare at this point.  People who wear masks in 2024 are either the occasional socially awkward misfit or the rare soul who might be sick or have immune issue.  In contrast, there is a very, very large percentage of protesters wearing masks.  The organizers encouraged protesters to mask up. And it has zero to do with Covid.  It is to disguise their identity.  You know this.  You aren't that stupid.

So you do believe an N95 disguises its wearer's identity?

Posted
5 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

Well, I'm going to hit a few on the way home and don't want to bring a change of clothes.

Bring a change of clothes. Nobody likes seeing that shit.

Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Dahobbs said:

I understand. And in my post I acknowledged that other mechanisms exist for protesters to address those concerns. That said, I want to focus on the bolded portion of your statement as it has the structure of our system of government backwards. It isn't for the government to decide what freedoms we are "allowed" to have. Rather, it is for us decide what power the government has to restrict those freedoms. By phrasing it as you've done, you've implicitly suggested the government is being generous by letting us do certain things. I'm not saying this is intentional, but this sort of phrasing can color how one views the issue. My suggestion is that the proper view recognizes the government is curtailing our ability to do something because that is ultimately how the exercise of power here works. And, in doing Constitutional analysis we're generally more focused on whether what government restriction was reasonable and necessary for the purpose it sought rather than whether the government could have taken even more restrictive action. 

I can't do a proper constitutional analysis because I don't have legislative findings or a factual record to show what interest the state is trying to advance. I can think of possible interests in banning tents on the lawn (architectural consistency of structures, preserving the lawn, keeping the lawn open to students to the greatest extent), but it's admittedly speculation.

I do know, however, that a restriction on tents is either not a restriction on speech at all, or at most is a content-neutral restriction on the manner of speech. For that reason, it's important that the restriction permits the core political speech at issue and allows reasonable alternatives for students who want to protest next to a tent (protest in a raincoat, use an umbrella, etc.). I don't mean to suggest that the government is being generous, but rather that the government can impose content-neutral restrictions where, as here, alternatives are available. 

Edited by Mikey4
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Posted
22 minutes ago, F250 said:

I would also add people that wear golf pants to the office to this list.

Dress like you or we're misfits huh?  Give me your address - I'm sending the protesters to your place next.

Posted

The Education Secretary isn’t down with what is happening across college campuses. 
 

“Education Secretary Miguel Cardona condemned what he deemed the "unacceptable" behavior of protesters on college campuses across the country.

"I think what's happening on our campuses is abhorrent," Cardona told Sen. Shelley Moore Capito, R-W.Va., at the Senate's budget requests hearing for fiscal year 2025 on Tuesday. "It's unacceptable and we're committed as a Department of Education to adhering to Title VI enforcement."

https://abcnews.go.com/US/live-updates/college-protests-israel-palestine-war/?id=109734946&cid=social_twitter_abcn

I guess the White House isn’t down with these campus occupiers nor their bullshit either. Hmmm….🤔 

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