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Posted
3 hours ago, Longhorn94 said:

I mean you cant be a sinner seeking forgiveness if you don't sin first, amirite?

 

3 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

 

When you understand that for modern American "Christians," the list of the holiest of sacraments just has one item on it -- "be a complete fucking hypocrite" -- it all clicks and falls into place.

Modern American Christians have managed to be, literally, everything the ACTUAL Christ warned and spoke against.  It's amazing to watch.  Up is down, black is white, lies are truth.....all of it.  One of the most fascinating sociological phenomena I've ever seen.

 

1 hour ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

That's the old Christian way.  They no longer bother with confession or shame, and repentance left the building a long time ago.  Deny, deflect, accuse, and then move on.  

Infuriating. 

 

1 hour ago, Dnaguy said:

Repent?

I answer to 3 folks and 3 folks alone.

The father, son, and the holy spirit.

Answering or repenting to anyone else is sacrilege and a sure fire way to hell.

I'm born again each day in the blood of the lamb when I wake up and thank Jesus for another glorious sunrise.

Heavenly father knows my heart.

Let us pray.......

Happy Well Done GIF

“Jesus died for my sins. I am already forgiven.”

So, in their minds, it doesn’t matter what they do.

Posted
2 hours ago, Jive Turkey said:

It should be worth noting that Moscow Marge has not been summoned to comfort Trump in the courtroom.  Yet Big Mike is there bending the knee. 

 

 

2 hours ago, Pancho said:

 

 

1 hour ago, HenryJames said:

Hahahahaha

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591c77eb-8f94-4190-beba-f08dfed21e22_tex

Posted
2 hours ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

I had forgotten, but I have a prior engagement this afternoon with some local Special Olympians from 1-3, so I'm not going to be able to do the play by play of the cross on Cohen.   @bolverk, are you able to take the wheel?

 

 

And now a reading from Trump's favorite gospel, a letter from Saint Daniel to the Special Olympians.  

"Dear brothers and sisters..."  (insert meme of him doing that physical mocking of the disabled reporter).  Well, you get it.  

Posted
1 hour ago, HenryJames said:

Hahahahaha

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It’s fascinating to watch  wannabe cabinet members and VP hopefuls on their pilgrim journey to a Manhattan courtroom to give the evil eye to the judge on Trump’s behalf. It’s like farting Fatima.

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Posted

I'll say it again: there should be stiffer penalties for lying, especially from elected officials. the parade of lies behind those microphones is just astounding. history will not look kindly at all on these people. assuming they don't win and prevent it from being written. sleep well!

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Posted
1 minute ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

why the objection? that's high comedy. but really, why was it sustained? because it's not a direct answer?

The objection was to the question, it just didn't beat the answer. I believe both the question and answer were stricken based on the reporting I've seen. 

Posted
2 hours ago, Surly Bevo said:

Looks like Stormy isn’t the only “whore” to visit the courthouse. 

Stormy is a sex worker, the whores are the Republicans.  

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Posted
2 hours ago, Foosters said:

having a laugh at the thought of those 4 guys struggling to tie a tie that will hang 6 inches below the belt

Luckily for them, Lindsey Graham just happened to be around and eagerly volunteered to take precise measurements by hand. No matter how many tries it takes. 

Posted
15 minutes ago, The Dog said:

Liked this one too:

image.png.6b44f2e72893eec61cb082c8a3fd2580.png

Lawyers, explain why "Well yeah, he broke the law" isn't a good answer here. That's what my instinct would be, and even if the defense objected isn't setting a witness up for an answer like that dumb? 

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Posted

I expected a lot more fire and needless drama from the defense on cross…bet Trump is pissed (if he even heard any of it during nappy time).  I’m biased, but the prosecution laid out a clear path to how TrumpCo is essentially a mob-style personality cult that minimized any form of traceable communications while attempting to hide hush payments illegally.  

But, given the ratio of hidden Trumpers in the country, I have little faith in the jury to reach consensus.  That oaf will proclaim he can sleep through trials and still be found not guilty.  

Posted
18 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Lawyers, explain why "Well yeah, he broke the law" isn't a good answer here. That's what my instinct would be, and even if the defense objected isn't setting a witness up for an answer like that dumb? 

As a technical matter, witnesses cannot tell a jury their opinion on whether a defendant is guilty or innocent, because only the jury can make that determination, but in response to a question worded as such, I think an objection would be overruled, because counsel opened the door and the witness is allowed to provide a response. 

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Posted

So refreshing to know that when Trump wins this case, in addition to the following truisms, the GOP is going to lock in the idea that Dems, and not the GOP,  weaponizes law enforcement:

GOP - more fiscally responsible.

GOP - more responsible on national defense.

GOP - backs the blue.

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Posted
20 minutes ago, 'stache said:

As a technical matter, witnesses cannot tell a jury their opinion on whether a defendant is guilty or innocent, because only the jury can make that determination, but in response to a question worded as such, I think an objection would be overruled, because counsel opened the door and the witness is allowed to provide a response. 

You're probably right, but I would have some small concern that it could be used as the basis of a mistrial. I thought his answer, especially if it had a good delivery, had largely the same effect on the jury with less risk. 

Posted
4 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

You're probably right, but I would have some small concern that it could be used as the basis of a mistrial. I thought his answer, especially if it had a good delivery, had largely the same effect on the jury with less risk. 

The defense can’t ask for a mistrial based on a question they asked can they? Because if that’s the case seems like there would be an “oops” question in every criminal trial that is trending against the defendant 

Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

The defense can’t ask for a mistrial based on a question they asked can they? Because if that’s the case seems like there would be an “oops” question in every criminal trial that is trending against the defendant 

They can ask.  But it almost certainly would fail under the invited error doctrine.  If he went off topic, they could object to a nonresponsive answer and request an instruction to disregard.  If that instruction were granted, they could request a mistrial, but he hasn't said anything so bad that it would render a hypothetical instruction to disregard ineffective.  

Edited by dcbc
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Posted
19 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

The defense can’t ask for a mistrial based on a question they asked can they? Because if that’s the case seems like there would be an “oops” question in every criminal trial that is trending against the defendant 

Well, usually not, but a witness can flout the rules in a such a way to cause a mistrial. This would most often come up in the context of an expert witness, who would generally be instructed by their attorney on what the judge has allowed vs not allowed to come into the case and would have to tailor their testimony based upon those instructions. Here, you're talking about a highly inflammatory statement, directly commenting on an issue the jury is supposed to be deciding, from a fact witness who is a lawyer and should understand the line, and where answering the question doesn't require the extra bit of inflammatory testimony. I'm not saying it likely would have resulted in a mistrial, but I bet it would have appeared in a motion for one. I think Cohen's answer was good in that context. I think while he could have issued a more explicit statement, discretion is the better part of valor here.  

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Posted
13 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Well, usually not, but a witness can flout the rules in a such a way to cause a mistrial.

By answering "sure" to a yes/no question?

Posted
11 minutes ago, The Dog said:

By answering "sure" to a yes/no question?

No, that's the answer that I think is fine. @Huckleberry's proposal of "Well yeah, he broke the law" is the one that I think is potentially problematic. I wouldn't really lose much sleep over it or anything, but I do think it invites a motion for mistrial.  

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Posted
2 hours ago, BevoAbyss said:

History shows no surprise Maggie Haberman was/is spewing Trump propaganda for the New York Times

After all, the Nazis/Hitler had writers, artists, hacks, and propagandists all over the German newspaper, radio, and film industries in the 1930s-1940s.

 

You know the most interesting part of this fact to me is that Hitler was trying to emulate the US and UK with propaganda.  

He mentions several times in Mein Kampf how impressed he was with their propaganda techniques during WWI, and how he wished Germany would have done the same.

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Posted
3 hours ago, Huckleberry said:

Lawyers, explain why "Well yeah, he broke the law" isn't a good answer here. That's what my instinct would be, and even if the defense objected isn't setting a witness up for an answer like that dumb? 

probably too smartass and argumentative for a jury. are there still lawyers on this jury?

Posted
44 minutes ago, DixonHur said:

You know the most interesting part of this fact to me is that Hitler was trying to emulate the US and UK with propaganda.  

He mentions several times in Mein Kampf how impressed he was with their propaganda techniques during WWI, and how he wished Germany would have done the same.

Quote


All propaganda must be popular and its intellectual level must be adjusted to the most limited intelligence among those it is addressed to. Consequently, the greater the mass it is intended to reach, the lower its purely intellectual level will have to be. But if, as in propaganda for sticking out a war, the aim is to influence a whole people, we must avoid excessive intellectual demands on our public, and too much caution cannot be extended in this direction. 

The more modest its intellectual ballast, the more exclusively it takes into consideration the emotions of the masses, the more effective it will be. And this is the best proof of the soundness or unsoundness of a propaganda campaign, and not success pleasing a few scholars or young aesthetes. 

The art of propaganda lies in understanding the emotional ideas of the great masses and finding, through a psychologically correct form, the way to the attention and thence to the heart of the broad masses. The fact that our bright boys do not understand this merely shows how mentally lazy and conceited they are. 

Once understood how necessary it is for propaganda in be adjusted to the broad mass, the following rule results:
It is a mistake to make propaganda many-sided, like scientific instruction, for instance. The receptivity of the great masses is very limited, their intelligence is small, but their power of forgetting is enormous. In consequence of these facts, all effective propaganda must be limited to a very few points and must harp on these in slogans until the last member of the public understands what you want him to understand by your slogan. As soon as you sacrifice this slogan and try to be many-sided, the effect will piddle away, for the crowd can neither digest nor retain the material offered. In this way the result is weakened and in the end entirely cancelled out. 

Thus we see that propaganda must follow a simple line and correspondingly the basic tactics must be psychologically sound.

Trump has proven Hitler correct.  

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Posted
3 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

Trump has proven Hitler correct.  

Yep.  That was my point, but I was in a hurry to get dinner out to the oven.

Shit's come around full circle with each iteration getting dangerously more aggressive and sophisticated as technology improves.  

Mein Kampf is basically the GQP playbook.

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Posted

Interesting note there about the prosecution's discomfort during Daniels' cross and relative ease with Cohen's.

I think that points up what we were saying earlier that Daniels is a problematic witness that the prosecution felt the jury wanted to hear from, but was not necessary to the case.  So, they could see her cross blowing something up for a witness that was just window dressing.

On the other hand, Cohen is a problematic witness that is essential to proving the case.  They KNEW they had to put him on and swallow the pig of his credibility problems.  Apparently thus far they are quite content with the neutralization they have achieved and don't feel the cross is damaging.

Also, that the reporters and seemingly the jury can't follow the cross and where it's headed is a great sign for the prosecution.

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Posted
23 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Interesting note there about the prosecution's discomfort during Daniels' cross and relative ease with Cohen's.

I think that points up what we were saying earlier that Daniels is a problematic witness that the prosecution felt the jury wanted to hear from, but was not necessary to the case.  So, they could see her cross blowing something up for a witness that was just window dressing.

On the other hand, Cohen is a problematic witness that is essential to proving the case.  They KNEW they had to put him on and swallow the pig of his credibility problems.  Apparently thus far they are quite content with the neutralization they have achieved and don't feel the cross is damaging.

Also, that the reporters and seemingly the jury can't follow the cross and where it's headed is a great sign for the prosecution.

The whole approach seems to be to just muddle along, throw shit at the witnesses and see what sticks.  Pretty much the same way Trump runs a campaign or anything else.  Problem is the jury isn't full of MAGA worshippers.

 

6 minutes ago, chainsaw said:

To me it all comes down to the Truth Social juror. Can the other jurors get him to embrace common sense?

Pretty sure that was juror 4 and they were disqualified before the jury got properly seated.    But I had forgotten about the one who listened to Cohen's podcasts.  Probably one or more of the Meidas ones.

Posted
7 minutes ago, pyrohornIII said:

The whole approach seems to be to just muddle along, throw shit at the witnesses and see what sticks.  Pretty much the same way Trump runs a campaign or anything else.  Problem is the jury isn't full of MAGA worshippers.

 

Pretty sure that was juror 4 and they were disqualified before the jury got properly seated.    But I had forgotten about the one who listened to Cohen's podcasts.  Probably one or more of the Meidas ones.

The "Truth Social" juror was seated, but:

Some commentators have suggested that Trump might find a guardian angel in Juror 2, the only one to have admitted to following Trump on Truth Social and to getting his news from the platform. But the media consumption graphic only tells part of the story. “I read basically everything,” Juror 2 said. “I follow Truth Social posts from Trump on Twitter. I do follow Michael Cohen, Mueller She Wrote, and some more.” He said that Trump has done some good for the country, but added “it goes both ways.” (That doesn’t sound exactly like a MAGA diehard.)

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/04/trump-jury-selection-manhattan-juror-2-merchan/

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Posted
To me it all comes down to the Truth Social juror. Can the other jurors get him to embrace common sense?

It won’t matter. Even if they find him guilty. They’ll just give him a fine and that will be that. Best case.
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Posted
18 minutes ago, tbone_ said:


It won’t matter. Even if they find him guilty. They’ll just give him a fine and that will be that. Best case.

Yeah, but the fine might be a bigly $10,000.  That will teach him.

Posted
18 minutes ago, tbone_ said:


It won’t matter. Even if they find him guilty. They’ll just give him a fine and that will be that. Best case.

It won't matter to his base one way or the other, but there are Republicans, no matter how small the percentage, say 3 to 5%, that won't show up because he is a 34 time convicted felon.  And yes, that matters.  

Posted
It won't matter to his base one way or the other, but there are Republicans, no matter how small the percentage, say 3 to 5%, that won't show up because he is a 34 time convicted felon.  And yes, that matters.  

They’re lying. If they’re still republicans, 1) they’re in a cult, and 2) lying is their favorite sacrament. They will come home to Dear Leader. Always.
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Posted
1 minute ago, Brisketexan said:


They’re lying. If they’re still republicans, 1) they’re in a cult, and 2) lying is their favorite sacrament. They will come home to Dear Leader. Always.

He didn't get complete fealty from Republican Congressman, even if it was a small percentage, again 3 to 5%.  The same will be true for the general population.  He'll always have the Maga base, but that doesn't win an election.  It's the margins that matter, 3% doesn't sound like much but against the 80 million needed to win, 2.4 million is a big deal.  

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Posted

Yep.  All of this.  The only way to defeat him is to take that middle 25mm of his voter bloc.  And shame just enough of them to stay home and tell themselves, "I just can't with this fucking guy anymore."  You get a few million across a dozen key states, and it's game over for MAGA.  The 25mm straight ticket voters don't give a shit if it's Trump, Goebbels, or Larry the Cable Guy...they're pulling the lever no matter what.  The bottom 25mm that came out of the woodwork addicted to validation and empowerment, they're going for Trump and probably shooting up the polling station.  Focus on shaming those in that middle seam.  

But then the real fun begins.  It's not super close, but close...EC-wise.  And Trump throws a tantrum that makes J6 and the last 4 years look like a fraternity prank.  The trick remains, "how do you make them think that one another was complicit in the fraudulent conspiracy to steal the election?"  If you can find a way to get them to turn on one another and not the rest of us, it's Morning in America again.  If not, it's blood in the streets.  

Posted
18 minutes ago, YGIFS said:

Yep.  All of this.  The only way to defeat him is to take that middle 25mm of his voter bloc.  And shame just enough of them to stay home and tell themselves, "I just can't with this fucking guy anymore."  You get a few million across a dozen key states, and it's game over for MAGA.  The 25mm straight ticket voters don't give a shit if it's Trump, Goebbels, or Larry the Cable Guy...they're pulling the lever no matter what.  The bottom 25mm that came out of the woodwork addicted to validation and empowerment, they're going for Trump and probably shooting up the polling station.  Focus on shaming those in that middle seam.  

But then the real fun begins.  It's not super close, but close...EC-wise.  And Trump throws a tantrum that makes J6 and the last 4 years look like a fraternity prank.  The trick remains, "how do you make them think that one another was complicit in the fraudulent conspiracy to steal the election?"  If you can find a way to get them to turn on one another and not the rest of us, it's Morning in America again.  If not, it's blood in the streets.  

He couldn't pull off a coup while in charge of the Federal Government, good luck now.  This is a guy who couldn't figure out a bus schedule.  Sure you will get a few nutters who do something crazy, but by November Trump will be lucky if he can distinguish shitting his pants from brushing his teeth.  

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