Jump to content

2023 Fall Camp Thread of Dominance


USMCHorn

Recommended Posts

9 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

Sweat is not a question mark. He was 3rd team All Big 12 by PFF last year. Starting DT is in line with starting WR on the lists of worries for 2023. Collins is a fair criticism. 

 

3 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

This is kind of important.

 

2 minutes ago, SarkAfterDark said:

When did Sweat become a jag? Could have swore we were all hoping he returned instead of taking his shot at the NFL.

Don't get me wrong. I like Sweat, and hope he has a great year. I think he can be effective. He wasn't better than Ojomo or Coburn last year, and I'd like to see a little more disruption in the backfield, but you're right - he's not as big of a question mark as some of the others. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Hornlover said:

 

 

Don't get me wrong. I like Sweat, and hope he has a great year. I think he can be effective. He wasn't better than Ojomo or Coburn last year, and I'd like to see a little more disruption in the backfield, but you're right - he's not as big of a question mark as some of the others. 

I'd say he's not really a question mark at all.

 

Both Sweat and Murphy have 3rd-5th round grades. 

Edited by BurntOrange&White
Link to comment
Share on other sites

37 minutes ago, 6th Street said:

There is enough talent to beat down the likes of TCU, Baylor, etc. Just need better second half coaching from Sark when the other teams make halftime adjustments. 

I already know that the halftime adjustment thing is going to be the most overused bit of the season along with where the corners line up on 3rd and 4th down. If we are down by 1 to Bama at half and come back and win it's because we made halftime adjustments! If we are ahead by 1 at the half and lose on a field goal at the buzzer it is because we didn't make halftime adjustments!

How much face time do you think coaches get with each other and the players in a 20-minute halftime once everyone files into the locker room, coaches get down from the press box, everyone takes a piss and players get any treatment needed from the training staff? The actual time spent in front of a whiteboard in the locker room is maybe maybe 6-7 minutes at most. The notion that you can just sit down and review what a team showed in the first half and draw up plays to counter it in the second half is a major stretch. You can make a few minor tweaks to your original gameplan, give the team a rah-rah speech and it's back out on the field. 

If you think second halves need to be better than that's a preparation thing that needs to be fixed on Sunday through Friday and not during a brief intermission in the middle of the game. 

Edited by Hookem2147
  • Hook 'Em 6
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

I already know that the halftime adjustment thing is going to be the most overused cliche of the season along with where the corners line up on 3rd and 4th down. If we are down by 1 to Bama at half and come back and win it's because we made halftime adjustments! If we are ahead by 1 at the half and lose on a field goal at the buzzer it is because we didn't make halftime adjustments!

How much face time do you think coaches get with each other and the players in a 20-minute halftime once everyone files into the locker room, coaches get down from the press box, everyone takes a piss and players get any treatment needed from the training staff? The actual time spent in front of a whiteboard in the locker room is maybe maybe 6-7 minutes at most. The notion that you can just sit down and review what a team showed in the first half and draw up plays to counter it in the second half is a major stretch. You can make a few minor tweaks to your original gameplan, give the team a rah-rah speech and it's back out on the field. 

If you think second halves need to be better than that's a preparation thing that needs to be fixed on Sunday through Friday and not during a brief intermission in the middle of the game. 

Last season Peyton Manning said the same thing on one of his MNF broadcasts. He said that the significance of halftime adjustments is way overblown and that most of halftime is basically spent waiting for the coaches to get down from the box to the locker room. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, trythisathome said:

Last season Peyton Manning said the same thing on one of his MNF broadcasts. He said that the significance of halftime adjustments is way overblown and that most of halftime is basically spent waiting for the coaches to get down from the box to the locker room. 

It's even more true in the NFL where I think halftimes are only 12 or 13 minutes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Hornlover said:

And two of them are Collins - a fourth year senior who has never shown anything resembling consistency or high effort, and Sweat - a fifth year senior that has trouble shedding blocks and whose main contribution seems to be just being big and clogging up the middle.  You're hoping these guys are Gaskamp candidates that turn into this years' version of Ojomo and Coburn, but like @closetojumping likes to say - I'm from Missouri.

Sweat staying back for another year was a huge win for the defense.  Collins hasn't lived up to the hype, but I'm glad to have him in the rotation.  To write off either is foolish, particularly when they'll have as much or more help at NT and EDGE to support them than we've seen in previous years. 

The defensive line will be anchored by Sorrell and Murphy anyway, and the rest just need to be competent to match last year.  Throw in an improved pass rush with second year Burke and Finkley and the raw talent of Colton Vasek and Anthony Hill, and hopefully all those QB pressures start to result in more sacks.   This seems to be the plan, and I don't see how it won't result in similar results on run defense with a chance to improve our pass defense up front.  ILB will be the same or better with Ford at Mike and your-guess-is-as-good-as-mine at Will (same as it ever was). 

 You can nitpick individual players, but I think there's plenty of room for optimism for the defense as a whole.    You either believe that PK, Davis, and Choate can coach this combo of talent into a serviceable front 6 or 7 or you don't.  I choose to believe they can.  Combine that with what appears to be the most talented secondary we've had in recent memory, and I see a defense that has a floor that we can win the Big12 with. 

  

  • Hook 'Em 3
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This Is just comical. Your questions on offense boil down to "Some of the players on O had poor results last season". Then, you proceed to say "All of these defensive players, that couldn't even start last year, are likely to be better than the person they're replacing". 
You listed 8 defensive players, only two of which (Ford and Sorrell) were starters last year. The rest were all backups. Yes, they played, but they are mostly unproven. That's why there are so many question marks. 
The offense returns 9 starters (10 if you want to count Cain). Yes, we lose the best RB in the country, but that's also usually one of the easiest positions for a freshman to play, and we have 4 or 5 excellent choices including the #1 RB recruit in the country. Otherwise, the only question surrounding the offense is basically "Will all of the players from last year be better this year?" Much of that hinges on Ewers, but even that's not some big question mark. 
Versus the defense, where we don't have any clue if either Edge can generate pressure consistently or hold the edge against the run. How will a new DT stand up in the middle with starters' snaps? (Murphy has enough track record to not be unproven).  Will Collins or Vasek or Tapp or Finkley or Walton contribute meaningfully? Who's going to play next to Ford? Gbenda, Bush, Blackwell, and all the freshman have questions surrounding them.
The starters in the secondary are likely solid, but we're also expecting lots of contributions from young unproven players. Especially if Catalon gets hurt again. 

Starter has been a pretty arbitrary term on the DL the past two years - to a point of being detrimental at times, Broughton being a consistent feature in the rotation after it was proven he was not as good as the guys in front of him and should have been used more situationally, if at all, is a good example of that. And yet it’s already been proven that a front with those guys collectively playing a bunch of snaps can produce a good defensive unit, which is my point. To act like Sweat, Murphy, or Finkley are “new” because they happened to send someone out on the first play last year is silly because they played a bunch of snaps. There’s a lot of experience in the front.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

EGAT just did a breakdown of the LB position. Waddlington and Boyd are bullish on Gbenda while acknowledging his shortcomings. Scipio saw improvement from '21 to '22 and made the case that the trend should continue, especially in coverage. He noted that Gbenda may still be playing "wait and see" against the run (rather than being proactive), but that is still better than his strategy of "run around randomly" from 2021. 
Remember, Ford wasn't shit until he was.  

I’m on the Gbenda hype train. One - cause I like to go against the grain. Two - cause I see the positives when others focus on the negatives (I actually flip that based on general perceptions). Three - he’s a ball of thunder. Four - he will play hard and be active.

I watched the UW game again. The long TD run was right at him. Unfortunately the DT was pushed back into this lap. The defender to his left - unblocked and concerned with the fake/qb. I think he read it fine, but the line play (one player) caused the problem.

He only logged 71 snaps in 2022, about a third of 2021. He needs reps to get consistency. I’m not sure he’ll be a 3 down guy so coverage may not be a huge issue. Last year he didn’t play enough to draw any definitive conclusions but PFF graded him well, and there were some positives from his limited snaps. I’d say throw 2021 out the window for a number of reasons.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It feels like every offseason I get sucked into the hype of believing that an upperclassman will finally break out. This year it is Collins, and I think it actually make rational sense. This is his “contract year” and the coaches seem to really believe in him/have specific plans for him. I’d love to see it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Sock Monkey said:

It feels like every offseason I get sucked into the hype of believing that an upperclassman will finally break out. This year it is Collins, and I think it actually make rational sense. This is his “contract year” and the coaches seem to really believe in him/have specific plans for him. I’d love to see it.

It’s a lot more believable for someone like Collins than Naashon Hughes and other ones who have been hyped up in previous years.

  • Hook 'Em 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

It’s a lot more believable for someone like Collins than Naashon Hughes and other ones who have been hyped up in previous years.

I think it's more believable because this staff has shown in such a short time they can develop players. That hasn't been true with proper development in 10-15 years. 

  • Hook 'Em 3
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Hookem2147 said:

"Our sources feel that Arch has moved ahead of Maalik Murphy this month"- IT

Sure, but I’d still be surprised it Malik isn’t #2 on the depth chart. Don’t want him to transfer at first opportunity. They probably want him and Arch to battle it out for #1 next year before he transfers.

  • Hook 'Em 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Hookem2147 said:

I already know that the halftime adjustment thing is going to be the most overused bit of the season along with where the corners line up on 3rd and 4th down. If we are down by 1 to Bama at half and come back and win it's because we made halftime adjustments! If we are ahead by 1 at the half and lose on a field goal at the buzzer it is because we didn't make halftime adjustments!

How much face time do you think coaches get with each other and the players in a 20-minute halftime once everyone files into the locker room, coaches get down from the press box, everyone takes a piss and players get any treatment needed from the training staff? The actual time spent in front of a whiteboard in the locker room is maybe maybe 6-7 minutes at most. The notion that you can just sit down and review what a team showed in the first half and draw up plays to counter it in the second half is a major stretch. You can make a few minor tweaks to your original gameplan, give the team a rah-rah speech and it's back out on the field. 

If you think second halves need to be better than that's a preparation thing that needs to be fixed on Sunday through Friday and not during a brief intermission in the middle of the game

Fair, let's just say general in game adjustments is an area where Sark needs to improve. He does well on the first couple of drives which are scripted. Then when opposing defenses have had time to adjust he tends to struggle. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, thepop said:

Sure, but I’d still be surprised it Malik isn’t #2 on the depth chart. Don’t want him to transfer at first opportunity. They probably want him and Arch to battle it out for #1 next year before he transfers.

For this exact reason I don't expect Sark to name a starter next year until some time after fall camp.  Maybe not even going into our first game next season.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, 6th Street said:

Fair, let's just say general in game adjustments is an area where Sark needs to improve. He does well on the first couple of drives which are scripted. Then when opposing defenses have had time to adjust he tends to struggle. 

Our 3rd quarter offense was actually fairly decent last year, so it appears to be more of a 4th quarter thing than a "halftime adjustment" thing. We did a better job last year of finishing games in the 4th quarter than 2021. Now we need to take another step on that front. 

  • Hook 'Em 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ultimately, the name of the game is Scoreboard. We averaged 35 points a game, and lost 5 games. Of those losses, 3 were because the O didn't get to the average and 2 were because the D couldn't hold the opponents under 35. If we'd scored 35 every game, we'd have been 11-2 instead of 8-5. The bowl game is not really pertinent, other than showing a lack of urgency from all concerned, so I'ma ignore that. None of the losses were blowouts – in fact, they were all basically single scores. What the record shows is that improvement on either side of the ball, with no dropoff on the other side, should be enough to get to 10 wins in the first 12 games.

Of course, one of the losses was a combination of losing our starting QB and a couple of bad zebra calls, and that can certainly happen again, and under the greater circumstances seems more likely than not. Still, all else being more or less equal, I'm feeling pretty good.

Let's ride.

  • Hook 'Em 5
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, bejezuz said:

Sweat staying back for another year was a huge win for the defense.  Collins hasn't lived up to the hype, but I'm glad to have him in the rotation.  To write off either is foolish, particularly when they'll have as much or more help at NT and EDGE to support them than we've seen in previous years. 

I'm not writing off either. I'm just pointing out that there are lots more questions surrounding our DL and LBs than there are on offense. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

34 minutes ago, Had Enough said:


I’m on the Gbenda hype train. ... he’s a ball of thunder and he will play hard and be active.

I watched the UW game again. The long TD run was right at him. Unfortunately the DT was pushed back into this lap. The defender to his left - unblocked and concerned with the fake/qb. I think he read it fine, but the line play (one player) caused the problem.

Last year he didn’t play enough to draw any definitive conclusions but PFF graded him well, and there were some positives from his limited snaps. I’d say throw 2021 out the window for a number of reasons.

1 hour ago, Park Gothic said:

EGAT just did a breakdown of the LB position. Waddlington and Boyd are bullish on Gbenda while acknowledging his shortcomings. Scipio saw improvement from '21 to '22 and made the case that the trend should continue, especially in coverage. He noted that Gbenda may still be playing "wait and see" against the run (rather than being proactive), but that is still better than his strategy of "run around randomly" from 2021. 

Remember, Ford wasn't shit until he was.  

1 hour ago, CastHorn said:

Gbenda’s Cinco Ranch tape is some of the best ILB tape you’ll find at the HS level. 

I would offer that Gbenda's results reflect his coaching and the players around him, good and bad. 

A LB in the middle is impacted by other players more so than most others.

Hiring the position coaches before the Defensive Coordinator is not conducive to having a consistent defensive philosophy, which we are all painfully aware of.

Blitzing from centerfield or sitting on your heals and waiting and then "running around randomly" is more symptomatic of braindead coaching rather than player execution.

Hager's style of "setting the edge" and consistently taking himself our of the play puts a lot of pressure on LB. Having your DL thrown into your lap while an unblocked teammate watches doesn't help.

Gbenda's a 5th year player who will benefit from better coaching and athletes around him, and I look froward to him delivering the goods. 

  • Hook 'Em 1
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, Hornlover said:

I'm not writing off either. I'm just pointing out that there are lots more questions surrounding our DL and LBs than there are on offense. 

I think both have 2 questions with the starting group..  OL- the 2 guards

DL- Buck and LB next to Ford.. I dont think Ovie is tough to replace. He was solid vs the run and offered 0 pass rush. That is should not be tough to replace, if PK wants a similar profile. The LB spot will regress some. Lot will depend on HIll's development/usage. 

 

 

Edited by Codaxx
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Had Enough said:


I’m on the Gbenda hype train. One - cause I like to go against the grain. Two - cause I see the positives when others focus on the negatives (I actually flip that based on general perceptions). Three - he’s a ball of thunder. Four - he will play hard and be active.

I watched the UW game again. The long TD run was right at him. Unfortunately the DT was pushed back into this lap. The defender to his left - unblocked and concerned with the fake/qb. I think he read it fine, but the line play (one player) caused the problem.

He only logged 71 snaps in 2022, about a third of 2021. He needs reps to get consistency. I’m not sure he’ll be a 3 down guy so coverage may not be a huge issue. Last year he didn’t play enough to draw any definitive conclusions but PFF graded him well, and there were some positives from his limited snaps. I’d say throw 2021 out the window for a number of reasons.

You're exactly right about the UW game. I just rewatched that play and Broughton is double teamed right into Gbenda's lap. Ford was supposed to cover the inside lane and took himself out of position. Not on Gbenda.

For reference (at 2:48): 

 

That doesn't mean he'll be world beater. More than anything it confirms my belief that Broughton is a liability whose ass should be firmly glued to the pine. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, thepop said:

Sure, but I’d still be surprised it Malik isn’t #2 on the depth chart. Don’t want him to transfer at first opportunity. They probably want him and Arch to battle it out for #1 next year before he transfers.

We will have 2 opportunities in the first 3 weeks to have backups play the 4th. Sark isn't going to waste reps on Murphy if Arch has already supplanted him. Also if Murphy is already falling behind he will want a fresh start in the spring at whatever school takes him. There will be a equal or better option than Murphy in the portal that can push Arch and give some insurance behind him

Link to comment
Share on other sites

41 minutes ago, Park Gothic said:

You're exactly right about the UW game. I just rewatched that play and Broughton is double teamed right into Gbenda's lap. Ford was supposed to cover the inside lane and took himself out of position. Not on Gbenda.

For reference (at 2:48): 

 

That doesn't mean he'll be world beater. More than anything it confirms my belief that Broughton is a liability whose ass should be firmly glued to the pine. 

This.. Broughton plays DT on roller skates. If anyone enjoys watching Broughton play, it is @Burt Macklin

Edited by Codaxx
  • Hook 'Em 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Sir Ulrich said:

We will have 2 opportunities in the first 3 weeks to have backups play the 4th. Sark isn't going to waste reps on Murphy if Arch has already supplanted him. Also if Murphy is already falling behind he will want a fresh start in the spring at whatever school takes him. There will be a equal or better option than Murphy in the portal that can push Arch and give some insurance behind him

I disagree.  I think even if Arch is ahead of Murphy, even if Sark knows right now that Arch will be the starter next year, Murphy will take garbage time reps first all year.  If Quinn had a major injury that would be different.

  • Hook 'Em 4
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites


That doesn't mean he'll be world beater. More than anything it confirms my belief that Broughton is a liability whose ass should be firmly glued to the pine. 


The UW is a good game to watch for this year. They’re well coached with good talent including a capable QB. They missed some throws on us, but we battled and didn’t make the throws easy. They coach to their advantage so they identify some of our disadvantages.

There are good examples of how we need to be more physical and sometimes sacrifice yourself to allow someone else to finish.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.



×
×
  • Create New...