America's Loneliness Epidemic

[seven 1366]

I can very easily say that I would be immensely lonely without my dog. 

[MissingInAction 24746]

It's not just the companionship, but the responsibility which many have lamented here. 

That responsibility has kept me out of serious trouble on more occasions than I can count.

I'll be out at midnight or later when the booze/drugs are hitting, and poor decisions are being discussed amongst the crew. That's when I pull the, I have to get home to my dog, card.

Works 100% of the time evry time.

[seven 1366]

Yes, same. In my deepest pits of depression (or chemo fatigue), I still got out of bed to feed the dog and let her outside. 

[SHOOTER12 8782]

On 9/1/2023 at 11:21 AM, InkaUtexas said:

I guess I am fortunate. Lived alone since the kiddos went off to college three years ago. This year invited a good friend to live at my place in the separate wing of the house. We are working on a screenplay and just made sense with the logistics. Work from home and taking care of dogs was getting old. Another friend got divorced and had no where to go. He is an Artist and this place allows him the space to paint. Plus they both get along well with my fiancé. 

So basically I set up an artist colony without realizing. We rotate cooking duties and it is a lot of time shooting the shit over a few beers in the kitchen. Sports rule the TV and the library has expanded. 

I am very happy my dad (Widower, 83) got involved with Civil Air Patrol. Gives him some people to hang out with and share their military experience. He has lunch with a few friends twice a week. 

Humans are not supposed to be alone.

@ztejas Tell us more about this tailgate. 

You should be negged for this.

One humble brag per post please...

[MissingInAction 24746]

1 hour ago, seven said:

Yes, same. In my deepest pits of depression (or chemo fatigue), I still got out of bed to feed the dog and let her outside. 

I feel ya brother.

I take my dog to the house of this asshole I can't stand just so she can play with his dog and run around for a while. 

[NeverMarryAStripper 21780]

These days, the only real human contact I have outside of my 93-year-old mom who I take care of, and my two kids are the regulars at the Tanglewood dog park that I take Sebastian to most days.  I don't even know most of their names, I just know their dog's names.  I hesitated for a long time about getting another dog after I had to put down my GSD Duke because of cancer about 20 years ago, but now I wish I hadn't waited because Sebastian has been such a blessing to me.  I swear he's like a natural therapy dog.  He can sense when I need cheering up and comes to give me a kiss and put his head in my lap.  I'm thinking about another rescue now, but I think Sebastian would need to pick him out.

[Judge Roybeanbag 11771]

On 9/2/2023 at 8:24 AM, Bevo said:

Ahh, it should be like a walk in the park.

Not sure if you’re an Austin native but just in case, here’s some Bob.

 

[Deej 76396]

On 9/6/2023 at 11:49 AM, Sandman said:

All this talk about how many dogs to get is crazy to me. I have 2 and wish they would go back to their home planet, Pootchie-style. I don't like having to work around them as far as rushing home straight after work to let them out, or making sure we get home in time to feed them on a saturday. Or just making sure they have plenty of time to be out of their crate every day. I currently do all those things, without fail, but I'd rather just do whatever the fuck I wanted, without limits.

And before you call me a bastard for having these dogs, my kids wanted dogs after our beloved boxer passed and we got these two idiots. Then my kids got their driver's licenses and jobs and now they moved out and have families and dogs of their own. I got stuck with the farting machines. 

Sounds like you don't deserve a dog. 

[Sandman 3401]

24 minutes ago, Deej said:

Sounds like you don't deserve a dog. 

I agree. I don't deserve this at all. 

[Parliament 14086]

This has turned into the Mental Health Thread B channel, and that's awesome.  Props to all you guys.

[Hefeweizen 5306]

It’s kind of interesting being alone when my wife and son are gone in college visits.  It’s a little bit of a preview of empty nest time.

I am planning on working about half time and volunteering a couple of days a week, and my wife is going back to work part time and continuing to volunteer (different organizations).

I enjoy being alone and being able to do what I want but I think personal interaction is absolutely necessary for people.  I force myself to get it regardless.

[BearSchlong 8072]

Church was where a lot of people traditionally found community and connection. Hell, as a child my family sure as hell did (the Houston Catholic “mafia” is still a great network for me), and even as a young family we did. Even though we don’t attend regularly anymore (seriously…sometimes not even Christmas or Easter), we still get together every couple of months with other similar aged adults for pizza beer and bullshitting, who we all met through our PCUSA church. Our kids are at similar stations in life, and so are most of us. Things have changed…one gal is divorced because her husband ran out on her, another is widowed (a fucking OD, the dumbass), but we are all in community, and it came from going to the same church.
Churches attract similar-minded people from similar stations in life, making a natural community that follows from that. These days, the theology, often rigid structure, and building distrust of institutions has worn that down. And there’s a SHITLOAD that’s bad about American organized religion. But the community aspect of it was a good thing, and as we walk away from what’s bad about church, we also walk away from the good we got out of it, and we haven’t really replaced it with anything.

I'm chairman of the fellowship committee. At the church my grandparents helped found in the 50s. Raging liberal Presbyterian. At first I was “dammit they put me on the session so I would be their church luncheon bitch. I hate that job.” so I did it until I learned to love it.

Several years later, it's one of the more rewarding of my half-dozen service commitments. Served gumbo to 120 in the fellowship hall after church today, as a matter of fact, and already looking forward to October’s event.

Our PCUSA pastor has wacky themes. Of course next month is the kirkin of the tartans (no haggis, enchilada soup), but today was talk like a pirate day. Here are my 82 year old aunt and uncle, and my mom.

[DalTxHornFan 3074]

19 minutes ago, BearSchlong said:

I'm chairman of the fellowship committee. At the church my grandparents helped found in the 50s. Raging liberal Presbyterian. At first I was “dammit they put me on the session so I would be their church luncheon bitch. I hate that job.” so I did it until I learned to love it.

Several years later, it's one of the more rewarding of my half-dozen service commitments. Served gumbo to 120 in the fellowship hall after church today, as a matter of fact, and already looking forward to October’s event.

Our PCUSA pastor has wacky themes. Of course next month is the kirkin of the tartans (no haggis, enchilada soup), but today was talk like a pirate day. Here are my 82 year old aunt and uncle, and my mom.

Good for you, Schlong.  Knowing PCUSA, your gumbo was very likely the biggest truth any of them experienced today!  (Sorry, that may have been a bit CR!)

Edited September 18, 2023 by DalTxHornFan

[Hook1997 5263]

40 minutes ago, BearSchlong said:

I'm chairman of the fellowship committee. At the church my grandparents helped found in the 50s. Raging liberal Presbyterian. At first I was “dammit they put me on the session so I would be their church luncheon bitch. I hate that job.” so I did it until I learned to love it.

Several years later, it's one of the more rewarding of my half-dozen service commitments. Served gumbo to 120 in the fellowship hall after church today, as a matter of fact, and already looking forward to October’s event.

Our PCUSA pastor has wacky themes. Of course next month is the kirkin of the tartans (no haggis, enchilada soup), but today was talk like a pirate day. Here are my 82 year old aunt and uncle, and my mom.

X,1,2

jk. That’s awesome.  
Living alone definitely has its advantage of doing what you want but definitely sucks at times.  Especially after you get out of a relationship.  So not only is that interaction time missing but you also neglect spending time with friends while in a relationship.  It feels odd being like hey, what’s up guys can I come hangout with you and your family after not seeing people for a while.  

Edited September 18, 2023 by Hook1997

[BabaYaga 15190]

14 hours ago, BearSchlong said:

and my mom.

[Frank Drebin 5616]

On 9/4/2023 at 9:17 AM, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

This is an interesting thread. It's been touched on lightly here, but I think the underlying issue is our iPhones. They're a life crutch and allow us to complete checkout from the relationships and experiences that truly provide meaning to our lives.

I got rid of my iPhone a few months ago and it's had a profound impact on my happiness, sense of purpose, relationships, pretty much everything. It obviously has its drawbacks, but I feel like I have my life back. Without that stupid fucking thing in my pocket, everything I do has intentionality behind it. I make more of an effort to live my life, and looking back, it's clear it has stolen so much of the one thing I can't have more of: time.

This is a really good post.

I put my phone on the charger in another room when I get home from work and keep it there. 

[Frank Drebin 5616]

On 9/4/2023 at 2:55 PM, Gatorubet said:

And we used to sit together for lunch and not stare at our cell phones.  And we used to take care of our elderly in our own homes and not send them off to nursing homes.   And we used to not spend hours online gaming.   And if you read the morning paper, and then at dinner listened to uncle Walt give the news, you did not spend one second on Twitter or Surly or FaceBook looking up world events, sports or politics.  

So while I recognize the community aspects of church and religion, I do not agree with the “a lot” statement. That said, it is certainly a factor in the mix.  

I disagree.  I think it is a lot.

Church provides a network of people who will care for you and check in on you.  In my experience, if you get sick or have a tragedy, there will be a organized group stepping in to care for you.  When you get married or have a child, there will be showers. You don't show up for a month, you will get a phone call. A loved one dies, you get checked in on and many will attend the funeral. A group of men I am friends with at church meet once a week in person for bible study and coffee.  The ladies do the same. We have a couple short zoom prayer meetings a week.  So needs are generally known.

Churches, like any institution, are made of human beings so they never have been and will never be perfect.  But the community aspect is very beneficial for those who participate. I don't see any other institution being able to fill in the void of a community of faith.

 

[Brisketexan 104226]

6 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

I disagree.  I think it is a lot.

Church provides a network of people who will care for you and check in on you.  In my experience, if you get sick or have a tragedy, there will be a organized group stepping in to care for you.  When you get married or have a child, there will be showers. You don't show up for a month, you will get a phone call. A loved one dies, you get checked in on and many will attend the funeral. A group of men I am friends with at church meet once a week in person for bible study and coffee.  The ladies do the same. We have a couple short zoom prayer meetings a week.  So needs are generally known.

Churches, like any institution, are made of human beings so they never have been and will never be perfect.  But the community aspect is very beneficial for those who participate. I don't see any other institution being able to fill in the void of a community of faith.

I don't disagree.  Which is why the self-destruction by religious institutions, choosing to focus so much of their energy (and the vast majority of their public-facing statements) on judging others, cruelty, division, and flat-out hate, is such a fucking tragedy.

I agree that American Christianity is under attack.  It's almost all "coming from inside the house."  My children, RAISED in the organized church (and a denomination that is pretty far onto the "kind and welcoming" end of the spectrum), actively LOATHE organized religion in America.  Why?  Because it's fucking cruel to their friends and peers.  Because it is so focused on hurting and wounding.  Because "the cross" has been coopted as a political symbol by a movement that is so far removed from the Gospels (cough cough, Matthew 25) that they are utterly disgusted.

And I find it sad.  Because they are losing that anchor and community in their lives -- the good things that church can provide -- as well.

In the end, the collapse of the community of church is a symptom of the underlying illness that is the very subject of this thread.  It's all about self, zero about community/empathy.

[MissingInAction 24746]

Cruelty, division, and hate are the holy trinity of southern Baptist evangelicals.

[Frank Drebin 5616]

Just now, Brisketexan said:

I don't disagree.  Which is why the self-destruction by religious institutions, choosing to focus so much of their energy (and the vast majority of their public-facing statements) on judging others, cruelty, division, and flat-out hate, is such a fucking tragedy.

I agree that American Christianity is under attack.  It's almost all "coming from inside the house."  My children, RAISED in the organized church (and a denomination that is pretty far onto the "kind and welcoming" end of the spectrum), actively LOATHE organized religion in America.  Why?  Because it's fucking cruel to their friends and peers.  Because it is so focused on hurting and wounding.  Because "the cross" has been coopted as a political symbol by a movement that is so far removed from the Gospels (cough cough, Matthew 25) that they are utterly disgusted.

And I find it sad.  Because they are losing that anchor and community in their lives -- the good things that church can provide -- as well.

In the end, the collapse of the community of church is a symptom of the underlying illness that is the very subject of this thread.  It's all about self, zero about community/empathy.

There are all sorts of churches.  Find one that fits. Today there are a lot more that fit your politics and beliefs than there were 30 or 50 years ago.

 

[Brisketexan 104226]

7 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

There are all sorts of churches.  Find one that fits. Today there are a lot more that fit your politics and beliefs than there were 30 or 50 years ago.

 

Sure there are.  Like I said, our particular denomination (well, at least our congregation) is pretty focused on the loving part of the Gospels, not the judging part of the Gospels (of course, those branches of denominations are also being attacked in schisms, being tossed out as "apostate" (because they don't hate the gayz enough to satisfy the dogmatists), etc.).  But the thing is, even to the extent that these churches exist, love and kindness happen behind the scenes, in day-to-day work.  Damned near invisible.  Cruelty, hate, and division?  Those happen in neon lights, right in front of the media, on the floor of the legislatures, etc. etc.  And they cause real harm, and real pain, to people my children and I love and care about.

You can argue against it, but the cause-and-effect is clear as day.  I'm not pointing out a novel observation here.  There have been alarm bells ringing on this front for a generation.  Now, those chickens are coming home to roost.  

[Guest]

Lots of good points on the impact of social media and iPhones on isolation, but the problem started before either of these were common.  There was a fairly well known study done in the 90s that was published in an article called “bowling alone” that documented the decline in organized social groups of all types, including bowling leagues, bridge/pinnacle clubs, church activities, etc.  I think it’s definitely the case that phones and social media has made the problem worse, but it started before social media and smart phones were widespread.   
 

Human relationships are messy.  People let you down and often believe crazy things. If you want a big social network you need to have a high tolerance for the dumb things we all do.  

Edited September 19, 2023 by axiom of foundation

[David Dennison 18485]

There are all sorts of churches.  Find one that fits. Today there are a lot more that fit your politics and beliefs than there were 30 or 50 years ago.
 

What do you suggest for the growing number of non-believers?

[Brisketexan 104226]

Just now, David Dennison said:

What do you suggest for the growing number of non-believers?

 

Who cares?  They are evil anti-americans who are going to hell.

That's the message of vocal American Christianity.  There's no room for love of your fellow man who happens to be a non-believer.  Nope.  He's an evil heretic, to be fought against at every turn.

[Kennythetiger 9325]

58 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

This is a really good post.

I put my phone on the charger in another room when I get home from work and keep it there. 

Mine goes on a separate floor of the house. 

[Gatorubet 30023]

20 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

I disagree.  I think it is a lot.

Church provides a network of people who will care for you and check in on you.  In my experience, if you get sick or have a tragedy, there will be a organized group stepping in to care for you.  When you get married or have a child, there will be showers. You don't show up for a month, you will get a phone call. A loved one dies, you get checked in on and many will attend the funeral. A group of men I am friends with at church meet once a week in person for bible study and coffee.  The ladies do the same. We have a couple short zoom prayer meetings a week.  So needs are generally known.

While accurate, most of these aspects you mention also will be found in any cult, although the level of constant mandated and enforced community is often even more immersive than what you describe.   The issue in America is no longer that the organized church is not “perfect”.   The issue in America is that fundamentalist churches are now so completely toxic that participation in those churches have driven away any right thinking young people from their doors.  If a loss of community ensues because of people leaving those churches, even given the loss of community aspect, leaving is usually vastly beneficial to the individuals.  

 People are not turning away from Christianity because they don’t like Christianity and the principles behind it. They are turning away from Christianity in America because it has the devolved into something that does not remotely resemble the type of Golden Rule Christianity espoused in the New Testament.    We will have to agree to disagree on things.  Really, both of us are likely painting with too broad a brush. 

And if somewhere in there you were implying or advocating that a return of all those self-banishing people to the church would help eliminate the loneliness epidemic that is the topic of this thread, I would counter that being miserable in those churches - and encountering constant criticism and hate for beliefs that do not mess with those churches’ beliefs - is not a viable solution to the loneliness problem. 

[MissingInAction 24746]

24 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

There are all sorts of churches.  Find one that fits. Today there are a lot more that fit your politics and beliefs than there were 30 or 50 years ago.

 

How about basic humanity? 

[Degenerate Gardner 4075]

Quote

 

My children, RAISED in the organized church (and a denomination that is pretty far onto the "kind and welcoming" end of the spectrum), actively LOATHE organized religion in America.  Why?  Because it's fucking cruel to their friends and peers.  Because it is so focused on hurting and wounding.  Because "the cross" has been coopted as a political symbol by a movement that is so far removed from the Gospels (cough cough, Matthew 25) that they are utterly disgusted.

Very much the same for my kids. While they appreciate the value in caring church communities, both are too alienated by all the wolves in sheeps’ clothing to voluntarily attend church anymore. 

[Brisketexan 104226]

6 minutes ago, Degenerate Gardner said:

Very much the same for my kids. While they appreciate the value in caring church communities, both are too alienated by all the wolves in sheeps’ clothing to voluntarily attend church anymore. 

Which is really, really fucking sad.  Because I'll say this -- in terms of understanding the core truths of the Gospel and living it, my son is 10X the Christian I've ever been.  He just wants nothing to do with American "Christianity" because it has little to do with being a practicing Christian.

And because of that, he loses out on SO much natural, built-in community that has not been replaced in our society (and probably can't be replaced).  When we make our institutions -- natural building blocks of community - so toxic/dysfunctional as to drive people away, well then....we lose our sense of community.

We are a deeply wounded society.  Almost all of those wounds are self-inflicted, and it's a spiral of ever-increasing harm.

[G650 13843]

Idk, as someone who grew up with basically no church going family members except maybe one or two, and never encountered church going kids in school, I feel this is a wildly misplaced line of thought. And I'm referencing 40 years ago, so not some lately the world is going to hell because no one goes to church anymore bullshit. Going to church was always something people in like Kansas did in my mind as a youth.

[Frank Drebin 5616]

12 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

While accurate, most of these aspects you mention also will be found in any cult, although the level of constant mandated and enforced community is often even more immersive than what you describe.   The issue in America is no longer that the organized church is not “perfect”.   The issue in America is that fundamentalist churches are now so completely toxic that participation in those churches have driven away any right thinking young people from their doors.  If a loss of community ensues because of people leaving those churches, even given the loss of community aspect, leaving is usually vastly beneficial to the individuals.  

 People are not turning away from Christianity because they don’t like Christianity and the principles behind it. They are turning away from Christianity in America because it has the devolved into something that does not remotely resemble the type of Golden Rule Christianity espoused in the New Testament.    We will have to agree to disagree on things.  Really, both of us are likely painting with too broad a brush. 

And if somewhere in there you were implying or advocating that a return of all those self-banishing people to the church would help eliminate the loneliness epidemic that is the topic of this thread, I would counter that being miserable in those churches - and encountering constant criticism and hate for beliefs that do not mess with those churches’ beliefs - is not a viable solution to the loneliness problem. 

If a fundamentalist church is not for you or anyone else, there are all sorts of options.

And I am not just talking about Christian churches.  There are mosques, synagogues, and Sikh temples that offer that sort of community.

Again, from my view, American Christian churches have become way more tolerant and accepting the last 50 years.  So I guess I have difficulty understanding you and Brisket's position that American Christian churches are now more cruel than they used to be and are turning people off.

[Gatorubet 30023]

6 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Which is really, really fucking sad.  Because I'll say this -- in terms of understanding the core truths of the Gospel and living it, my son is 10X the Christian I've ever been.  He just wants nothing to do with American "Christianity" because it has little to do with being a practicing Christian.

And because of that, he loses out on SO much natural, built-in community that has not been replaced in our society (and probably can't be replaced).  When we make our institutions -- natural building blocks of community - so toxic/dysfunctional as to drive people away, well then....we lose our sense of community.

We are a deeply wounded society.  Almost all of those wounds are self-inflicted, and it's a spiral of ever-increasing harm.

Co-sign all of this.  This exactly tracks my family’s experience. My two sons were both youth elders on the Session, but as soon as they were old enough to draw a line in the sand and tell their mother they weren’t going to church anymore, no force on earth could make the return.    Our church was about as liberal and accepting as you could expect, but within that church were enough people who had big problems with gays that my gay son no longer wanted to risk even occasional unpleasant conversation and encounters.    And I think my younger son was more upset at this than my gay son. 

[Kennythetiger 9325]

1 minute ago, G650 said:

Going to church was always something people in like Kansas did in my mind as a youth.

When I was growing up my mom was Catholic and my dad was Lutheran. We’d hit one service Saturday night and the other one on Sunday morning. 

[AnimationTaco 35]

8 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Which is really, really fucking sad.  Because I'll say this -- in terms of understanding the core truths of the Gospel and living it, my son is 10X the Christian I've ever been.  He just wants nothing to do with American "Christianity" because it has little to do with being a practicing Christian.

And because of that, he loses out on SO much natural, built-in community that has not been replaced in our society (and probably can't be replaced).  When we make our institutions -- natural building blocks of community - so toxic/dysfunctional as to drive people away, well then....we lose our sense of community.

We are a deeply wounded society.  Almost all of those wounds are self-inflicted, and it's a spiral of ever-increasing harm.

What is interesting about your posts is that you are all in on the Grace and Love taught in the bible as God's word, but you don't seem to have the awe and wonder (fear) and respect for the truths commanded in it-- at least not in equal measure.

I'd recommend re-reading the John 8:10-11 to get a refresher on how the two should live in harmony (God's truth and will and commands for us along with his grace and mercy and love).

By the way, I'm not trying to personally attack you just making an observation, and the broader observation has been made by theological thought leaders that this phenomenon is an over-correction because the 80's and 90's were full of church's doing the opposite of enabling-- preaching almost wholly about how everyone is sinful and failing and hell fire and brimstone, etc.

But to Frank Derbin's point, there are church's out there for all walks of life and faith (or whatever people characterize it as). There are women preachers and gay preachers and people wearing pride flags and all kinds of things that you'd never see just 10 years ago in most big cities. Not making a comment on those institutions other than to observe they exist and probably connect lonely people.

[G650 13843]

3 minutes ago, Kennythetiger said:

When I was growing up my mom was Catholic and my dad was Lutheran. We’d hit one service Saturday night and the other one on Sunday morning. 

[Gatorubet 30023]

3 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

Again, from my view, American Christian churches have become way more tolerant and accepting the last 50 years.  So I guess I have difficulty understanding you and Brisket's position that American Christian churches are now more cruel than they used to be and are turning people off.

Look, I am not trying to insult you or get in a fight, but when I read this, when I pick my jaw off the floor, the only thing that goes through my mind is

 

I think you have fallen into a trap where you view your own very positive church (a place where you obviously feel comfortable and at home, and in a community of faith) as a typical exemplar of most modern churches in America. Most people see America’s fundamentalist evangelical churches as racing each other to the bottom of what might be considered toleration.   There is also a massive political component to this, but this is not the time or place for that discussion.

[AnimationTaco 35]

3 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

Look, I am not trying to insult you or get in a fight, but when I read this, when I pick my jaw off the floor, the only thing that goes through my mind is

 

I think you have fallen into a trap where you view your own very positive church (a place where you obviously feel comfortable and at home, and in a community of faith) as a typical exemplar of most modern churches in America. Most people see America’s fundamentalist evangelical churches as racing each other to the bottom of what might be considered toleration.   There is also a massive political component to this, but this is not the time or place for that discussion.

I think America has fallen into the trap that God, and by extension church, exists to conform and please whatever human desires and demands and not the other way around. People don't want to hear their desires and comforts and wants aren't righteous. So there are communities that exist for everyone and if your chief aim isn't a spiritual one, but a social connection, you can find plenty under the banner with the name "church".

 

[MissingInAction 24746]

11 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

Look, I am not trying to insult you or get in a fight, but when I read this, when I pick my jaw off the floor, the only thing that goes through my mind is

 

I think you have fallen into a trap where you view your own very positive church (a place where you obviously feel comfortable and at home, and in a community of faith) as a typical exemplar of most modern churches in America. Most people see America’s fundamentalist evangelical churches as racing each other to the bottom of what might be considered toleration.   There is also a massive political component to this, but this is not the time or place for that discussion.

*narrator* it would become plain to all that yes, he is indeed stupid. *narrator *

Edited September 19, 2023 by MissingInAction
Stupid is as it do

[royiv 9124]

12 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

Look, I am not trying to insult you or get in a fight, but when I read this, when I pick my jaw off the floor, the only thing that goes through my mind is

 

I think you have fallen into a trap where you view your own very positive church (a place where you obviously feel comfortable and at home, and in a community of faith) as a typical exemplar of most modern churches in America. Most people see America’s fundamentalist evangelical churches as racing each other to the bottom of what might be considered toleration.   There is also a massive political component to this, but this is not the time or place for that discussion.

He's someone who has posted disgusting, hateful things about marginalized members of our society on this board. I'm sure his church community is full of people who share his disgusting viewpoints. Take whatever he says with a gigantic grain of salt.

[Snake Diggity 4607]

11 minutes ago, AnimationTaco said:

I think America has fallen into the trap that God, and by extension church, exists to conform and please whatever human desires and demands and not the other way around. People don't want to hear their desires and comforts and wants aren't righteous. So there are communities that exist for everyone and if your chief aim isn't a spiritual one, but a social connection, you can find plenty under the banner with the name "church".

 

Did you ever think that the church you’re defending is just an “idealized version of yourself”?  Of course people who hate gays and browns and poors are gonna defend the hateful churches and tell people who stand up to them that they’re “disagreeing with god”.  

[ImissWallyPryor 9044]

I’m a bit of an introvert, but not really because I am quite talkative when I’m around other people. It’s just that I can go days without interacting with people and not suffer one bit.

I can walk away from Surly (no encouragement, assholes), texts, Twitter, etc., but I have a harder time ignoring my favorite podcasts. Texts are hard only because family members are always texting.  

My daughters, however, get down pretty easily when they don’t have direct, daily interpersonal contact. One daughter can’t go 2 or three hours without seeing or talking to someone. Texting or FaceTime aren’t enough for her. My daughter on the other extreme can be alone for a day or two, but what bothers her the most is knowing that her friends might be doing things without her  

Sometimes it’s hard for me to empathize, but I try.

[AnimationTaco 35]

1 minute ago, Snake Diggity said:

Did you ever think that the church you’re defending is just an “idealized version of yourself”?  Of course people who hate gays and browns and poors are gonna defend the hateful churches and tell people who stand up to them that they’re “disagreeing with god”.  

That's an interesting point, I know there are many, many things that I rationalize or justify that falls in the idealized version of myself and wanting to repent of sin. I think most people would agree, but it's the conviction that drives us to repent and work to do better that generally runs afoul of our more flesh-based desires that is the hard, spiritual work. Just saying you believe Jesus died on the cross for your sins and everything else will work out and my will be done, is functional atheism, IMO.

Further, I don't and don't personally know anyone who hates browns or poors or gays or whatever. I think the right posture is one of compassion and an extension of God's love and mercy with a reminder of what God has decreed and wants for us.

It's "Where are your accusers? Go and sin no more.", not "Where are your accusers? Go and do whatever you want because I am love and you can abuse my abudnant grace."

[Kennythetiger 9325]

5 minutes ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

I’m a bit of an introvert, but not really because I am quite talkative when I’m around other people. It’s just that I can go days without interacting with people and not suffer one bit.

I can walk away from Surly (no encouragement, assholes), texts, Twitter, etc., but I have a harder time ignoring my favorite podcasts. Texts are hard only because family members are always texting.  

My daughters, however, get down pretty easily when they don’t have direct, daily interpersonal contact. One daughter can’t go 2 or three hours without seeing or talking to someone. Texting or FaceTime aren’t enough for her. My daughter on the other extreme can be alone for a day or two, but what bothers her the most is knowing that her friends might be doing things without her  

Sometimes it’s hard for me to empathize, but I try.

I still think a lot about the kids who were college freshmen when Covid hit. That first year of college was the best year of my life, and those kids absolutely got fucked out of that experience. 

[G650 13843]

3 minutes ago, Kennythetiger said:

I still think a lot about the kids who were college freshmen when Covid hit. That first year of college was the best year of my life, and those kids absolutely got fucked out of that experience. 

 

Yeah, this is a tough one. I couldn't imagine.

[AnimationTaco 35]

3 minutes ago, Kennythetiger said:

I still think a lot about the kids who were college freshmen when Covid hit. That first year of college was the best year of my life, and those kids absolutely got fucked out of that experience. 

Same! I have friends whose kids were impacted, and those kids are starting to graduate this year and for sure next.

[MissingInAction 24746]

Can the preachers please GTFO of this thread?

Your kind is the problem. Now please fuck off and let the rest of us heal in a healthy manner.

[Guest]

Enough church talk. I want to hear more about Bear's gumbo.

[InkaUtexas 25289]

6 minutes ago, Kennythetiger said:

I still think a lot about the kids who were college freshmen when Covid hit. That first year of college was the best year of my life, and those kids absolutely got fucked out of that experience. 

Daughter lost both her senior year of HS and freshman year of college. Man that was rough on her. We set up a front year meet and greet system but could not change the loss of friendship. 

[wildcat09 29146]

Who else remembers on TOS when Johnny would brag about how moderate churches were dying off and more fundamentalist churches were experiencing the most growth in America? 

[David Dennison 18485]

1 hour ago, AnimationTaco said:

That's an interesting point, I know there are many, many things that I rationalize or justify that falls in the idealized version of myself and wanting to repent of sin. I think most people would agree, but it's the conviction that drives us to repent and work to do better that generally runs afoul of our more flesh-based desires that is the hard, spiritual work. Just saying you believe Jesus died on the cross for your sins and everything else will work out and my will be done, is functional atheism, IMO.

Further, I don't and don't personally know anyone who hates browns or poors or gays or whatever. I think the right posture is one of compassion and an extension of God's love and mercy with a reminder of what God has decreed and wants for us.

It's "Where are your accusers? Go and sin no more.", not "Where are your accusers? Go and do whatever you want because I am love and you can abuse my abudnant grace."

And if you choose not to believe in the supernatural?