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Posted
3 hours ago, UTEE97 said:

Quinn throwing in the Dolphins minicamp.

 

 

I'm seeing a lot of things I don't like in those clips of Quinn...

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Posted
11 hours ago, dcar00 said:

I'm seeing a lot of things I don't like in those clips of Quinn...

I’m struggling to take anything away from those clips. Just look like some basic drills. 

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Posted
Just now, Park Gothic said:

I’m struggling to take anything away from those clips. Just look like some basic drills. 

I mean just look at his jersey, it looks bunched up and his shoe lace loops are a little too long.

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Posted
49 minutes ago, Park Gothic said:

I’m struggling to take anything away from those clips. Just look like some basic drills. 

The fact that they only show a few of the receptions is an interesting choice.

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Posted
13 hours ago, dcar00 said:

I'm seeing a lot of things I don't like in those clips of Quinn...

The only knock I have in those basic drills is the throw at  around 1:12 mark where the receiver had to dive to catch the ball, so no YAC possibility. Without any defenders, the QB needs to throw the ball where the WR can catch it standing up.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, UTEE97 said:

The only knock I have in those basic drills is the throw at  around 1:12 mark where the receiver had to dive to catch the ball, so no YAC possibility. Without any defenders, the QB needs to throw the ball where the WR can catch it standing up.

Or the WR needs to run faster. 

Or, Ya know, it's like day 2.

Edited by Slacks
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Posted
9 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

holy moly this thread...

It is what happens when an ag uses AI to celebrate a dumpster fire with face-AIDS after eating day-old nachos that the cat crapped on.

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Posted

Probably been said before but Miami is an actually a great spot for Quinn. McDaniel is a good QB coach and Tua is made of glass. If they can approve his pocket awareness, he can probably have a pretty solid backup career.

Posted
4 minutes ago, LebongJames said:

Probably been said before but Miami is an actually a great spot for Quinn. McDaniel is a good QB coach and Tua is made of glass. If they can approve his pocket awareness, he can probably have a pretty solid backup career.

 

 

pocket awareness much like accuracy isn’t something that can be coached. But I definitely agree Miami is the perfect spot for him due to their offense style and having lowest depth of target in the nfl. 

Posted
47 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

 

 

pocket awareness much like accuracy isn’t something that can be coached. But I definitely agree Miami is the perfect spot for him due to their offense style and having lowest depth of target in the nfl. 

Yep. Every successful QB is just born accurate and aware, and there are no drills or coaching techniques for it and never were. Nailed it.

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Posted
2 hours ago, Slacks said:

Or the WR needs to run faster. 

Or, Ya know, it's like day 2.

I get what you're saying but not hitting the WRs in strides is one of the knocks on Quinn. As a 7th round pick, he is not going to get too many chances to prove himself, so every rep needs to be crisp.

Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, AnotherLawyer said:

Yep. Every successful QB is just born accurate and aware, and there are no drills or coaching techniques for it and never were. Nailed it.

That’s literally correct. Those are two things they have or don’t have.

 

 

you can try and coach it but reality is most QBs only marginally improve or don’t improve accuracy at all

 

IMG_6211.thumb.jpeg.92524f328b104ba615c6536bb2324290.jpeg

 

you can’t coach a 11 second 100m guy to be a 10 second 100m guy. It’s just traits and skills that people have. 

Edited by BurntOrange&White
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Posted
56 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

That’s literally correct. Those are two things they have or don’t have.

you can’t coach a 11 second 100m guy to be a 10 second 100m guy. It’s just traits and skills that people have. 

There are physical and mental ceilings for everyone. That's genetics. You have a 6'0" 25-year-old? You can't teach him to be 6'5". You have an 11-100 14-year-old? Who knows if coaching will improve him or not? Technique may shave off half a second. Physical maturity may shave off another half second. Or he may have reached his ceiling at 14.

Some kids' mental and physical abilities are synchronized at an early age. They get things right away. And some kids are physically capable and mentally capable, but aren't synchronized. They have to be taught. All Coach Leach is saying is that if someone isn't accurate in high school, he's probably not going to be accurate in college or the pros. He disagrees recruiting/drafting based on physical measurements alone. There are a lot of people who disagree with him.

Aside from that, there are dozens of drills for pocket awareness and there are examples all over college and the pros of kids who succeeded or failed to make the mental and physical connection. For some it just clicks at some point. It's called the "game slowing down." For others it never does.

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, AnotherLawyer said:

There are physical and mental ceilings for everyone. That's genetics. You have a 6'0" 25-year-old? You can't teach him to be 6'5". You have an 11-100 14-year-old? Who knows if coaching will improve him or not? Technique may shave off half a second. Physical maturity may shave off another half second. Or he may have reached his ceiling at 14.

Some kids' mental and physical abilities are synchronized at an early age. They get things right away. And some kids are physically capable and mentally capable, but aren't synchronized. They have to be taught. All Coach Leach is saying is that if someone isn't accurate in high school, he's probably not going to be accurate in college or the pros. He disagrees recruiting/drafting based on physical measurements alone. There are a lot of people who disagree with him.

Aside from that, there are dozens of drills for pocket awareness and there are examples all over college and the pros of kids who succeeded or failed to make the mental and physical connection. For some it just clicks at some point. It's called the "game slowing down." For others it never does.

 

Sorry you don’t know ball dude. Those are legit two things that are god given. There are coaches and scouts who think they can change that but it rarely ever happens, especially with accuracy. If you’re not very accurate in college with larger windows the chance of being more accurate in the pros with tighter windows is slim to none.
 

You think Johnny Manziel practiced his pocket awareness and he’s one of the best QBs with regards to that. Pocket awareness is a feel and you can’t coach a player to feel and mentally process that feeling to make the correct decision on when to roll, bail, or take off. 

Edited by BurntOrange&White
Posted
9 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

 

Sorry you don’t know ball dude. Those are legit two things that are god given. There are coaches and scouts who think they can change that but it rarely ever happens, especially with accuracy. If you’re not very accurate in college with larger windows the chance of being more accurate in the pros with tighter windows is slim to none.
 

You think Johnny Manziel practiced his pocket awareness and he’s one of the best QBs with regards to that. Pocket awareness is a feel and you can’t coach a player to feel and mentally process that feeling to make the correct decision on when to roll, bail, or take off. 

No? Josh Allen and Lamar Jackson are two *current* examples of how accuracy can be taught at the pro level. And every single NFL coach will tell you that pocket awareness can be taught. Will some be better than others? Of course. Can someone who has a different ceiling be taught to be as good as some natural talent like VY? No, but they sure as shit can be taught.

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, AnotherLawyer said:

No? Josh Allen and Lamar Jackson are two *current* examples of how accuracy can be taught at the pro level. And every single NFL coach will tell you that pocket awareness can be taught. Will some be better than others? Of course. Can someone who has a different ceiling be taught to be as good as some natural talent like VY? No, but they sure as shit can 

 

for every Josh Allen/Lamar Jackson there are a dozen Miltons, Richardson’s, Levis, Jamarcus Russels, etc. every nfl coach thinks they can teach those things. In reality they rarely do. These are legit god given things that can be honed in but the clay is the clay when sculpting. Nothing will change your mind because you’re looking at it as a negative towards Quinn from me but it’s not just a Quinn thing. 
 

you can coach your ass off on escape drills all you want but how a QB acts in live fire when pressure is bearing down is your true pocket awareness and when this happens Quinn shuts himself and self sacks. It’s a feel they have

Edited by BurntOrange&White
Posted
1 minute ago, BurntOrange&White said:

 

for every Josh Allen/Lamar Jackson there are a dozen Miltons, Richardson’s, Levis, Jamarcus Russels, etc. every nfl coach thinks they can teach those things. In reality they rarely do. These are legit god given things that can be honed in but the clay is the clay when sculpting. Nothing will change your mind because you’re looking at it as a negative towards Quinn from me but it’s not just a Quinn thing. 

Nope. I'm not talking about Quinn. But if we're talking reality, in reality, players rarely succeed in the NFL. For every one that succeeds there are literally dozens who get the chance and don't for some reason or another. Can it be taught? Yes, it can and I gave you two current examples. You want Ewers to fall into Leach's category of 'can't be taught' so badly that you'll ignore objective proof to the contrary.

Posted
Just now, AnotherLawyer said:

Nope. I'm not talking about Quinn. But if we're talking reality, in reality, players rarely succeed in the NFL. For every one that succeeds there are literally dozens who get the chance and don't for some reason or another. Can it be taught? Yes, it can and I gave you two current examples. You want Ewers to fall into Leach's category of 'can't be taught' so badly that you'll ignore objective proof to the contrary.

Oh so just Quinn allow me to tee off then. The fucking guy has had private QB coaching his entire life, trains with Mahommes private trainer as well, was coached by Sark, and coached by Riley Dodge in HS. He’s had the best coaching you can get to this point yet this bum shits himself in the pocket at the hint of perceived pressure. So yeah tell again how you can coach pocket awareness…..

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Posted (edited)

Jesus Christ, you are just the most miserable son of a bitch I've ever met. I honestly feel badly for you.

Edited by AnotherLawyer
But how about your same argument? Just because *Ewers* can't be taught doesn't mean it can't be taught.
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Posted
Just now, BurntOrange&White said:

Oh so just Quinn allow me to tee off then. The fucking guy has had private QB coaching his entire life, trains with Mahommes private trainer as well, was coached by Sark, and coached by Riley Dodge in HS. He’s had the best coaching you can get to this point yet this bum shits himself in the pocket at the hint of perceived pressure. So yeah tell again how you can coach pocket awareness…..

Xavier Worthy doesn't seem to have much issue tracking the ball from his new QB either... 

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Posted
Just now, AnotherLawyer said:

Jesus Christ, you are just the most miserable son of a bitch I've ever met. I honestly feel badly for you.

I don't think he is, I think people misunderstand a lot of the criticism in this thread because it's hard to balance it with the gratitude of what Quinn did bring. 

Without Quinn coming to Texas, Texas is not what it is today. It helped get shit right A LOT faster than it would have otherwise, whether he lived up to his full potential or not is what makes this thread so contentious.

He did not, and a lot of people think that is mostly his fault. 

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Posted
2 minutes ago, immamac said:

Xavier Worthy doesn't seem to have much issue tracking the ball from his new QB either... 

Cool. We talking about Ewers specifically or accuracy/pocket awareness generally? And is the standard of comparison how an 8th-year, All-Pro, MVP, Super Bowl winner throws? Because almost none of the QBs drafted in ever meet that standard.

Posted
2 hours ago, immamac said:

I don't think he is, I think people misunderstand a lot of the criticism in this thread because it's hard to balance it with the gratitude of what Quinn did bring. 

Without Quinn coming to Texas, Texas is not what it is today. It helped get shit right A LOT faster than it would have otherwise, whether he lived up to his full potential or not is what makes this thread so contentious.

He did not, and a lot of people think that is mostly his fault. 

I agree with half of this.

Posted
5 hours ago, BurntOrange&White said:

 

 

pocket awareness much like accuracy isn’t something that can be coached. But I definitely agree Miami is the perfect spot for him due to their offense style and having lowest depth of target in the nfl. 

 

2 hours ago, BurntOrange&White said:

 

for every Josh Allen/Lamar Jackson there are a dozen Miltons, Richardson’s, Levis, Jamarcus Russels, etc.

So the goal posts moved in 3 hours.   I am noticing a pattern.  And bringing up Jamarcus Russell is interesting, since he improved year over year in college from 50% to 67% but flamed out in the NFL as it seems he was no longer a casual user.

 

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Nivek said:

 

So the goal posts moved in 3 hours.   I am noticing a pattern.  And bringing up Jamarcus Russell is interesting, since he improved year over year in college from 50% to 67% but flamed out in the NFL as it seems he was no longer a casual user.

 

Because 2 guys have done something doesn’t make it the standard or rules. It’s a rare thing and I stand by what I said. Accuracy and pocket awareness is god given. 

Posted
2 hours ago, BurntOrange&White said:

Oh so just Quinn allow me to tee off then. The fucking guy has had private QB coaching his entire life, trains with Mahommes private trainer as well, was coached by Sark, and coached by Riley Dodge in HS. He’s had the best coaching you can get to this point yet this bum shits himself in the pocket at the hint of perceived pressure. So yeah tell again how you can coach pocket awareness…..

Arch Manning has had coaching from 3 HOF, QBs in his family alone. And yet he went 3/6 for 19 yards and a fumble against a college team!!!!   Do you understand how fucking stupid this statement is?

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Posted
1 minute ago, BurntOrange&White said:

Because 2 guys have done something doesn’t make it the standard or rules. It’s a rare thing and I stand by what I said. Accuracy and pocket awareness is god given. 

So you are absolutely sure there are only 2 guys that have improved in accuracy in the NFL and College?   Cause I mentioned JaMarcus Russell's college stats and there was a significant improvement there as well.  (Hint: that makes 3, and you brought him up!)

Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, Nivek said:

So you are absolutely sure there are only 2 guys that have improved in accuracy in the NFL and College?   Cause I mentioned JaMarcus Russell's college stats and there was a significant improvement there as well.  (Hint: that makes 3, and you brought him up!)

You do know accuracy isn't the same thing as completion percentage, right? Or are you just a dumb fucking retard?

Edited by BurntOrange&White
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Posted

"The Texas quarterback and former five-star recruit has displayed above-average accuracy to only the shorter levels of the field. Once Ewers starts throwing the ball over the middle, toward the boundaries, or deep down the field, his efficiency takes a steep hit.

It’s tough to watch Ewers try to drive a football toward the boundaries. He was on-target on just 46% of these looks, the lowest number I’ve ever charted to that level of the field. He’s also on-target on a sub-50% clip throwing the ball deep down the field as well. He was on-target on just 45% there as well. While he was a bit more accurate over the middle at 65%, this number is still a massive 5% below average historically.

Ewers has the worst accuracy and ball placement profile of any quarterback I have charted in the last three years and there is a real reason to wonder whether or not he actively held the Longhorns back from competing for a national title."

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Posted
3 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

"The Texas quarterback and former five-star recruit has displayed above-average accuracy to only the shorter levels of the field. Once Ewers starts throwing the ball over the middle, toward the boundaries, or deep down the field, his efficiency takes a steep hit.

It’s tough to watch Ewers try to drive a football toward the boundaries. He was on-target on just 46% of these looks, the lowest number I’ve ever charted to that level of the field. He’s also on-target on a sub-50% clip throwing the ball deep down the field as well. He was on-target on just 45% there as well. While he was a bit more accurate over the middle at 65%, this number is still a massive 5% below average historically.

Ewers has the worst accuracy and ball placement profile of any quarterback I have charted in the last three years and there is a real reason to wonder whether or not he actively held the Longhorns back from competing for a national title."

I don't have an explanation for it, but watching him go from a gunslinger with the generational arm who can make all the throws (and we saw some of this when he first got here), to "Well, he's pretty great at throwing the ball parallel to the line of scrimmage. Really puts it in the guy's hands who is standing about eight feet from him" was something to behold.

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Posted
You do know accuracy isn't the same thing as completion percentage, right? Or are you just a dumb fucking retard?

It’s not, but plenty of people want to argue it is. I feel like that was what Leach was talking about. I do think you can teach pocket awareness. I don’t think you can drastically improve accuracy. You can teach touch on a pass.
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Posted

 

8 hours ago, Steamboat1874 said:

No kidding.

I think tomorrow we might hear how Quinn failed to brush his teeth before practice.

Woe onto him that would sack the QB ... payback is a beotch.

                                                season 3 starz GIF by Ash vs Evil Dead

Posted
1 hour ago, Nivek said:

Arch Manning has had coaching from 3 HOF, QBs in his family alone. And yet he went 3/6 for 19 yards and a fumble against a college team!!!!   Do you understand how fucking stupid this statement is?

Do you understand that what you’re saying here is not what he is saying at all? Doesn’t seem so.

Posted
2 hours ago, Nivek said:

Arch Manning has had coaching from 3 HOF, QBs in his family alone. And yet he went 3/6 for 19 yards and a fumble against a college team!!!!   Do you understand how fucking stupid this statement is?


3 HOF, QBs”

1) Archie & Peyton are in the HOF, but who is the third family member?

Eli is not in the College Football HOF and…

•Eli was .500 as a starting QB in the NFL while never winning the league MVP, never being selected as an All-Pro, and never leading the league in passing.

2) Are we talking about Cooper? Because I am not even sure that he made the Isidore Newman School’s ring of honor  

 

2) I think that Arch has the potential to be one of the top college QBs in Texas over the next 20 months.

 

Posted
4 minutes ago, Napoleon said:


3 HOF, QBs”

1) Archie & Peyton are in the HOF, but who is the third family member?

Obviously Eli isn't in the NFL HOF . . . yet.  I think the majority opinion is that he will eventually make it.  He was only eligible just this year.

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Posted
You do know accuracy isn't the same thing as completion percentage, right? Or are you just a dumb fucking retard?

You certainly are a hateful person. I guess getting challenged on a discussion board was too much for you to handle. Which is evident by the ever changing standards. I’ll let you in on a professional secret. It is OK to be wrong, in fact it is good. Because this is how people learn if they have self-confidence.

And yes, completion percentage is an objective measure of a mix of accuracy and precision and is being used as a proxy here. It is a much more robust measure than, “Billy said so” or “Billy, Bobby, and Benny said so.” Parsing out accuracy and precision of in game performance would require much more analysis.

Or do you have a better statistical measure that is readily available?
Posted
Just now, Nivek said:


You certainly are a hateful person. I guess getting challenged on a discussion board was too much for you to handle. Which is evident by the ever changing standards. I’ll let you in on a professional secret. It is OK to be wrong, in fact it is good. Because this is how people learn if they have self-confidence.

And yes, completion percentage is an objective measure of a mix of accuracy and precision and is being used as a proxy here. It is a much more robust measure than, “Billy said so” or “Billy, Bobby, and Benny said so.” Parsing out accuracy and precision of in game performance would require much more analysis.

Or do you have a better statistical measure that is readily available?

I stood by my stance the entire time that accuracy and pocket awareness can’t be taught. Completion percentage can be easily gamed from near the LOS and check downs. It’s not a tell of accuracy. I posted numbers that support my theory that Quinn is not accurate from his on target rate. Sorry you’re wrong and complete moron for thinking completion percentage is accuracy 

Posted
14 hours ago, Napoleon said:


3 HOF, QBs”

1) Archie & Peyton are in the HOF, but who is the third family member?

Eli is not in the College Football HOF and…

•Eli was .500 as a starting QB in the NFL while never winning the league MVP, never being selected as an All-Pro, and never leading the league in passing.

2) Are we talking about Cooper? Because I am not even sure that he made the Isidore Newman School’s ring of honor  

 

2) I think that Arch has the potential to be one of the top college QBs in Texas over the next 20 months.

 

You are correct.  I was not precise in my language.

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Posted
2 hours ago, BurntOrange&White said:

I stood by my stance the entire time that accuracy and pocket awareness can’t be taught.

And I gave you two current examples demonstrating that it can. 

Posted
22 hours ago, BurntOrange&White said:

That’s literally correct. Those are two things they have or don’t have.

 

 

you can try and coach it but reality is most QBs only marginally improve or don’t improve accuracy at all

 

IMG_6211.thumb.jpeg.92524f328b104ba615c6536bb2324290.jpeg

 

you can’t coach a 11 second 100m guy to be a 10 second 100m guy. It’s just traits and skills that people have. 

Says two things are emphatically true…proceeds to provide support for only one of those two things.

Posted
25 minutes ago, Nope said:

Says two things are emphatically true…proceeds to provide support for only one of those two things.

Do I really need to show clips of Quinn pissing down his leg at the thought of pressure and all the sacks he caused on himself because he fucking sucks in the pocket? It’s quite obvious to see when a QB has no pocket presence or great. 

Posted
23 hours ago, AnotherLawyer said:

Yep. Every successful QB is just born accurate and aware, and there are no drills or coaching techniques for it and never were. Nailed it.

the speed of the sec had quinn totally flummoxed; there’s not a lot that mike mcdaniel can do to make quinn suddenly able to handle nfl speed, defenses, disguises, etc. you really can’t “coach up” a guy’s ability to be calm in the pocket while processing everything that an nfl qb has to process at warp speed. guys pretty much either have that or they don’t.

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