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NBA 2022-2023 Season Thread


Mitch Cumsteen

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2 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

??????

Damion Lillard signs $176M deal to eat every meal for the rest of his career at Romano's Macaroni Grill. also Damian Lillard: "i dont have much of an appetite for italian food."

this guy really gets on my nerves. "i don't want to chase titles, i'm not a ring chaser that's not me. also, i want this organization to give me all the money they have to spend on players. also, i want to play on a competitive team, because i don't really like not competing for titles."

jesus christ. score your empty buckets, swim in your scrooge mcduck style money room, and stfu. 

He also just arguably had the best individual season of his career in a pretty mediocre western conference, couldn't compete for the play-in, and have had people openly wondering if they're low key tanking all year.

Yeah, the Portland roster is trash, but you could surround the true superstars in the league with just about any 12 NBA players and at least expect to have a shot at the 10 seed. They were 27-31 with Dame. He's a small scorer in a league where everyone can score. He's had two great first round playoff series that culminated in walk off threes surrounded by a bunch of postseason clunkers. He is who he is at this point. No free agent All-Star is going to Portland to get swept in the 2nd round with him. Even if they had boat loads of money to spare, which they don't.

He chose loyalty (and a shit load of money that he wasn't going to get anywhere else) over trying to compete for rings. I have no issue with that whatsoever, but, as you say, shut the fuck up with your passive aggressive criticisms of the franchise's direction. You ain't LeBron.

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40 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

He also just arguably had the best individual season of his career in a pretty mediocre western conference, couldn't compete for the play-in, and have had people openly wondering if they're low key tanking all year.

Yeah, the Portland roster is trash, but you could surround the true superstars in the league with just about any 12 NBA players and at least expect to have a shot at the 10 seed. They were 27-31 with Dame. He's a small scorer in a league where everyone can score. He's had two great first round playoff series that culminated in walk off threes surrounded by a bunch of postseason clunkers. He is who he is at this point. No free agent All-Star is going to Portland to get swept in the 2nd round with him. Even if they had boat loads of money to spare, which they don't.

He chose loyalty (and a shit load of money that he wasn't going to get anywhere else) over trying to compete for rings. I have no issue with that whatsoever, but, as you say, shut the fuck up with your passive aggressive criticisms of the franchise's direction. You ain't LeBron.

I like what Dame has done, because I’d prefer guys stay with one franchise to the extent possible vs the Durant/Barkley/LeBron approach.

And fuck the suggestion that Dame, or any player, should taking a dollar less than the max. Their billionaire owner can go in the luxury tax if need be.
 

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I don’t think there’s any animosity between Brunson and Luka but I kind of chuckle at the thought of Luka missing the playoffs while Brunson is in the playoffs
 
Mark Cuban.  There’s enough data to show that teams seem to do better without kyrie and you decide to bring him in?
Kyrie wasn't the issue. I know he will be the convenient scapegoat they can point to this year but the Mavs front office isn't good and have no real vision. In fact, Dallas looked better with Kyrie out there when Luka didn't play. Luka already said they miss Brunson a lot. Luka just isn't a guy right now that is going to make his teammates better. He's Dame to me. Great individual player. Can score really well. Light up the stat sheet. Both have found their way to the WCF to get stomped by GSW. And being Dame isn't a knock. But Mavs fans have this inflated sense of what Luka is. I'm not sure who will work as his #2 because he demands so much of the ball at all times.

Sounds like Brunson dad wanted his son to get out of the Mavs organization and probably for good measure.
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3 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Kyrie wasn't the issue. I know he will be the convenient scapegoat they can point to this year but the Mavs front office isn't good and have no real vision. In fact, Dallas looked better with Kyrie out there when Luka didn't play. Luka already said they miss Brunson a lot. Luka just isn't a guy right now that is going to make his teammates better. He's Dame to me. Great individual player. Can score really well. Light up the stat sheet. Both have found their way to the WCF to get stomped by GSW. And being Dame isn't a knock. But Mavs fans have this inflated sense of what Luka is. I'm not sure who will work as his #2 because he demands so much of the ball at all times.

Sounds like Brunson dad wanted his son to get out of the Mavs organization and probably for good measure.

Basically if the mavs win it’s because if luka.   If they lose, it’s because of you. Luka is viewed as a top five talent and possible future of this league

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After last season and carrying the Mavs to the WCF and what he was able to do against the Suns, i viewed Luka as a top 5 player. He really hurt his stock this year and i don't view him that same way at the moment. One thing i am sure of is Kidd being bad at his job with Cuban not far behind him.

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Luka is 2nd in the NBA in usage.  I would HATE to play with a ball dominant perimeter player like that.  Yay! I get to stand around at the 2-point line and hope that he will drive and kick it out to me.  Brutal.  He is James Harden 2.0.  I hate watching this style and I hate playing it.

It is one thing if you have a very high usage center (see Embiid). That means the team is consciously getting the ball into the paint where you don't expect it to come back out.  Moreover, guys like Embiid and Giannis are playing at an All-Defense level on the other end of the court.

Westbrook gets a lot of shit for his usage, but he has only had two seasons higher than what Luka just threw down (which was the #8 all-time single season usage mark).

If you are a perimeter player with this kind of usage, you damn sure better be D'ing up like Kobe or Jordan on the other end or your team is going to hate you.

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33 minutes ago, HookEm said:

Luka is 2nd in the NBA in usage.  I would HATE to play with a ball dominant perimeter player like that.  Yay! I get to stand around at the 2-point line and hope that he will drive and kick it out to me.  Brutal.  He is James Harden 2.0.  I hate watching this style and I hate playing it.

It is one thing if you have a very high usage center (see Embiid). That means the team is consciously getting the ball into the paint where you don't expect it to come back out.  Moreover, guys like Embiid and Giannis are playing at an All-Defense level on the other end of the court.

Westbrook gets a lot of shit for his usage, but he has only had two seasons higher than what Luka just threw down (which was the #8 all-time single season usage mark).

If you are a perimeter player with this kind of usage, you damn sure better be D'ing up like Kobe or Jordan on the other end or your team is going to hate you.

Basically “I’ll hold the ball for 20 seconds if I can’t find a shot I’ll pass it to you.  Hey you may try making it every once in a while!”

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2 hours ago, Reynolds Woodcock said:

I like what Dame has done, because I’d prefer guys stay with one franchise to the extent possible vs the Durant/Barkley/LeBron approach.

And fuck the suggestion that Dame, or any player, should taking a dollar less than the max. Their billionaire owner can go in the luxury tax if need be.
 

I get what you're saying but the CBA is set up to protect the owners (essentially from themselves) and the new CBA is even more punitive towards higher taxpayers with new handicaps on player movement/acquisition. If a player wants to take the supermax, he damn well better know what he's truly signing up for -- and that's kneecapping his chance for a ring. It shouldn't be like that but it cuts both ways. The players didn't have to accept the CBA. They could have held out for a different cap structure that made it easier to build teams around winning, but they wanted to max their earning potential. 

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So did they have to suspend him because league rules mandate a one game suspension for throwing a punch or was it a team decision?  It would have made it even better if the league suspended guys for coming off the bench during the fight.

Also, anybody remember when I called out Gobert over the summer for being a bad teammate and @MNLonghornFUKM told me it was all Donovan Mitchell's fault because he didn't play any defense and that Joe Ingles thought Rudy was a swell guy? I like to think back on those days as the summer of "You're goddamn right I told you so."

My favorite thing about the whole thing --- and believe me, there are layers upon layers of hilarity and incredulity --- is that right after he throws the punch he backpedals the fuck out of there and almost backs over a ballboy. Rudy was having none of it. Kyle Anderson is right. He's definitely a bitch.

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5 hours ago, tx 3 putt said:

These nba play in games are dumber than dumb 

...except this year when, instead of being the 8 seed and getting swept out of the first round, Minny can lose to LAL and NO and not make the playoffs at all. Much funnier. 

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52 minutes ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

 

My favorite thing about the whole thing --- and believe me, there are layers upon layers of hilarity and incredulity --- is that right after he throws the punch he backpedals the fuck out of there and almost backs over a ballboy. Rudy was having none of it. Kyle Anderson is right. He's definitely a bitch.

Give a little respect to one of the all-time fake tough guys.  That move is referred to as pulling a Kevin Garnett.

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8 hours ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

I get what you're saying but the CBA is set up to protect the owners (essentially from themselves) and the new CBA is even more punitive towards higher taxpayers with new handicaps on player movement/acquisition. If a player wants to take the supermax, he damn well better know what he's truly signing up for -- and that's kneecapping his chance for a ring. It shouldn't be like that but it cuts both ways. The players didn't have to accept the CBA. They could have held out for a different cap structure that made it easier to build teams around winning, but they wanted to max their earning potential. 

Billionaires that sell their franchises for about five times more than they bought it after like 30 years of ownership certainly do a good job at painting players as the bad guys.  Props to them.

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21 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

 

At this point--and just like last year--they're doing Zion a disservice meeting the conversation going. They're not bringing him back after 5 months of for a crucial Game 4 against the Nuggets. Stop it. Announce that he's out for the year and be done with it.

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52 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

At this point--and just like last year--they're doing Zion a disservice meeting the conversation going. They're not bringing him back after 5 months of for a crucial Game 4 against the Nuggets. Stop it. Announce that he's out for the year and be done with it.

They're doing Zion anything.  He has minor injuries that somehow keep him out for months, if not the season.  

They committed a significant portion of their future to him.  They shouldn't have.  I know it's a hot take but I'd have let him walk.  He's just not playable.  

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7 hours ago, ztejas said:

Um. No.

 

7 hours ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

Screenshot_20230410_221916_Chrome.thumb.jpg.6d00fb6a2a9d9bc50b0b4cffc6864666.jpg

 

7 hours ago, Aqua Buddha said:

They're doing Zion anything.  He has minor injuries that somehow keep him out for months, if not the season.  

They committed a significant portion of their future to him.  They shouldn't have.  I know it's a hot take but I'd have let him walk.  He's just not playable.  

 

7 hours ago, Aqua Buddha said:

And that was at a somewhat reduced price because there weren't many other takers due to injury concerns.  Pelicans should have let him walk.  That sounds like a hot take but he's just not playable and he's only 22.

Ah, I forgot that he signed that. For some reason I thought he was still on his rookie contract. That’s a ton of $$ for someone who misses so many games.

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1 hour ago, PittsburghTiger said:

 

 

 

Ah, I forgot that he signed that. For some reason I thought he was still on his rookie contract. That’s a ton of $$ for someone who misses so many games.

I didn't realize it but that big contract hasn't even kicked in yet.  This is the last year on his rookie deal.  Next season starts the 5 year/$194M deal.

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/new-orleans-pelicans/zion-williamson-31558/

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3 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

I didn't realize it but that big contract hasn't even kicked in yet.  This is the last year on his rookie deal.  Next season starts the 5 year/$194M deal.

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/new-orleans-pelicans/zion-williamson-31558/

Ah, so I was correct, to an extent. Although, it doesn’t change the fact that it is an insane contract for a guy who is always hurt.

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14 minutes ago, PittsburghTiger said:

Ah, so I was correct, to an extent. Although, it doesn’t change the fact that it is an insane contract for a guy who is always hurt.

But it was a gamble.  If they let him go elsewhere and he stops getting hurt they would be remembered as the team that gave up on a superstar.  I see both sides.

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1 hour ago, huge said:

But it was a gamble.  If they let him go elsewhere and he stops getting hurt they would be remembered as the team that gave up on a superstar.  I see both sides.

Yeah, they had to do it, especially being a team/market that has always had trouble keeping people.  It’s one team that I could see moving but if Zion stays and stars, they could stay.

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Hawks open to considering a Trae Young trade.  Really is a parallel career to Luka at this point:

According to The Ringer's Kevin O'Connor: "[The] Hawks' front office has the green light from ownership to do whatever it wants to with the roster, which includes considering trade opportunities involving All-Star point guard Trae Young."

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/trae-young-trade-rumors-hawks-front-office-has-green-light-to-consider-moving-all-star-guard/

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29 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

Hawks open to considering a Trae Young trade.  Really is a parallel career to Luka at this point:

According to The Ringer's Kevin O'Connor: "[The] Hawks' front office has the green light from ownership to do whatever it wants to with the roster, which includes considering trade opportunities involving All-Star point guard Trae Young."

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/trae-young-trade-rumors-hawks-front-office-has-green-light-to-consider-moving-all-star-guard/

I dunno maybe the Hawks shouldn't have traded 3 future firsts (2025, 2026, 2027) to the Spurs for Murray.

The Gobert debacle took a lot of attention away from this disastrous Hawks trade (43 wins and 8 seed last year, 41 wins and 8 seed this year).  

Probably a stupid question here, but if a team isn't going to get any better, why bother trading multiple future firsts for someone?

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On 4/10/2023 at 8:46 AM, aggie08 said:

He also just arguably had the best individual season of his career in a pretty mediocre western conference, couldn't compete for the play-in, and have had people openly wondering if they're low key tanking all year.

Yeah, the Portland roster is trash, but you could surround the true superstars in the league with just about any 12 NBA players and at least expect to have a shot at the 10 seed. They were 27-31 with Dame. He's a small scorer in a league where everyone can score. He's had two great first round playoff series that culminated in walk off threes surrounded by a bunch of postseason clunkers. He is who he is at this point. No free agent All-Star is going to Portland to get swept in the 2nd round with him. Even if they had boat loads of money to spare, which they don't.

He chose loyalty (and a shit load of money that he wasn't going to get anywhere else) over trying to compete for rings. I have no issue with that whatsoever, but, as you say, shut the fuck up with your passive aggressive criticisms of the franchise's direction. You ain't LeBron.

This is where I think Harden got zero appreciation from people on here and others in the Bill Simmons mafia.  Did he ever win it all? No.  But, I saw him win a shitload of games, mostly with crummy surrounding casts, and never miss the playoffs and never win less than 45 games. All while guys like AD couldn't carry shitty Pelicans teams to the playoffs- where we've seen guys like Dame also fail to ever get to that level except when things line up for him.  Showed up every day, put up points, beat the bad teams, beat enough of the good teams to be a mid tier playoff contender.  Hell- even Russ I guess got his team to a 6 seed and 43 wins in his MVP season. Dame (or AD at the Pels, or Luka this year) should be proof that you have to be pretty damn elite to make that happen and be an eco system all unto yourself- and Dame isn't that guy but gets paid like he is and talked about like he is, b/c of his 2 series winning walkoff shots I guess.  But that's more trivia than heroics to me.  
It's not just Harden when he was in his prime- it's guys like Barkley, Lebron, Hakeem, Dirk who you just know- you have that guy and that guy alone and you can pencil a team into the playoffs and figure they are winning at least 45 games, and if you surround them with anyone decent they will win 55 games and be a title contender.  Dame isn't likely even to be the second best player on a title team imo. He's a 3rd banana and you better protect him.  

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Who the fuck is going to trade for Trae Young and what are they going to give up for him? He's got a huge cap number. He's gotten two coaches and a GM fired. He's not a winner. He's a shitty teammate/leader. He plays no defense and doesn't appear to have any interest in ever doing so. And he possesses the most punchable face in the NBA since Danny Ainge.

I think it's pretty obvious that he can't be your number 1 on anything resembling a contending team and his usage rate is so high that he probably can't function in any other role. The calories don't get any emptier than this dude. Nobody is taking that on. It's not like the Hawks haven't put some good pieces around him. Their roster is way better than what Dallas has managed to cobble together over the same time frame. 

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37 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

This is where I think Harden got zero appreciation from people on here and others in the Bill Simmons mafia.  Did he ever win it all? No.  But, I saw him win a shitload of games, mostly with crummy surrounding casts, and never miss the playoffs and never win less than 45 games. All while guys like AD couldn't carry shitty Pelicans teams to the playoffs- where we've seen guys like Dame also fail to ever get to that level except when things line up for him.  Showed up every day, put up points, beat the bad teams, beat enough of the good teams to be a mid tier playoff contender.  Hell- even Russ I guess got his team to a 6 seed and 43 wins in his MVP season. Dame (or AD at the Pels, or Luka this year) should be proof that you have to be pretty damn elite to make that happen and be an eco system all unto yourself- and Dame isn't that guy but gets paid like he is and talked about like he is, b/c of his 2 series winning walkoff shots I guess.  But that's more trivia than heroics to me.  
It's not just Harden when he was in his prime- it's guys like Barkley, Lebron, Hakeem, Dirk who you just know- you have that guy and that guy alone and you can pencil a team into the playoffs and figure they are winning at least 45 games, and if you surround them with anyone decent they will win 55 games and be a title contender.  Dame isn't likely even to be the second best player on a title team imo. He's a 3rd banana and you better protect him.  

I will be forever grateful to Harden for giving me one of my favorite Manu memories

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38 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Dame isn't likely even to be the second best player on a title team imo. He's a 3rd banana and you better protect him.  

You lost me here. Dame would be the 2nd best player on the majority of teams that have won the title. He'd be the best player on quite a few. 

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3 minutes ago, ztejas said:

You lost me here. Dame would be the 2nd best player on the majority of teams that have won the title. He'd be the best player on quite a few. 

I don't know man- he isn't in front of Steph and Durant. He isn't in front of Lebron or Kyrie.  Or Lebron or AD. Or Steph and Klay (defense is half the game still- right?)  So that leaves him as the second best player behind the Nephew on one of the last 10 or so title teams, right?  And that nephew squad shouldn't/wouldn't have won a title except for massive injuries to the dubs in the finals- they were kind of an accidental champ.  
I can't think of a team in my entire lifetime that won a title that Dame would be the best player on.  I'm a man- I'm 44.  Maybe that ensemble Pistons 03 team that was just weird as fuck.  But none of the Lakers or Spurs teams when they kept trading titles. Definitely not better than Jordan or Hakeem.  Not better than Magic or bird. Not better than Dirk. I'm going to need to see your work here. I think any team built around Dame is destined to be a loser. He's a poor man's CP3 (that's no insult- CP3 is awesome) and CP3 proved to have a second round ceiling.  Which would be Dame's except for their luck induced run to the west finals that 1 year where they then got blown out 4-0 by an injured Warriors team if I recall correctly (might have been a gentleman's sweep but I thought it was the real deal kind of sweep). 

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31 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

I don't know man- he isn't in front of Steph and Durant. He isn't in front of Lebron or Kyrie.  Or Lebron or AD. Or Steph and Klay (defense is half the game still- right?)  So that leaves him as the second best player behind the Nephew on one of the last 10 or so title teams, right?  And that nephew squad shouldn't/wouldn't have won a title except for massive injuries to the dubs in the finals- they were kind of an accidental champ.  
I can't think of a team in my entire lifetime that won a title that Dame would be the best player on.  I'm a man- I'm 44.  Maybe that ensemble Pistons 03 team that was just weird as fuck.  But none of the Lakers or Spurs teams when they kept trading titles. Definitely not better than Jordan or Hakeem.  Not better than Magic or bird. Not better than Dirk. I'm going to need to see your work here. I think any team built around Dame is destined to be a loser. He's a poor man's CP3 (that's no insult- CP3 is awesome) and CP3 proved to have a second round ceiling.  Which would be Dame's except for their luck induced run to the west finals that 1 year where they then got blown out 4-0 by an injured Warriors team if I recall correctly (might have been a gentleman's sweep but I thought it was the real deal kind of sweep). 

Dame has 6 all NBA selections - including a first team nod and 4 second teams. He hasn't been great in the playoffs but he also hasn't been on very good teams. Portland made the playoffs 8 straight years starting with his 2nd season in the league and won 4 playoff series. Last season he played 29 games and this season Portland was 27-31 when he played, and he had whatever the fuck this was as a supporting cast:

Screenshot_20230411_142811_Chrome.thumb.jpg.8f148d0cd29e30a25d50aaa738b131e6.jpg

This year's version of Dame would have easily been the 2nd best player on the Ws last season and the Bucks the season before that. Same with the Raptors in '19. Maybe Kyrie in '16 is a push. He was probably closer to Steph in '15 than he was to Klay or Dray. '11 Mavs is no contest. '08 Celtics he's easily one of their best 2 players.

I mean we can keep going. On paper he would have been the best player on the '14 Spurs or '04 Pistons - but I'm not sure those teams still win the title if you start messing with the chemistry and defense - so feel free to evaluate as you see fit. 

Dame runs his mouth a lot and wants to have his cake and eat it, too, but he's still one of the best players of the past 10 seasons. 

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