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The 01-06-21 Select Committee Thread


Satchel

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9 minutes ago, Underdog said:

What kind of trouble could one get into if one were to email that court and call them fucksticks?  Asking for a friend. 

Not wise.  This is the DC Circuit, more or less "liberal" and very attuned to governmental issues.  It's a great court to have this in front of.

Any court in the country would have issued that order because of the cat out of the bag problem.

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The reference to Garland is or should be a criminal contempt prosecution referral.  But the Committee has to vote that out first.  No further evidence necessary.

An interesting thing on the criminal contempt is that I think it can be avoided by appearing, answering what you can and using the executive privilege, to the extent it still exists, only on those questions or issues that are reasonably covered by it.

Jeffery Clark, the Big Lie Deputy AG did that and has avoided such a referral, as have other cooperators.  At least so far.

The statute requires willful noncompliance, and stonewalling is a sure way to get there.  Being cooperative while ultimately not giving up the ghost as long as the privilege remains viable seems a good way to avoid a conviction.

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32 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

The reference to Garland is or should be a criminal contempt prosecution referral.  But the Committee has to vote that out first.  No further evidence necessary.

An interesting thing on the criminal contempt is that I think it can be avoided by appearing, answering what you can and using the executive privilege, to the extent it still exists, only on those questions or issues that are reasonably covered by it.

Jeffery Clark, the Big Lie Deputy AG did that and has avoided such a referral, as have other cooperators.  At least so far.

The statute requires willful noncompliance, and stonewalling is a sure way to get there.  Being cooperative while ultimately not giving up the ghost as long as the privilege remains viable seems a good way to avoid a conviction.

I understand the process.  However, he has Bannon to still deal with, and so far, not a damned thing has happened.  We know TFG wants to draw this out hoping the GQP takes the House in the Mid-Terms and shuts this down.  

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1 hour ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

I understand the process.  However, he has Bannon to still deal with, and so far, not a damned thing has happened.  We know TFG wants to draw this out hoping the GQP takes the House in the Mid-Terms and shuts this down.  

Well, first of all, it's not Merrick Garland, it's the US Attorney for the District of DC, Matthew Graves.  Garland can yay or nay, tell him to hurry up or slow down, but ultimately it will be Graves and his minions that bring the charges and prosecute them.

I see some reference to using grand juries on these, which is kind of absurd because it's a misdemeanor, so there's no constitutional need.  Someone can just draft up a criminal complaint or information and file it.

But, you need to realize that the criminal contempt proceeding is not directly designed to coerce testimony.  It may pressure the witness to do so, but it's only a trial and sentencing process.

I honestly don't think these witnesses are that important.  They'll just lie, anyway.  The documents will tell the tale, as well as other witnesses with no privileges, even bullshit ones.

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8 hours ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

really? you think the VP shirking the SS and saying he'll get an uber bc he feels safer is not eyebrow raising? am I reading your post wrong?

I think it shows Pence has two brain cells to rub together.  It doesn't mean the SS is compromised, but he wasn't fucking around to find out.

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12 minutes ago, 4th&Five said:

Karl: "They were saying 'hang Mike Pence.'"

Trump: "Because it's common sense, Jon. It's common sense that you're supposed to protect.

Well, I hope he keeps giving interviews like this that are recorded.  We might get a Colonel Jessup moment yet.

A Few Good Men You Cant Handle The Truth GIF by SundanceTV

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14 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Not wise.  This is the DC Circuit, more or less "liberal" and very attuned to governmental issues.  It's a great court to have this in front of.

Any court in the country would have issued that order because of the cat out of the bag problem.

My friend was joking… 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

sort of. 

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5 minutes ago, Underdog said:

My friend was joking… 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

sort of. 

Just explaining that this was an inevitability, I think.  No matter how shitty your argument, most courts are going to give you a brief opportunity to make it before you effectively lose.

I am pretty confident, too, that the DC Circuit will "fix" any "defects" in the district court's reasoning and get it primed for Supreme Court review.

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3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Just explaining that this was an inevitability, I think.  No matter how shitty your argument, most courts are going to give you a brief opportunity to make it before you effectively lose.

I am pretty confident, too, that the DC Circuit will "fix" any "defects" in the district court's reasoning and get it primed for Supreme Court review.

So, theoretically, could this be appealed up to the SC?  

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9 minutes ago, Macanudo said:

Yes.   And no matter how sound the request is, don't count on them to uphold the law.

Well, I am fairly confident that the Supremes will hold against Trump.  The strongest argument for executive privilege is to maintain separation of powers, between the executive and legislative branches.  Well, Biden is the executive and Trump is nobody.  All he has is the idea that his shit should be confidential, just because, and on the idea that the executive needs some confidentiality in order to permit unfettered discussion and deliberation, to protect the office and executive officers.  That type of confidentiality has always been qualified, and yields to a greater need.  First, I think this is clearly a greater need, and second, Biden gets to make the call on that, period.  Finally, this whole mess is pretty clearly unrelated to any legitimate government function, so even if you held a former president to have some residual privilege claim, this would be extraordinarily weak.

The problem is that the Supremes will probably again enjoin the disclosure pending the argument, and, even on an expedited basis, the Supreme Court is relatively slow, months instead of weeks.

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Why would you be confident?  Rule of law and common sense have gone the way of the dodo and UT football 10 win seasons. What’s the worst possible outcome for this particular situation?  Cool, that’s what I would put my money on to actually happen.
 

At the very least the SC will muddy the waters, at worst they will serve as a last line of defense for Trump’s autocratic/rules don’t and won’t apply to me even when I’m not president horseshit. 

yes I am a pessimist to the nth degree, but I’m just following along with the story at this point. 

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2 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Yeah, SCOTUS won't rule for Trump on the merits, they'll jut handle it in a way that continues to delay the release of anything important.

Still, the Mazars case, for example, went from filing in the district court to Supreme Court ruling in 15 months.  And it had a less procedural basis for expeditious resolution than this.  Six months of that time was spent in the DC Circuit.  I think this is going to go quite a bit faster.

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4 minutes ago, hookemATL said:

Why would you be confident?  Rule of law and common sense have gone the way of the dodo and UT football 10 win seasons. What’s the worst possible outcome for this particular situation?  Cool, that’s what I would put my money on to actually happen.
 

At the very least the SC will muddy the waters, at worst they will serve as a last line of defense for Trump’s autocratic/rules don’t and won’t apply to me even when I’m not president horseshit. 

yes I am a pessimist to the nth degree, but I’m just following along with the story at this point. 

I'm not really confident in a good decision from SCOTUS. I'm just confident in a decision that John Roberts can sell to idiot centrists as a sort of reasonable middle ground, which will be that an ex-President no longer has executive privilege but that there are 139423232 procedural issues the lower courts will need to resolve before anything can be released.

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4 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

I'm not really confident in a good decision from SCOTUS. I'm just confident in a decision that John Roberts can sell to idiot centrists as a sort of reasonable middle ground, which will be that an ex-President no longer has executive privilege but that there are 139423232 procedural issues the lower courts will need to resolve before anything can be released.

One of the btilliant things about this is that there's no "burden."  Unlike the subpoena cases, there's no real consideration of personal burden to Trump in responding, or the scope of the subpoena that gets tied up in that kind of litigation on remand in the trial court.  And, in the "subpoena" cases, the trial courts cut right through that shit with quickness.

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10 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

One of the btilliant things about this is that there's no "burden."  Unlike the subpoena cases, there's no real consideration of personal burden to Trump in responding, or the scope of the subpoena that gets tied up in that kind of litigation on remand in the trial court.  And, in the "subpoena" cases, the trial courts cut right through that shit with quickness.

Oh I'm sure 5 of the conservatives on SCOTUS can imagine a burden if they try hard enough.

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20 hours ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

really? you think the VP shirking the SS and saying he'll get an uber bc he feels safer is not eyebrow raising? am I reading your post wrong?

I took his refusal not to mean he would find his own way home, but more him saying he wasn't planning on leaving, because he had a duty to count the votes.  It's the most ethical thing he's ever done.

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It will be such a shock when the GOP swings back into power in Congress and immediately starts to investigate Biden and his administration, completely ignoring any semblance of executive privilege. And they will do so with a straight face, and the fucking rubes will scream in agreement that Biden must be investigated to the fullest extent for crimes against the constitution, and their holy majesty, Donald Trump. Nobody will be surprised. We'll just all shrug our shoulders and say "jeez, the simulation is really cooking now!" This country is proper fucked. 

 

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25 minutes ago, Blotto said:

It will be such a shock when the GOP swings back into power in Congress and immediately starts to investigate Biden and his administration, completely ignoring any semblance of executive privelege. And they will do so with a straight face, and the fucking rubes will scream in agreement that Biden must be investigated to the fullest extent for crimes against the constitution, and their holy majesty, Donald Trump. Nobody will be surprised. We'll just all shrug our shoulders and say "jeez, the simulation is really cooking now!" This country is proper fucked. 

 

Bookmark this post. This will be 100% true. Every word. 

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Yep, that was my remark yesterday--GOP will take House/Senate in 2022 and all will then delay and obstruct until 2024 per the Roy Cohn tactic and then the fascist/nationalist takeover will be complete. Once the decision was made to go all in, they haven't stopped the train and they intend to see it through.

It's a shame that the twilight of democracy is not the raging, the anger at what might have been and could be but a soft exhalation as the last bit of light is absorbed by the darkness on the horizon.

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38 minutes ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

Yep, that was my remark yesterday--GOP will take House/Senate in 2022 and all will then delay and obstruct until 2024 per the Roy Cohn tactic and then the fascist/nationalist takeover will be complete. Once the decision was made to go all in, they haven't stopped the train and they intend to see it through.

It's a shame that the twilight of democracy is not the raging, the anger at what might have been and could be but a soft exhalation as the last bit of light is absorbed by the darkness on the horizon.

But hey at least your 401k amirite

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28 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

AG.  Which is kind of even worse, since he's the top legal person in the state.

The Paxton deal has been an unusual series of fuckups that are kind of unique to state criminal prosecution.  As a Collin County lawyer and politician, he was able to recuse the Collin County judges and DA from his prosecution.  A special judge and prosecutors from Fort Worth and Houston were appointed.  There have been all sorts of shenanigans related to that.

This is the feds.  It's still going to take some time.  And it's only a misdemeanor.

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Dan Patrick is the kind of "man" that genuinely gets upset that he can't use words like retarded, fag, or coloreds in public.  And thinks it's unfair that "the woke mob" is changing the rules of language.

But without any sense of irony, the man looks and dresses like what happens if Tommy Hilfiger went on an absinthe bender and created a line of clothes for the closeted gay man who still wanted his beard wife to look upon his "rugged masculinity" with a certain public-facing zeal.  

 

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28 minutes ago, hookemATL said:

Bring back David Dewhurst, or as I know him, the Quaalude Vampire. 

I’m gonna take some ludes and fucking end this nightmare (not really). Why do we suck at every goddam sport?

I actually have a theory, but too drunk to type it out right now. Essentially big cities are fucked from a college sports perspective going forward. 

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