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Brothahorn

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I get all that, I really do, but that doesn't mean you have to vote for Republican politicians who are even more cynical than Democrats.

Only leftist idiots want to really "abolish the police," but Republicans want you to believe those idiots are more numerous than they are. Sensible people on the left just want to change the way policing is conducted.  

And, yes, Democrats have played Black folks for far too long. Democrats defy y'all to vote for them -- or else --  because the other alternative is even worse. Neither party really cares about the poor (of any color) except as a political football and that's what really has to change. 

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3 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

I get all that, I really do, but that doesn't mean you have to vote for Republican politicians who are even more cynical than Democrats.

Only leftist idiots want to really "abolish the police," but Republicans want you to believe those idiots are more numerous than they are. Sensible people on the left just want to change the way policing is conducted.  

And, yes, Democrats have played Black folks for far too long. Democrats defy y'all to vote for them -- or else --  because the other alternative is even worse. Neither party really cares about the poor (of any color) except as a political football and that's what really has to change. 

Not saying anyone has to vote republican. All I'm saying is get your vote's worth, regardless of party. Make the candidate/party earn your vote. 

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1 minute ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

Absolutely. Neither party does much for me these days and I think most people feel the same. 

 

 

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Yeah, I understand. My second time to vote in Oregon was over the governor. Kate hasn't done anything to help schools, but Knute seemed to get at what I think is the root problem, the unions protecting the teachers. Seriously, this state has some terrible schools, and are basically last in the country in testing.

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I see lots of the Death Spiral and some angry CNN/MSM things. 

I guess the point is that this side of the death spiral isn't often noted enough here? If so, I totally agree with you. 

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So this is where Brothahorn dumps his memes and tweets rather than starting and engaging in a discussion that might change minds? If more people do the same here in this thread, that can be a good thing.

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What's the view of the minority independent? That Donald Trump is a corrupt, incompetent, immoral piece-of-shit-failed businessman who was elected by absolute fucking morons?

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Brothahorn said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Let's break down both stories since you can't be bothered to read past the headlines

Quote

Story 1 How Trump gets hydroychloroquine wrong?

Question #1: How soon until we know if hydroxychloroquine works against coronavirus?

Trump says "days."

Doctors say weeks or months.

 

Question #2: French researchers have already done a clinical study showing hydroxychloroquine works as a treatment for coronavirus. Doesn't that tell us something?

Trump says yes.

Doctors say the study was terrible, so no.

 

Question #3: Have some people tried to delay hydroxychloroquine clinical trials?

Trump says yes, and he came to the rescue.

Doctors say they have no idea what he's talking about.

 

Question #4: Is hydroxychloroquine safe for coronavirus patients?

Trump says yes.

Doctors say the drug can have serious side effects.

 

Story 2 How Hydroxychloroquine can help patients survive?

Quote

A team at Henry Ford Health System in southeast Michigan said Thursday their study of 2,541 hospitalized patients found that those given hydroxychloroquine were much less likely to die.

Dr. Marcus Zervos, division head of infectious disease for Henry Ford Health System, said 26% of those not given hydroxychloroquine died, compared to 13% of those who got the drug. The team looked back at everyone treated in the hospital system since the first patient in March.

...

"The combination of hydroxychloroquine plus azithromycin was reserved for selected patients with severe COVID-19 and with minimal cardiac risk factors," the team wrote.

How are these stories in conflict with each other? 

And even if they were 100% in conflict, I would appreciate if a journalist decided to flip flop 100% if they later discovered they were wrong. Only weak minded people stick to a narrative even once they're proven to be wrong. 

Edited by Nice Guy Eddie

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1 minute ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Let's break down both stories since you can't be bothered to read past the headlines

 

Story 2 How Hydroxychloroquine can help patients survive?

How are these stories in conflict with each other? 

And even if they were 100% in conflict, I would appreciate if a journalist decided to flip flop 100% if they later discovered they were wrong. Only weak minded people stick to a narrative even once they're proven to be wrong. 

Absolutely this. So many use the sentence "that's my opinion and I'm sticking to it" and they think it's a projection of strength. It's not. It's a very cowardly display of weakness.

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14 minutes ago, hpslugga said:

Absolutely this. So many use the sentence "that's my opinion and I'm sticking to it" and they think it's a projection of strength. It's not. It's a very cowardly display of weakness.

Yep. Remember that long forgotten scandal from Trump in Sept 2019 when he mistakenly said Alabama was in the path of the hurricane. But he was wrong. Why bad that the President tweets out wrong info, its an easy mistake to correct. Hell, he could just let it go with a new tweet with the correct info. Nope, he forces his will so that the entire hurricane prediction arm of the US had to back him up.  

Trump_holding_altered_Dorian_forecast_ma

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Posted (edited)

Oh he's the most spineless of them all, yet people are so easily distracted by bells, whistles, smoke, mirrors, colors, lights, etc that they think his pseudo tough guy rhetoric makes him a tough guy. If you picked up Donald Trump's testicles and rolled them into a drinking straw, it'd look like two kernels of corn were rolling around in a storm drain.

And as far as the rest of those goons and hooligans in that chickenshit organization known as the GOP, he surrounds himself with likeminded spineless buffoons. Rick Perry was the governor of Texas when Dan Patrick was a state senator that had his hands all over the statement enunciating the party's platform in 2012. In it, they said of education "We oppose the teaching of Higher Order Thinking Skills (HOTS) (values clarification), critical thinking skills and similar programs that are simply a relabeling of Outcome-Based Education (OBE) (mastery learning) which focus on behavior modification and have the purpose of challenging the student’s fixed beliefs and undermining parental authority." Perry didn't have anything to do with the drafting of that statement, but he nonetheless gave every fucking word of it his dickless aggy blessing. Again, the bold phrase is a sign of weakness, not strength, contrary to what those morons imagine. You can go through Trump's cabinet, especially its initial edition, and you'll find the same thing: spineless cowards who pretend to be tough.

Edited by hpslugga

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1 hour ago, Herpa Derpa said:

Power to you, I guess.  I will say that the first bit you posted about the big bad MSM is an interesting misuse of journalism.  Only headlines provided, which are often not even written by the author of the article, so no context as to what either article truly said.  Even then, your gotcha moment highlights the name of a writer without any reflection on the dates.  One written in April, the other 3 months later.  Is it possible that the virus, and hydro, came to be better understood based on the subsequent study?  That the first article reflected known medical practice at that time, and the second article provided updated information to the reader based on the latest data?  Science and brains, can we first go back to using those?  Otherwise, it's just a bunch of noise.

Since you started off with such a disingenuous example, I won't bother discussing any of the rest which kinda defeats the whole point of the thread.

However, nothing of what I see above is about being a conservative person when it comes to our governance.  I don't see anything that doesn't demand MORE government in personal lives.  It's all about the issues that YOU deem important, demanding as much be done as the other side about YOUR personal issues.  Ensuring the adherence to the Constitution is not an exclusively "conservative" trait.  It's just not. That's another example of the co-opting of a word for your partisan glean.  Frankly, it's absolutely antithetical to the Constitution. There isn't one way things must be done.  Being on the losing end of an election, legislative vote, or court decision isn't an affront to the Constitution.  It's how it works.

You haven't shown me anything that is seeking a conservative approach to governance under the supreme law of the land.  The view presented in the OP doesn't have much to do with only having a federal government that provides an impenetrable national defense to our enemies, a solid and advanced infrastructure that reflects our union, and the protection of all people within the borders under the words of the document from which it all starts.  On the other hand, what I see presented has a lot to do with demanding fealty to one collection of opinions.  Again, not what this place is about.

I am a lost conservative.  Out in the wilderness from when the word had real meaning.  I have no label to take now because the debate has become enraptured to the cult of personality, intolerance and bad faith interaction.  Some both sideisms, but lately not very proportional at all.  I don't care about the tint of your melanin, I do care that the ignorant and backwards understandings about how this thing works that I see demonstrated in the OP have potentially foundered this nation, political labels be damned. That is what will drive my next time in the ballot box.  A reckoning must come.

Yes that first example was cringeworthy.  That's what 'entertainment news' channels have done.  People no longer understand what a real journalist should be doing.  You report the news - not your opinions as news.  When things change it shouldn't be a 'gotcha' moment unless you're talking about some political news show like Lemon or Hannity.  

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I do like the idea, Brothahorn, of a thread specifically for libertarians and independents on here somewhere.  I was a drive-by poster of negativity on anything Obama related for years on TOS.  I was largely silent on political stuff for Trump's first year as well.  I felt his inflated sense of his average intelligence was hilarious, but that most on here were being hyperbolic about how dangerous he was.  But I was completely wrong.  He's beyond incompetent because the incompetent usually give up and move on.  He's doubling down as if to prove a point to his dead parents.  

I let my membership in the Libertarian Party lapse after Amash said he was done.  I've resigned from every Republican Party organization I was appointed to over the last two years.  I'll likely migrate back in a few years down the road but mainly for business purposes.  So technically, I am a man without a country.  A minister without portfolio.  so I applaud your wanting a space in which we can pick on both sides again.  In a race between Dan Patrick and Hillary Clinton, I'd take the NASCAR approach---get drunk and hope they both crash.

It's been exhausting having every two-bit "I'm more patriotic than you" Trumper on many threads accuse of me of being some Anti-American leftist when nothing could be further from the truth.  Likewise, it's annoying as shit to have the resident "enlightened" liberals on here shit on capitalism and accuse me of white privilege.  80 million of us adults did not vote for Clinton nor Trump in 2016.  Now Trumpers think it's because we're lazy brown people.  HRC people think it's because we're apathetic and didn't feel the fervor of her electric aura.  You're both fucking ignorant judgemental pricks.  

I guess one final illustration would be my voting record since I turned 18.  1996-Harry Browne, 2000-George W. Bush, 2004-Michael Bednarik, 2008-Barack Obama, 2012-Gary Johnson, 2016-Gary Johnson, 2020-Joe Biden.  I am not a member of the Democratic Party, I have never been a member of the Democratic Party.  I will never be a member of the Democratic Party.  I am not a particular fan of Joe Biden.  I simply want this madness to end and he's the best chance at it, for now.  

Everybody at the cocktail party is fiscally conservative and socially liberal.  I have committed my political efforts to that precise effect.  But it's futile at this point.  But you and I are both in camps much closer than you realize.  I just feel the need, right now, to shut down the Trump Camp which seems to be fiscally-fucked and socially-hurt-the-dark-people-'cause-heritage.  I didn't even know that was an option on the coordinate grid.  I wouldn't have selected it, but it'd be nice to know it was a 3-dimensional graph, not just the 2-dimensional one we've been presented with since 7th grade algebra.  I mean, the least Christian President that we'll ever see in our lifetimes turns out to be the most beloved by the Evangelicals.  That's insane to me.  

Anyway, hope this thread is something positive on here that we could use right now.

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22 minutes ago, Axiom of Choice said:

(the white liberals would talk to him perplexed with feigned concern) 

I know you're not a mind-reader, otherwise you would have far fewer questions about what others think, so this statement is complete bullshit (and possibly projection).

Your posting style is idiotic. Your stated intention is often one of dialogue, but your conclusions and assertions all make it seem like you'd be better off in conservative circle-jerk threads. If you're just a troll, congrats. You're successful at engaging in the lowest form of internet interaction, though you need to bush up on the stylings of FCHorn and the like, who do as good a job as you with far less effort. If you're not trolling, then you're failing at whatever it is you think you're doing.

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My voting history is somewhat similar to Lobo.  We came of voting age in the same election.  I've voted (R) in one presidential election and (D) in one presidential election and cast a fuck 'em both (L) vote in the remainder of the elections.  The reason this board appears "not conservative" right now is that the GOP put the most horrible person to run for the office in the White House and he is trying to drag the country to a place on the political spectrum that makes Rush look like Marx.  Everyone is going to look liberal in comparison. 

 

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Posted (edited)
50 minutes ago, softlynow said:

I know you're not a mind-reader, otherwise you would have far fewer questions about what others think, so this statement is complete bullshit (and possibly projection).

Your posting style is idiotic. Your stated intention is often one of dialogue, but your conclusions and assertions all make it seem like you'd be better off in conservative circle-jerk threads. If you're just a troll, congrats. You're successful at engaging in the lowest form of internet interaction, though you need to bush up on the stylings of FCHorn and the like, who do as good a job as you with far less effort. If you're not trolling, then you're failing at whatever it is you think you're doing.

He's Swam4Texas with a fedora and a thesaurus. Pretty straightforward. Bunch of anecdotal nonsense and hollow talking points masquerading as a word salad full of masturbatory faux-intellect. Basically if you took Joe Rogan but made him stupid. There's a reason nobody engages with him, although I did enjoy watching @bad_teammate hand him his ass in the BLM thread.

Edited by BradInATX

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8 hours ago, Brothahorn said:

Since the conservatives(especially minorities) have so little voice on this forum. I decided to start my own thread. Because this is what America is about. Not all of us are bitches crying about the past and looking to be a victim. I will post views from minority conservatives, libertarians and independents. Joe Biden doesn't own us all.

 While I won't always agree with everything I post, I feel it is important to show that there are way more views than what is currently represented on this site. 

"Make America Great Again" is entirely about being a victim and a bitch who cries about the past.  It is not a forward thinking slogan. 

Out of the things you posted, there are only a couple of ones actually worth reading.  Leave the dumb memes out like "I keep a gun on me cuz I'm American as fuck", and the crybaby anti-media ones out, and you might get some good discussion.  

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Brothahorn said:

Since the conservatives(especially minorities) have so little voice on this forum. I decided to start my own thread. Because this is what America is about. Not all of us are bitches crying about the past and looking to be a victim. I will post views from minority conservatives, libertarians and independents. Joe Biden doesn't own us all.

 While I won't always agree with everything I post, I feel it is important to show that there are way more views than what is currently represented on this site. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Brothahorn, I probably disagree with you on a lot of policy type things, but I agree with you on the media. I've mostly kept quiet about it because i don't really want to end up in an argument about it, but I think the media has lost their mind a bit over the last eight years. 

I'm not saying that Trump isn't terrible, because he is, and they have a responsibility to report on it. And they do. But where I think they've really gone off the deep end is:

- Sensationalizing headlines, which makes them look over-dramatic. There is too much hyperbole and editorializing in mainstream media.

- Jumping to conclusions and not reporting responsibly, in order to get the first "gotcha" article or video clip out there. There are a million examples of this, but one would be when he supposedly fed those Japanese fish disrespectfully while he was with Shinzo Abe and there was a media shitstorm about him not respecting Japanese culture. Turns out what he did was fine. I may not have the details right but it was the first thing that came to mind. There are other examples of more serious events like this.

They are so anxious to get one over on Trump and own him that they have acted irresponsibly in a lot of ways. And obviously going all the way to "fake news!!" is an overly-dramatic Trumpian reaction. The media mostly still eventually gets things right. But they've given him and his followers the fuel for that fire. It also makes them, and the Democrats, get tagged with the "boy who cried wolf" label. IMO the pearl-clutching as if every little thing he does is the newest biggest scandal in the history of the universe has blunted the impact of things he's done that are actually scandalous.

As someone who wants Trump out yesterday, I think the media has unwittingly been one of his biggest allies for the past 5-6 years. For the most part, they are fools.

Edited by BradInATX

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

 

Brothahorn, I probably disagree with you on a lot of policy type things, but I agree with you on the media. I've mostly kept quiet about it because i don't really want to end up in an argument about it, but I think the media has lost their mind a bit over the last eight years. 

I'm not saying that Trump isn't terrible, because he is, and they have a responsibility to report on it. And they do. But where I think they've really gone off the deep end is:

- Sensationalizing headlines, which makes them look over-dramatic. There is too much hyperbole and editorializing in mainstream media.

- Jumping to conclusions and not reporting responsibly, in order to get the first "gotcha" article or video clip out there. There are a million examples of this, but one would be when he supposedly fed those Japanese fish disrespectfully while he was with Shinzo Abe and there was a media shitstorm about him not respecting Japanese culture. Turns out what he did was fine. I may not have the details right but it was the first thing that came to mind. There are other examples of more serious events like this.

They are so anxious to get one over on Trump and own him that they have acted irresponsibly in a lot of ways. And obviously going all the way to "fake news!!" is an overly-dramatic Trumpian reaction. The media mostly still eventually gets things right. But they've given him and his followers the fuel for that fire. It also makes them, and the Democrats, get tagged with the "boy who cried wolf" label. IMO the pearl-clutching as if every little thing he does is the newest biggest scandal in the history of the universe has blunted the impact of things he's done that are actually scandalous.

As someone who wants Trump out yesterday, I think the media has unwittingly been one of his biggest allies for the past 5-6 years. For the most part, they are fools.

If there is a problem with the media, it is that they've mostly treated Trump with kid gloves and tried to offer "both sides" of many situations that don't really have two equal sides.  CNN regularly has people like Kelly Anne Conway on, for example.  And this has allowed bullshit like "alternative facts" to come into being.

If CNN was a father of a toddler who pulled a cat's tail, they'd have the toddler on giving his justifications for why its okay to pull the cat's tail.  In reality, it just isn't okay and the toddler needs to be told that unequivocally.

And shit is off the deep end.  We have no functional leadership and are pretty much a failed state in the midst of a global pandemic.

But conservatives can get me on their side if they start to deliver on taxes.  Take the federal income tax to zero.

Edited by FondrenRoad

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3 hours ago, Bookman said:

What's the view of the minority independent? That Donald Trump is a corrupt, incompetent, immoral piece-of-shit-failed businessman who was elected by absolute fucking morons?

I'm a white independent, and that pretty much nails my view.

100% of the people who support Trump are gullible marks or selfish, soulless opportunists, whether they're white, black, brown, or whatever.  Be smarter or less evil.

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I am a libertarian who likes President Trump's handling of USSC noms. Any other R woulda bailed on Kavanaugh. His foreign policy has been pretty good. His fight with China was prescient.

 

But he's a blithering idiot, and his use of the Roman Praetorian Guard to clear people out of that park for his photo OP was a bridge too far. I have 3 months to decide if I wanna vote for him, or vote for the Libertarian Party. It'll come down to my desire to replace USSC Justices with good Conservatives.

 

We do have good Republicans out there. ND Governor Doug Bergum would make a great Presidential candidate. He's socially pragmatic, pro-business, pragmatic on his Covid management and just regular nice guy. But I'm pretty sure he has no desire to run.

 

SD Governor Kristy Noem too. She'll go pander to the far right on occasion, but still.

 

 

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30 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

But conservatives can get me on their side if they start to deliver on taxes.  Take the federal income tax to zero.

I hope this was a joke because it’s a really stupid idea. 

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

I hope this was a joke because it’s a really stupid idea. 

Nope.  In a regular year, my state gets about 50 cents back on the dollar for what it puts into federal coffers.  Right now, we have leadership that is intentionally withholding aid money from my state and city.  The administration is attempting to withhold education funding to my state's schools (and finally yours as well) in order to extort them into forcing dangerous reopenings.  That same administration also killed needed infrastructure projects for my state and city prior to covid.  It also raised our federal taxes and intentionally hindered us from collecting our own needed tax revenue.

I've been lucky to be working this whole time.  So right now, I'm about to write a large check to the federal government, and a small check to my state and local government.  I want this reversed.  The President has told my state and city multiple times that we are on our own.  Fine.  Let us be on our own.  So if my state taxes need to fund everything then let me pay them.  The vig that we pay to the useless king is too much.  But hey, I guess I will get to fund an evangelical private school in Kentucky instead of my local public school system.  And I also get to pay for my portion of a single fighter jet.

Medicare and Social Security are separate taxes.  We should raise those.  The federal government should have to go to state governments to raise other funds.

Edited by FondrenRoad

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15 minutes ago, Parliament said:

I am a libertarian who likes President Trump's handling of USSC noms. Any other R woulda bailed on Kavanaugh.

 

Anyone with a shred of decency would've bailed on Kavanaugh.

 

17 minutes ago, Parliament said:

His foreign policy has been pretty good.

 

Yeah.  Who needs allies like Germany, Britain, and Canada when we can be friends with North Korea and Russia instead?

Jesus tapdancing Christ there are some stupid people in this country.

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I do blame the media for giving rise to Trump. More so after the election by pointing out every little thing he was wrong about and being mesmorized by a dumbass with a Twitter account. It started making me think that there were other motives going on other than reporting. 

But then Trump's behavior continued and I started noticing a dangerous shift racial rhetoric starting with Charleston (from what I can remember. Or maybe the hurricane in Puerto Rico. Everything's running together at this point in the year 20ronavirus.) Then I started seeing more and more reports coming out about white supremacy and their militia groups around the country. I also started noticing the brazen, in your face, commentary and attitudes of whites in my community. That's when I realized the new GOP was a brand of maintaining systemic racism and a caste system disguised under American flags and patriotic rhetoric. 

I'm not sure how the media should've handled Trump. He was giving them so much ammunition to fire. Maybe they should've been more discretionary in their reporting but hindsight is always 20/20.

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This seems like a good place to drop this:

1) Democrats and Republicans tend to think of the others as caricatures, not as they really are 

https://perceptiongap.us/

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2) Most of us don't really fit into the edges of right and left that make the best caricatures and occupy a disproportionate chunk of our headspace.

https://hiddentribes.us/

spacer.png

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Some of you actually have the wrong impression of how CNN is operating. Sometime in either 2017 or 18, they decided to stop giving Trump the benefit of the doubt or allowing an impartial view. They now just call him for what he is: a liar. When they bring on a Trump spokesman, the point is for the CNN pundit to call Trump a liar and have the spokesman say that he's not. Both sides get something out of it.

You can dislike how they're operating but that is the model that they're following. 

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Posted (edited)

Conservative thought from Barry Goldwater:

 

""Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they're sure trying to do so, it's going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise. I know, I've tried to deal with them."
--Said in November 1994, as quoted in John Dean, Conservatives Without Conscience (2006)

 

Oh yeah, the Debt Clock.  Not sure if this is as a conservative thing as railing against CNN.

 

https://www.usdebtclock.org/

Edited by SaucyJack

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2 hours ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

I disagree with the first part of this premise. I'd say the viewpoint on this forum is dominated by conservatives. They just aren't Republicans and are horrified by the nihilism of the modern GOP. Ideology is mostly irrelevant to where we are right now. Minority voices aren't well represented, I agree. Also women. That's a function of historic underrepresenation at UT of minorities, and the fact that this forum is tangent to a football board, which a majority male interest. 

Exactly. I'm a conservative (a real one, i.e., classical liberal) and I'm also a minority. I've got plenty of voice on this forum and I have a lot of people who agree with me.

That has nothing to do with the fact that the current GOP is a steaming pile of horse shit.

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1 hour ago, FondrenRoad said:

If there is a problem with the media, it is that they've mostly treated Trump with kid gloves and tried to offer "both sides" of many situations that don't really have two equal sides.  CNN regularly has people like Kelly Anne Conway on, for example.  And this has allowed bullshit like "alternative facts" to come into being.

If CNN was a father of a toddler who pulled a cat's tail, they'd have the toddler on giving his justifications for why its okay to pull the cat's tail.  In reality, it just isn't okay and the toddler needs to be told that unequivocally.

And shit is off the deep end.  We have no functional leadership and are pretty much a failed state in the midst of a global pandemic.

But conservatives can get me on their side if they start to deliver on taxes.  Take the federal income tax to zero.

Esto. The media haven't been unwitting allies of Trump, many of them (at the executive level) have been fully witting allies of Trump. They intentionally frame their coverage in a way that focuses on the shit that doesn't really hurt him, but keeps him in the news. They cover up his criminality with scandal. Jeff Zucker barely hid this when he was at CNN. There's a reason the Times hired Maggie Haberman.

This isn't to say that there aren't a shitload of great political journalists in the media trying to do good work, but most of them work at places whose executives would love to see Trump re-elected. They're rarely going to get the resources to conduct any real substantive investigations into the most powerful man in America who also happens to be the most litigious man in American history.

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It’s unchecked greed that keeps shit broken in this country.  I’m at the point where almost every political discussion needs to start there. You can call yourself liberal or conservative but none of that shit matters until power is taken from the 0.001% that have a stranglehold on our government, media, and population.  

Conservatives didn’t just one day decide to say “fuck science, fuck education, fuck healthcare.”  These were business decisions to serve the existing power that values society as a mere instrument to serve their financial and political interests. Liberals fall for the same shit too, it’s just packaged differently.

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I'm waiting for a "Conservative" to address Trump's unabashed Socialism. By the billions & trillions, this year we have taken money from people who do well (over 100K) and given it directly to low achievers because.....socialism. 

 

Trump is the most Socialistic President to ever live, and it isn't close. Add up all of the Dems' programs you don't like, and the $ Trump has shoveled out this year eclipses all of them combined.

 

Conservatives voted for a Socialist. Congratulations.

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10 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Esto. The media haven't been unwitting allies of Trump, many of them (at the executive level) have been fully witting allies of Trump. They intentionally frame their coverage in a way that focuses on the shit that doesn't really hurt him, but keeps him in the news. They cover up his criminality with scandal. Jeff Zucker barely hid this when he was at CNN. There's a reason the Times hired Maggie Haberman.

This isn't to say that there aren't a shitload of great political journalists in the media trying to do good work, but most of them work at places whose executives would love to see Trump re-elected. They're rarely going to get the resources to conduct any real substantive investigations into the most powerful man in America who also happens to be the most litigious man in American history.

I think pre-election they were unwitting.  They didn't take him seriously as a candidate and he gave them ridiculous interviews and sound bites that led to ratings.  I think the media, like most of us, didn't understand the amount of people that would latch onto his crazy ass rhetoric.  I don't think anyone could reasonably argue that the media knew that he would attract, for lack of a better word, a cult.  

 

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19 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Esto. The media haven't been unwitting allies of Trump, many of them (at the executive level) have been fully witting allies of Trump. They intentionally frame their coverage in a way that focuses on the shit that doesn't really hurt him, but keeps him in the news. They cover up his criminality with scandal. Jeff Zucker barely hid this when he was at CNN. There's a reason the Times hired Maggie Haberman.

This isn't to say that there aren't a shitload of great political journalists in the media trying to do good work, but most of them work at places whose executives would love to see Trump re-elected. They're rarely going to get the resources to conduct any real substantive investigations into the most powerful man in America who also happens to be the most litigious man in American history.

Yeah, you and Fondren bring up good points. Usually the things they "boy who cried wolf" about are super dumb, IE the Stormy Daniels thing. If "grab em by the pussy" didn't play then him banging some porn star wasn't going to play either. Nobody cares. And they beat that to death, going so far as to cry for perjury charges or whatever.

Meanwhile, anyone heard about him letting Russia put bounties on our soldiers lately? I sure haven't. 

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19 minutes ago, JFKFC said:

I'm waiting for a "Conservative" to address Trump's unabashed Socialism. By the billions & trillions, this year we have taken money from people who do well (over 100K) and given it directly to low achievers because.....socialism. 

 

Trump is the most Socialistic President to ever live, and it isn't close. Add up all of the Dems' programs you don't like, and the $ Trump has shoveled out this year eclipses all of them combined.

 

Conservatives voted for a Socialist. Congratulations.

Have some memes, libtard!

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, FondrenRoad said:

If there is a problem with the media, it is that they've mostly treated Trump with kid gloves and tried to offer "both sides" of many situations that don't really have two equal sides.  CNN regularly has people like Kelly Anne Conway on, for example.  And this has allowed bullshit like "alternative facts" to come into being.

If CNN was a father of a toddler who pulled a cat's tail, they'd have the toddler on giving his justifications for why its okay to pull the cat's tail.  In reality, it just isn't okay and the toddler needs to be told that unequivocally.

Excellent stuff, Fondren. They're lazy and they follow a template. Opinion shows are cheaper than sending crews out to find and cover news, and they are every TV reporter's wet dream: My own show where I opine and insult the intelligence of the viewer! 

They will give a lie equal air time to an objective truth because they are chickenshit. They won't call a lie a lie. It's a "misrepresentation of the facts." 

We are ill served by the electronic news media.

This thread has produced some good posts. I'm going to run out of rep to give. I particularly like the former GOPs explaining their positions. I won't presume to speak for minority conservatives.

Edited by RomaVicta

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1 hour ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Some of you actually have the wrong impression of how CNN is operating. Sometime in either 2017 or 18, they decided to stop giving Trump the benefit of the doubt or allowing an impartial view. They now just call him for what he is: a liar. When they bring on a Trump spokesman, the point is for the CNN pundit to call Trump a liar and have the spokesman say that he's not. Both sides get something out of it.

You can dislike how they're operating but that is the model that they're following. 

He is a liar. Giving his spokesperson a chance to:

  • Say Trump was kidding,
  • Deflect to an accusation against the Dems/illusory lib,
  • Change the meaning of the words Trump said, or
  • Run out the clock is more than fair.

The above is the model being followed by the apologists when asked a direct question. They have tough hides because they stand up to the fire being directed at a wicked man from whom they take money in exchange for whatever integrity they may have once had.

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1 hour ago, Parliament said:

I am a libertarian who likes President Trump's handling of USSC noms. Any other R woulda bailed on Kavanaugh. His foreign policy has been pretty good. His fight with China was prescient.

 

But he's a blithering idiot, and his use of the Roman Praetorian Guard to clear people out of that park for his photo OP was a bridge too far. I have 3 months to decide if I wanna vote for him, or vote for the Libertarian Party. It'll come down to my desire to replace USSC Justices with good Conservatives.

 

We do have good Republicans out there. ND Governor Doug Bergum would make a great Presidential candidate. He's socially pragmatic, pro-business, pragmatic on his Covid management and just regular nice guy. But I'm pretty sure he has no desire to run.

 

SD Governor Kristy Noem too. She'll go pander to the far right on occasion, but still.

 

 

Pretty much the only reasons for conservatives to vote Trump are Supreme Court Justices and the 2nd amendment. They’re compelling reasons but that’s about it. 
 

24 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s unchecked greed that keeps shit broken in this country.  I’m at the point where almost every political discussion needs to start there. You can call yourself liberal or conservative but none of that shit matters until power is taken from the 0.001% that have a stranglehold on our government, media, and population.  

Conservatives didn’t just one day decide to say “fuck science, fuck education, fuck healthcare.”  These were business decisions to serve the existing power that values society as a mere instrument to serve their financial and political interests. Liberals fall for the same shit too, it’s just packaged differently.

Hugo I’m pretty sure I’ve never said this before but you’re 100% right. This round of bailouts was the last straw for me with regards to voting for either side in national elections. Voting for either big party essentially is supporting the system whereby any number of big corporations and big government interests are put way before citizens. 
 

The best way I’ve heard it described is the two parties are wings on the same bird 

 

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