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Cairn Horn88

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54 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

The judge never explicitly warned Trump he would be jailed if he did it again until the hearing on the nine contempt charges. The judge then spent time saying what was appropriate and what was not, so there would be no mistake about what he expected.   This is all a precursor to the inevitable jail time, but was absolutely necessary to remove multiple avenues of appeal.  

I’ve already explained that there were contempt allegations brought before the judge told Trump what he could and could not do - and that he would be jailed if he did it again.  Today’s contempt allegations could not be considered in jailing him because they were all turned in before Trump was warned by the judge and told in detail what would not be allowed. 

Your post where the judge tells Trump three times do it again and you are  going to jail - and then doesn’t - is bullshit.  Just don’t make up stuff about the trial.  Others read this thread for actual news. 

I will bet a C-Note right now that Trump gets jailed before this thing is over. Feel free to accept. Loser donates to Surly. 

I don't think he'll get jailed. He consistently dances just around the outskirts violating the gag order, but not specifically issuing threats. I think he only gets jailed if he expressly calls for violence i.e. "The only way to end this sham trial is for a true patriot to take out Cohen/Judge Merchan/Juror No. __." I think that would get him jailed, but not much short of that. 

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2 minutes ago, 'stache said:

I don't think he'll get jailed. He consistently dances just around the outskirts violating the gag order, but not specifically issuing threats. I think he only gets jailed if he expressly calls for violence i.e. "The only way to end this sham trial is for a true patriot to take out Cohen/Judge Merchan/Juror No. __." I think that would get him jailed, but not much short of that. 

If someone continually violates a judge's order and doesn't seem to care about fines, I don't see how you don't make them cool their heels in confinement for a certain point. Maybe you don't start with a weekend in Riker's but a couple of hours in a courtroom jail, or whatever option the judge has readily avaiable.

As far as today's testimony, it sounds like they have Weisselberg ordering the Cohen payments of their accounting/AP team. Presumably Trump must have ok'ed it, if not ordered it from Weisselberg. Has he testified yet, or is he refusing. Weisselberg creates a conundrum for the prosecution. He's continually lies under oath but in the defense of Trump. I assume that he will have to be given immunity to compel his testimony, if they're calling him at all.

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Posted (edited)

New witness:  Deborah Tarasoff

Trump leaves as the court takes its afternoon break. He walks out without Todd Blanche, the lawyer who is normally with him at all times.

We’ve arrived at the heart of the case, actually looking at the false documents and related exhibits for which Trump was charged.

This is a good moment to remind people that we have no idea how the jury is interpreting any of this. There is lots of circumstantial evidence that decisions didn’t get made on spending without Trump, and that Michael Cohen made a payment to a porn star, and said later it was better the story didn’t come out before the election. But there has been no direct testimony tying Trump to how the payments were recorded yet.

As a side note, Trump’s campaign is fundraising off the judge’s warning to him this morning about possible jail time if he does not stop violating his gag order, and attacking witnesses and others connected to the case.

Trump is charged with 34 counts of falsifying business records, which includes invoices, ledger entries and checks. This morning, during the testimony of the former Trump Organization controller Jeffrey McConney, we saw the invoices in question. Now, with Deborah Tarasoff, we are seeing the ledger entries and checks. This testimony has been granular yet essential to the prosecution’s case.

It’s not clear how closely jurors are paying attention to this records recitation. Some are clearly looking at the screens in front of them. At least one looks drowsy.

Some serious chain-of-custody testimony right now, concerning who sent and received checks, how they were sent, and how they were stapled to the front of invoices.

Deborah Tarasoff says that Trump had to sign all the checks from his personal account, even after he became president and was living in Washington, D.C. She says they were sent by FedEx. She added that after Trump signed the checks, she would eventually get them back.

Christopher Conroy, the prosecutor, is emphasizing Tarasoff’s point that only Trump could sign checks from his personal account. He is surprisingly halting as he questions her, moving slowly and thumbing through his binder at the lectern between questions.

At the defense table, Todd Blanche and Emil Bove, two of Trump's lawyers, are passing a note back and forth. In between them? Trump, sitting with his eyes closed.

Slowly but surely, Deborah Tarasoff is being guided toward testifying about payments made to Michael Cohen in 2017. Those payments, as we saw before lunch, were reimbursements. The Trump Organization — and the defense lawyers — say they were for legal services rendered. But the prosecutors say that they were reimbursements for hush money, and that each individual record represents a felony.

Deborah Tarasoff is walking the court through the very mundane way in which Trump would sign checks, down to the black Sharpie he would use. She is underscoring that, for all of Trump’s emphasis on the size of his company, Hope Hicks was correct when she testified that the company functioned like a family business. Things take place on a small and almost parochial level.

Deborah Tarasoff is being asked to run through a who’s who of Trump Organization employees. Just a few years ago, these names would have been all but anonymous. But given the three times in three years the Trump Organization has been in the bright glare of one trial or another, these are essentially celebrities to the reporters covering this case: Jeffrey McConney!! Rhona Graff!! Allen Weisselberg!!

Deborah Tarasoff says she still is employed by the Trump Organization, and the company is paying for her lawyers.

Trump smiles a little when Tarasoff mentions he owns the Trump Organization.

Her current title is "accounts payable supervisor." She is expected to be play a similar role, as a witness, to that of Jeffrey McConney, her former boss. She will likely testify about various exhibits, including potentially some of the false records.

The jury has been seated, and the new witness, Deborah Tarasoff, is being brought to the stand. Tarasoff didn’t look at Eric Trump as she walked right by him on her way up.

Deborah Tarasoff, who is testifying in Donald J. Trump’s criminal trial on Monday, is an accounting department employee at the Trump Organization who is believed to have played a significant role in the reimbursement of a hush-money payment at the center of the trial.

She was asked in February 2017 by senior Trump Organization employees to send $35,000 checks to Michael D. Cohen, Mr. Trump’s longtime lawyer and fixer, according to the statement of facts filed by prosecutors as part of Mr. Trump’s indictment. Prosecutors say those checks were to repay Mr. Cohen for the $130,000 he gave a porn star, Stormy Daniels, in the final days of the 2016 campaign to keep her from going public with her claim that she had sex with Mr. Trump a decade earlier.

Christopher Conroy, a prosecutor, just told the judge that the next witness would be Deborah Tarasoff, who ran the Trump Organization’s books for years.

Justice Merchan runs a tight ship/courtroom. We’re back on time at 2:15.

Todd Blanche, one of Trump's lawyers, complains to Justice Merchan that the defense only learned who the prosecution's next witness would be 30 minutes ago. The prosecutors' lack of trust toward the defense team is underscored here.

Prosecutors suggested early on that they did not trust Trump with the knowledge of which witnesses were being called in advance — a professional courtesy in many trials — because of worries that he would attack them on social media.

The lunch break is ending. Prosecutors are back, as is Trump, his lawyers, his son Eric, his advisers Alina Habba and Boris Epshteyn, and the Trump Organization's general counsel, Alan Garten.

Edited by Francisco 2.0
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3 minutes ago, Red Five said:

I think it's funny that Trump caught so much shit for none of his family being at his trial, that now Eric, and only Eric, has to show up every day. 

Good  point. Of course what in the world could Eric have to do otherwise. 

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3 minutes ago, Red Five said:

I think it's funny that Trump caught so much shit for none of his family being at his trial, that now Eric, and only Eric, has to show up every day. 

He probably threatened Eric with his "job" if he didn't come.

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6 minutes ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

Todd Blanche, one of Trump's lawyers, complains to Justice Merchan that the defense only learned who the prosecution's next witness would be 30 minutes ago. The prosecutors' lack of trust toward the defense team is underscored here.

Prosecutors suggested early on that they did not trust Trump with the knowledge of which witnesses were being called in advance — a professional courtesy in many trials — because of worries that he would attack them on social media.

Mob shit.

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2 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Good  point. Of course what in the world could Eric have to do otherwise. 

If convicted, Trump could go to prison for the rest of his life. I know they may at least partly want to just avoid the shitshow, but it's still amazing to see.

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16 minutes ago, Red Five said:

I think it's funny that Trump caught so much shit for none of his family being at his trial, that now Eric, and only Eric, has to show up every day. 

Not even every day

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1 hour ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

that's not actually what he said or how this played out. be better

It's not a transcript, and it's further explained 2 posts up from yours

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2 minutes ago, Rimbo said:

still wrong tho

How so?  

It's a pretty pussy ass move to neg a post just because you disagree, but hey, you do you.  I've given 9 negs in 6 years...and never because I disagreed with a post.

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1 hour ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Kinda goes against the innocent until proven guilty thing we pretend exists in this country. 

I didn't say automatically throw an ex president in prison for getting indicted so it has nothing to do with innocent until proven guilty. 

The perks of being an ex president aren't a right, it's a privilege that we should examine taking away if warranted. 

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Posted (edited)

Court break over, same witness:  Deborah Tarasoff

The jury is being sent home for the day.

Deborah Tarasoff is done. It is unclear whether we will get another witness or not. The lawyers are huddling with the judge. I believe we’ve now seen all the records for which Trump was charged — 34 in all.

The defense's strategy has been to put to try to put as much distance between Trump and whatever is under discussion as they can. Todd Blanche just tried it again while questioning Deborah Tarasoff, saying she didn’t get direct permission from Trump to draft the checks he signed, but rather from her boss, Jeffrey McConney. The cross-examination concludes, very quickly.

Christopher Conroy, a prosecutor, concludes his questioning of Deborah Tarasoff and Todd Blanche, a defense lawyer, stands up to cross-examine her. Trump turns his body to watch his lead lawyer and is now staring toward the lectern with his arm over the back of a chair. Blanche begins by establishing that he and Tarasoff don’t know each other.

Blanche takes a slight swipe at the prosecution, noting the confirmation of the checks took “an hour and a half.” Conroy, who led Tarasoff through that testimony, shoots Blanche a look.

Blanche looked down at his wrist when he did this, as if to look at a watch. As he mentioned how long it took to go through this evidence, Trump scoffed and shook his head.

We are seeing a series of checks made out to Michael Cohen, signed by Trump. His signature looks like a seismograph, all ups and downs, with a single decernible letter: the D at the front of his first name.

Edited by Francisco 2.0
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1 hour ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

If someone continually violates a judge's order and doesn't seem to care about fines, I don't see how you don't make them cool their heels in confinement for a certain point. Maybe you don't start with a weekend in Riker's but a couple of hours in a courtroom jail, or whatever option the judge has readily avaiable.

We're talking about putting the former President into the equivalent of time-out.  My youngest, at 8, has long outgrown that punishment. Yet here we are discussing if a time-out punishment, usually reserved for toddlers, will work on dotard.

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1 hour ago, DixonHur said:

How so?  

It's a pretty pussy ass move to neg a post just because you disagree, but hey, you do you.  I've given 9 negs in 6 years...and never because I disagreed with a post.

Because it isn't worth the effort to discuss it with you. You're shitting up the thread with nonsense. You either realize you're doing it, or you're too stupid to realize that you're doing it and I'm wasting my effort.

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6 hours ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

Why even bother w/ gag orders?  They're meaningless when it comes to the orange dipshit. 

If he wins the election, why even bother with the oath of office?

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2 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

If he wins the election, why even bother with the oath of office?

Well, the Supreme Court is deciding right now whether or not we have rule of law to begin with (and several of them might go against it), so what's the point of an oath anyway?  

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5 hours ago, Your Mom said:

As amusing as it would be to see, him spending a little time in jail would do wonders for his campaign. He’d rake in millions on day one.   It would fire up his base like nothing else has before, and they would see it as proof of his persecution.  He’s probably already got a bunch of pre-written tweets for someone else to post on his behalf just for the occasion.


  
 

Doesn’t matter. Lock him up the next time he violates the gag order. His supporters are lost souls. Fuck their feelings. Do what’s right for the sake of everyone who’s still sane. 

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5 minutes ago, Paper_jam said:

Can Trump still take an oath to "preserve, protect, and defend" the Constitution?  Cuz on Jan. 6, I don't think he was doing that.

He had his fingers crossed, doesn't count.

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Can Trump still take an oath to "preserve, protect, and defend" the Constitution?  Cuz on Jan. 6, I don't think he was doing that.
 

Nor was he that time he suggested “suspending” the constitution.

Good lord I can’t even remember right now what that was about.
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8 minutes ago, Paper_jam said:

Can Trump still take an oath to "preserve, protect, and defend" the Constitution?  Cuz on Jan. 6, I don't think he was doing that.

 

Disclaimer paragraph. Best ever. He's untouchable.

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3 hours ago, Rimbo said:

Because it isn't worth the effort to discuss it with you. You're shitting up the thread with nonsense. You either realize you're doing it, or you're too stupid to realize that you're doing it and I'm wasting my effort.

Lol, the neg was one my second fucking post...oh, and by the way, you "liked" my first one, so how the ever-loving fuck is that "shitting up the thread"?

If you're a pussy who's offended by a sarcastic comment about Trump continuing to flout our justice system just admit it and move on.  It certainly wasn't neg worthy.  Jesus.

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9 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

The thing I keep coming back to is the immediacy of these violations.  Failing to comply with a gag order isn't "deep state" stuff, it's about honoring the orders of the judge.  Whether you believe Trump should be in court or not, it's difficult to argue that staying in line during the trial is somehow part of the setup.

Not that I think the average MAGAt would agree, but still . . .

Watching Laura and some asshole from some shitstain org called “The Article III Project” bitch about the “unconstitutional” gag order imposed by a “Biden democrat” judge in a “democrat “ city, it’s totally part of the setup.

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34 minutes ago, Red Five said:


Nor was he that time he suggested “suspending” the constitution.

Good lord I can’t even remember right now what that was about.

It was about trying to stay in power after he lost the election. He doesn’t think he’s bound by laws or the constitution. He’s a narcissist, a demagogue, and a pathological liar. His oath is meaningless. 

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28 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

It was about trying to stay in power after he lost the election. He doesn’t think he’s bound by laws or the constitution. He’s a narcissist, a demagogue, and a pathological liar. His oath is meaningless. 

Man, I saw a four year-old clip of Dotard earlier, talking about how all the "illegal votes" shouldn't be counted. As President, standing behind the presidential seal in the White House. It was jarring to see. And a good reminder of how Biden is history's greatest monster because he's three years older.

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6 minutes ago, tx 3 putt said:

Odds he shows up to graduation ?

 

I’d go ahead and send that to the judge bc that fat fuck ain’t going to graduation 

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1 hour ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

he wants it. give the motherfucker what he wants.

 

 No one on this thread buys his shit but that is a master class on propaganda. 

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1 hour ago, tx 3 putt said:

Odds he shows up to graduation ?

 

The primary financier of the Minnesota GOP since 2012 is currently serving 21 years for sex trafficking.

A Republican should actually win something here for this state to still be considered purple. They haven't won shit since 2006.

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7 hours ago, Red Five said:

I think it's funny that Trump caught so much shit for none of his family being at his trial, that now Eric, and only Eric, has to show up every day. 

I don't see Jr being able to sit that long without getting a hit of coke hourly.  Plus no way Jr can even get out of bed in time to attend.  Ivanka is the only semi bright one, distancing herself.

4 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Doesn’t matter. Lock him up the next time he violates the gag order. His supporters are lost souls. Fuck their feelings. Do what’s right for the sake of everyone who’s still sane. 

It might actually wake some people up and grab their attention.  

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1 hour ago, immamac said:

He’s scared shitless of jail. 

That's 1 thing that I have in common with the fat fuck. Difference is, I don't go around committing crimes.

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20 minutes ago, pyrohornIII said:

It might actually wake some people up and grab their attention.  

This could actually be the case. It would fire up his moron minions, sure, but it could also show a shit ton of people that aren’t paying attention that he is actually a criminal fuck head. Maybe then they would get off their asses and vote. 
 

Or it could backfire spectacularly. Whatever. 

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3 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

This could actually be the case. It would fire up his moron minions, sure, but it could also show a shit ton of people that aren’t paying attention that he is actually a criminal fuck head. Maybe then they would get off their asses and vote. 
 

Or it could backfire spectacularly. Whatever. 

what's the backfire here?

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