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Elon Musk: Officially a fraud and piece of shit. Official or unofficial war criminal?


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9 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

Twitter is effectively running on auto-pilot with little or no oversight with regard to security concerns or anything else due to the massive amounts of irreparable damage Elon has done in a couple of weeks. It's complete and utter madness what he's doing. I knew he was an idiot, but I never thought he was dumb enough to do some of the things he's done in the past couple of weeks. It's mesmerizing.

I would be willing to bet that Musk has no idea how critical Twitter is to the news media.  So many of them use it as a part of their daily workflow.

If he takes Twitter down, he will be hard-pressed to get positive coverage for SpaceX, Tesla, Boring, etc. in the future. 

lisa simpson episode 23 GIF

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10 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

I would be willing to bet that Musk has no idea how critical Twitter is to the news media.  So many of them use it as a part of their daily workflow.

If he takes Twitter down, he will be hard-pressed to get positive coverage for SpaceX, Tesla, Boring, etc. in the future. 

lisa simpson episode 23 GIF

That's my favorite part of this. If he somehow fucks up Twitter so bad that he can't use it to pump It up Tesla, then it gets real interesting for elmo. House of cards could come crashing down.

Edited by Grade of D as in David
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In the event it becomes unusable, where does everyone go? You'd think some rich tech guys are working around the clock on something to replace it. I don't care for Instagram, don't have Facebook, and have no idea how tiktok works. Reddit's a weird interface and I looked at Mastodon just now and closed it 30 seconds later completely confused. It'll be interesting to watch the race to be the new twitter. I only got on it during the 2020 election and am embarrassed how much time I've spent on it since then. I think my life will be better without it. Thank god for Surly. 

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1 hour ago, Orale said:

In the event it becomes unusable, where does everyone go? You'd think some rich tech guys are working around the clock on something to replace it. I don't care for Instagram, don't have Facebook, and have no idea how tiktok works.

Since Facebook got big, there’s been hundreds, or thousands of attempts at the next major social media platform, but it’s weird that nobody has cracked it,

I feel like TikToks days are numbered because of the data collection, etc,

tumblr may come back, but they need a killer app.  They are probably very busy right now

1 hour ago, Orale said:

I looked at Mastodon just now and closed it 30 seconds later completely confused. 

 

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5 hours ago, Chopper said:

Not to be overly dramatic but it's a war on democracy and truth. Certain people in society can't stand to be fact-checked and their solution is to own or blackmail the media and/or medium.

That dude was joking. If you scroll his timeline you can see.
https://twitter.com/anothercohen  it was a damn good one though

 

He’s already gone back and added a gray check “official account” to certain blue check accounts. Basically, he discovered he needed the thing he thought he didn’t need. 

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5 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

I would be willing to bet that Musk has no idea how critical Twitter is to the news media.  So many of them use it as a part of their daily workflow.

If he takes Twitter down, he will be hard-pressed to get positive coverage for SpaceX, Tesla, Boring, etc. in the future. 

lisa simpson episode 23 GIF

I think that he does and that the value of killing a source of reliable information about him, his companies, and his investors (Saudis) might be at least 44 billion. 

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6 minutes ago, G650 said:

Mastodon is essentially a diffuse Twitter. They really need to get the front end more integrated to make it convenient enough to use

Mastodon is what happens when a bunch of engineers build a social media site lol. It's very modern and efficient, but damned if anyone knows how to use it lol. The simplicity of twitter is its greatest limitation and greatest strength. 

I can't wait to see how complicated twitter 2.0 is, if it is at all

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7 hours ago, Brian Fantana said:

Tell me you're completely clueless about the national security implications of the Twitter deal and the subsequent destruction of Twitter (and it's user safeguards) by a petulant, baboon brained manchild without telling me.

It's okay to be a dumbass, but maybe just sit this one out if you can't find 5 minutes of your day to learn something that doesn't involve sniffing glue.

I have a Twitter account, but I certainly don't use it much. However, I'm very aware of how important Twitter is as a communications tool. For fuck's sake, the literal day he implemented his retarded fucking Twitter Blue idea, a fake account posted a tweet that cost a company billions of dollars in market cap. Don't get me wrong, fuck Eli Lilly, but it's just an example of the impact a single tweet can have on the world.

Having trouble reconciling such an important tool that people won't pay a few dollars a month for. (I.e. great if free but like hell if well pay you anything in order to keep your employees)

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I also agree that Mastodon seems too complicated to be the new Twitter, although it also seems like the current leader in the clubhouse. I think that the server you choose isn’t ultimately that important, and that a good default is mastodon.social

 

i installed it, but it’s mostly sitting there dormant like Twitter usually was for me.

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1 hour ago, 956 Worldwide said:

I think that he does and that the value of killing a source of reliable information about him, his companies, and his investors (Saudis) might be at least 44 billion. 

I don’t think the plan was to kill Twitter. He thought he could reshape it to promote messages he liked and bury messages he didn’t. He fucked up because he never understood Twitter, can’t understand people, and thought he could run an established company in which none of its employees had any stake in its growth the same way he ran startups that promised shitloads of stock to early employees who grinded to build the company.

This is hubris, not genius.

Edited by wildcat09
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As long as it limps along and people keep seeing posts, we will eventually see “Twitters demise is overstated” articles.  But I question whether the content curation to keep the Nazis and racists out, and the ad analytics running for revenue can continue at such reduced levels of staffing.

And none of that addresses the bad financials of Elmo’s actual Twitter purchase (I.e. the vig he owes his investors).  The trick with Musk is to ignore his tweets and pay attention to what he’s doing financially with Tesla and SpaceX, which this month include another stock sale/margin call and a proposed round of fund raising. That tells me he’s in a cash crunch.

Edited by Bateshorn
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4 minutes ago, Bateshorn said:

As long as it limps along and people keep seeing posts, we will eventually see “Twitters demise is overstated” articles.  But I question whether the content curation to keep the Nazis and racists out, and the ad analytics running for revenue can continue at such reduced levels of staffing.

And none of that addresses the bad financials of Elmo’s actual Twitter purchase (I.e. the vig he owes his investors)

He added a billion in debt to it and is actively driving away its biggest revenue stream, when it already hasn’t been profitable in a couple of years.

I don’t know how long he can or will keep it going at a loss.  There’s no government contracts in the pipeline, and maybe the Saudis and Chinese will pay him for access to data, but it won’t be enough,

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5 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

He added a billion in debt to it and is actively driving away its biggest revenue stream, when it already hasn’t been profitable in a couple of years.

I don’t know how long he can or will keep it going at a loss.  There’s no government contracts in the pipeline, and maybe the Saudis and Chinese will pay him for access to data, but it won’t be enough,

He added $13 billion in debt.

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1 hour ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

Having trouble reconciling such an important tool that people won't pay a few dollars a month for. (I.e. great if free but like hell if well pay you anything in order to keep your employees)

You fundamentally misunderstand what is happening with the outrage over the “$8/mo=blue check” thing.

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1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

He gave them 24 hours notice that they’d have to now work more hours for him, otherwise they get three months pay to find a new job.

Extremely random but someone necro repped an ancient reply where surveys indicate that single people on avg are having sex like twice a month. You said that sounded crazy low, I countered that lots of people are doing no fucking at all. I suspect that lots of people even in high demand jobs  (although, huge layoffs going on in faang right now) do no fucking, both literally and metaphorically.

 

sorry, the above is not super comprehensible - was filling up my car. I'm with you on the "I would walk right the fuck out of there". employees absolutely should. talented engineers can find new work. I think people are very risk averse and while there were almost certainly a lot of people who didn't take the deal yesterday, I bet there were a lot who either did with the idea that it was a safer bet (while they look for new jobs) or did because they are actually terrified of having to replace their job.

Edited by Celery Man
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1 hour ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

Having trouble reconciling such an important tool that people won't pay a few dollars a month for. (I.e. great if free but like hell if well pay you anything in order to keep your employees)

It’s not an important tool.

 

 It’s a fucking blight with a few positives that are rapidly disappearing.  With add revenue gone, it’s going to become a hobby, not a business.   
 

Which frankly, makes a lot more sense.  Hobbies don’t have to have a P&L.  They can be picked up and set down at Elmo’s leisure.  But it’s not a business anymore.  The problem for him is if he thinks it is a business.  All he has left to monetize is data.  And its value decreases over time if use drops.

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33 minutes ago, Humble Beast said:

Ok. It’s our weekly Twitter status check.  I logged to find it’s still running, despite warnings to the contrary. I guess it’s supposed to be dead for sure by the end of the weekend. 
Here’a a different opinion.

Forget the opinions, here’s some facts:   It’s been a few years since it was profitable, and for most of its existence, it has not turned a profit. Musk has saddled it with additional debt.  Musk made policy changes that drove away a chunk of its biggest revenue stream.  Musk’s $8 solution to losing advertisers doesn’t come close to making up their revenue, and in fact contributed to the revenue streams slowing down or stopping with some companies.

Oh, and the biggest problem with generating revenue are the policy changes Musk made, things that affect human beings, but he thinks he can make software changes to make it to be profitable. 

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11 minutes ago, Hefeweizen said:

It’s not an important tool.

 

 It’s a fucking blight with a few positives that are rapidly disappearing.  With add revenue gone, it’s going to become a hobby, not a business.   
 

Which frankly, makes a lot more sense.  Hobbies don’t have to have a P&L.  They can be picked up and set down at Elmo’s leisure.  But it’s not a business anymore.  The problem for him is if he thinks it is a business.  All he has left to monetize is data.  And its value decreases over time if use drops.

It definitely has big issues but it a very important tool used by all kinds of legitimate organizations, experts and resources to disseminate information easily and in a very accessible manner.  Just look at how Twitter is used during emergencies, natural disasters, wars, etc.  It helps people get critical information.  

 

Someone just needs to recreate Twitter, call it Flapper or Stonker or whatever and get people to move over without an Elon or Ellison or Jack or whatever in charge.

 

Say what you will about Bezos - he wouldn't have screwed it up like this.

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3 minutes ago, texasdago said:

It definitely has big issues but it a very important tool used by all kinds of legitimate organizations, experts and resources to disseminate information easily and in a very accessible manner.  Just look at how Twitter is used during emergencies, natural disasters, wars, etc.  It helps people get critical information.  

 

Someone just needs to recreate Twitter, call it Flapper or Stonker or whatever and get people to move over without an Elon or Ellison or Jack or whatever in charge.

 

Say what you will about Bezos - he wouldn't have screwed it up like this.

With the responsibility and liability governments have thrown on Twitter no way anyone with half a brain is going to enter that market space. It's a money loser before you even start.

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8 minutes ago, texasdago said:

It definitely has big issues but it a very important tool used by all kinds of legitimate organizations, experts and resources to disseminate information easily and in a very accessible manner.  Just look at how Twitter is used during emergencies, natural disasters, wars, etc.  It helps people get critical information.  

 

Someone just needs to recreate Twitter, call it Flapper or Stonker or whatever and get people to move over without an Elon or Ellison or Jack or whatever in charge.

 

Say what you will about Bezos - he wouldn't have screwed it up like this.

I don't like Bezos, but he is one capable motherfucker

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11 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Forget the opinions, here’s some facts:   It’s been a few years since it was profitable, and for most of its existence, it has not turned a profit. Musk has saddled it with additional debt.  Musk made policy changes that drove away a chunk of its biggest revenue stream.  Musk’s $8 solution to losing advertisers doesn’t come close to making up their revenue, and in fact contributed to the revenue streams slowing down or stopping with some companies.

Oh, and the biggest problem with generating revenue are the policy changes Musk made, things that affect human beings, but he thinks he can make software changes to make it to be profitable. 

let's add some numbers in here for context.

I believe they were profitable for two years in their existence.

Last year Twitter had a little over $5 billion in revenue, 89% (!) of that was based on selling ads.

Elon added about $1 billion in debt service per year to the business.

 

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What the fuck does this post even mean

It means he doesn’t understand the model of Twitter…or Facebook…or radio….or network TV.

Platforms that make their money from ads need viewers. Charging the viewers….to generate orders of magnitude LESS revenue than ads do…necessarily costing you many eyes that won’t pay…is not smart.
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2 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Twitter is a people problem, not a software problem.  

Perfect TLDR summary.  And the key to why Elon is repeatedly stepping on his dick.  

Twitter is a medium FOR human behavior, and it's product IS human behavior (eyes on screens, in a way that's attractive to advertisers).  Engineering is the means of DELIVERING that product, just like engineering flat screen TVs and broadcast signals and HD cameras is the engineering that delivers "The Bachelor."

People are messy.  They defy engineering and binary reasoning.  Lawyers see this all the time when it comes to laws and regulations that are drafted.  Make them too rigid, and you often break the very thing you are trying to protect.  Make them too narrow, and there are so many ways to get around the law that the law fails in its essential purpose.  Make them too broad, and you end up banning conduct you never meant to ban.  A good "law" makes clear enough what is allowed/prohibited, states clearly its intent to guide interpretation and application of the law, and leaves some margin for human judgment: by the public, by the courts, etc.

Presenting and regulating speech, even on a private platform, IS REALLY FUCKING HARD BECAUSE BRIGHT LINE RULES ARE IMPOSSIBLE.  For example, it's good business to ban hate speech.  Most sane people would agree with that rule.  And we have no problem with deciding that "The nazis were right, all jews should be exterminated" is hate speech.  Just like we have no problem with deciding that "you are foolish, and your ideas are wrong" is not hate speech.  But it gets REALLY fucking messy as you get closer to a midline.  There can be no easy bright line.  Someone who thinks only like an engineer -- particularly someone who may have underlying psychological issues that prevent him from being fully funcitonal when it comes to social interaction (someone on the spectrum, like Elon) -- just can't conceive of that.  They may SAY that they can, but what they REALLY think is that "no engineer as brilliant as I am has ever tried to tackle this problem -- I am the genius who will come up with the perfect approach to make this easy-peasy."  Ultimate hubris.

TLDR version; engineers can build rockets.  Other people are the ones who convince astronauts to strap themselves INTO the giant explosive that every rocket is.  Elon needs "other people," and he needs to let them do their jobs.

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9 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Perfect TLDR summary.  And the key to why Elon is repeatedly stepping on his dick.  

Twitter is a medium FOR human behavior, and it's product IS human behavior (eyes on screens, in a way that's attractive to advertisers).  Engineering is the means of DELIVERING that product, just like engineering flat screen TVs and broadcast signals and HD cameras is the engineering that delivers "The Bachelor."

People are messy.  They defy engineering and binary reasoning.  Lawyers see this all the time when it comes to laws and regulations that are drafted.  Make them too rigid, and you often break the very thing you are trying to protect.  Make them too narrow, and there are so many ways to get around the law that the law fails in its essential purpose.  Make them too broad, and you end up banning conduct you never meant to ban.  A good "law" makes clear enough what is allowed/prohibited, states clearly its intent to guide interpretation and application of the law, and leaves some margin for human judgment: by the public, by the courts, etc.

Presenting and regulating speech, even on a private platform, IS REALLY FUCKING HARD BECAUSE BRIGHT LINE RULES ARE IMPOSSIBLE.  For example, it's good business to ban hate speech.  Most sane people would agree with that rule.  And we have no problem with deciding that "The nazis were right, all jews should be exterminated" is hate speech.  Just like we have no problem with deciding that "you are foolish, and your ideas are wrong" is not hate speech.  But it gets REALLY fucking messy as you get closer to a midline.  There can be no easy bright line.  Someone who thinks only like an engineer -- particularly someone who may have underlying psychological issues that prevent him from being fully funcitonal when it comes to social interaction (someone on the spectrum, like Elon) -- just can't conceive of that.  They may SAY that they can, but what they REALLY think is that "no engineer as brilliant as I am has ever tried to tackle this problem -- I am the genius who will come up with the perfect approach to make this easy-peasy."  Ultimate hubris.

TLDR version; engineers can build rockets.  Other people are the ones who convince astronauts to strap themselves INTO the giant explosive that every rocket is.  Elon needs "other people," and he needs to let them do their jobs.

Counterpoint from CEO Strangelove:

64368053-11408375-image-m-23_16680115428
 

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  • immamac changed the title to Elon Musk: [Fraud] Official or unofficial piece of shit?
  • blacklab changed the title to Elon Musk: Officially a fraud and piece of shit. Official or unofficial war criminal?

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