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Boo fucking hoo Ashli Babbitt


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I tend to think that when a public servant is involved in a shooting, it should be part of the public record. There of course will be cases where that information might be used by people with bad intent, but imo, those situations would be far exceeded by cops covering up the identities of the individuals involved in bad shoots. 

Sucks that it has to be that way, but until the various police forces operating in our country have earned the level of trust needed to let them control the information, that's the way it should be imo.  

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19 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I tend to think that when a public servant is involved in a shooting, it should be part of the public record. There of course will be cases where that information might be used by people with bad intent, but imo, those situations would be far exceeded by cops covering up the identities of the individuals involved in bad shoots. 

Sucks that it has to be that way, but until the various police forces operating in our country have earned the level of trust needed to let them control the information, that's the way it should be imo.  

In some (most?) situations, maybe.  But this was a fucking terrorist attack with thousands of potential other terrorists within miles of this cop at any given moment as we sit here today.  She got what she deserved and I don't think his identity should be given up in this case.

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7 minutes ago, Red Five said:

If they don't shoot there, then the angry mob chanting Hang Mike Pence probably gets to Mike Pence. He was right around the corner. 

Like if you storm the White House, and are heading upstairs to where the first family is... you're gonna get shot. The only question is why did it not happen sooner.

Pence had a large SS detail that would have blown all of their heads off.  (Wish this would have happened.). Like Babbit, they would have found out after fucking around.

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16 minutes ago, Red Five said:

The only question is why did it not happen sooner.

the next question is how did more people not die?  i'm still shocked and amazed by the tiny death count.

if this was a blm protest-turned-riot-turned-storming-of-the-capitol-to-overturn-a-trump-victory, i have to think we'd still be sorting out all the names of the deceased, not wondering about the name of one cop who was likely scared shitless, vastly undertrained, hugely outnumbered, and just trying to do his fucking job (which was made exponentially more difficult by some of his friends by the outside barricades).

so yeah, i'm done with this.

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42 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

I tend to agree, but Trump has already said the shooter (who they think is a black guy) should be lynched.

I admit that I was not aware of that fact.  That should influence the decision on how to handle it.  If there are exceptions to the general rule I laid out, they should be extremely few and far between.  If people don't like the general rule, the LE community needs to do their part to build the necessary trust.  ETA: And the problem with making exceptions based on fear of physical harm to the officer can also be used in a variety of other cop-related shootings where we would both agree that identification of the officer should not be suppressed. 

Edited by Anastasis
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I appreciate her service overseas.  Pull a Goebbels since that's the only thing these people understand and string her husband up in public as a warning to others.  

the first incarcerated insurrectionist is just a few weeks away from taking their own life.  We need to make that a national spectacle.  Traitorous Suicide should be a fucking punchline in this country.  And if they have a hard time and second-guess their suicide, have the state step in and help. 

I know we're consumed with politics, and the judicial system, and Trump's crimes, etc.  But it absolutely baffles me that 99% of America doesn't understand what would have happened to the fate of our nation had even one elected official been kidnapped of killed.   

I can gladly trade a few hundred suicides or accidental prison murders for that dark decade.  

 

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17 minutes ago, Lobo said:

But it absolutely baffles me that 99% of America doesn't understand what would have happened to the fate of our nation had even one elected official been kidnapped of killed.   

 

 

Honestly, many conservatives, and more Republican members of Congress, would be reacting entirely different had a member of Congress or a staffer been caught out in the open.   Even if only a beating had occurred.  But if an actual death happened?   I'd like to think that Trump, Mo Brooks, Josh Hawley, Ted Cancruz and several others would be persona non grata at the least and in jail at best. 

There's a point I have been making since January 6th to friends on either side of the spectrum....    Do we really think that those who breached the Capitol would have been able to tell Jody Hice or Ronny Jackson from Adam Hinziger?   Nope, I don't.   If Mitt Romney had gotten caught I think he would have gotten his ass totally kicked.   

Any member of Congress or their staff that would have gotten caught out in the open was going to get hurt or killed.  

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1 hour ago, Red Five said:

 The only question is why did it not happen sooner.

Nah, we should be asking why they didn't set up a barrier around the capital and at the very least screen every person (should have just arrested them, actually) for foreign spooks. This was clearly planned out by some individuals, and there were folks in offices of congresscritters who neglected to log off of thei computers. Who knows what could have been compromised.

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Babbit was one of them so to rally behind her as a martyr at Trump's urging is as natural as any other action: don't get the vaccine, vote in person, go to rallies, and stop the steal. She was human, like them.

She shared their anger.

She shared the same righteousness and indignation at all the sufferings they have been through since 2008.

Stop the Steal. Anyone trying to steal the election is not human and should hang, should be (I can't even recall all the things the mob was shouting, I think I've blocked it out).

Anyone who disagrees is not human, but instead a lesser than. Any discomfort that perhaps the officer was protecting someone, following orders to keep the hall from being breached, etc will be explained away by all sorts of handy rationalizations (the one that maybe she was shot while he was defending a Democratic leader  since if he had been defending a Republican leader then somehow that was better had me shaking my head), helpfully provided by the propaganda networks that abound. 

 

Trump is not as stupid as people make out in that regard. He and his aides been looking and looking for something to get people angrier and more violent. Let's hope this isn't it.

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9 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

at the very least screen every person (should have just arrested them, actually) for foreign spooks.

While this was a problem, it certainly wasn't the main problem.  Far more domestic terrorists than foreign spooks.

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Jesus. Some of y’all need to log off and get some fresh air.  The women is dead. She left behind family.  The situation is tragic. If you read articles about her, she was clearly troubled. 

The rioters were seditious and wrong and I hope as many of them as possible do hard time.  If they had been black, the National Guard and cops would have just opened up with automatic weapons fire instead of posing for selfies. The whole thing is horrible and emblematic of the rotten, broken corpse of the GOP.

But let’s try to have a little personal empathy here. 

Edited by Bateshorn
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1 minute ago, Bateshorn said:

Jesus. Some of y’all need to log off and get some fresh air.  The women is dead. She left behind family.  The situation is tragic. If you read articles about her, so we clearly troubled. 

The rioters were seditious and wrong and I hope as many of them as possible do hard time.  If they had been black, the National Guard and cops would have just opened up with automatic weapons fire instead of posing for selfies. The whole thing is horrible and emblematic of the rotten, broken corpse of the GOP.

But let’s try to have a little personal empathy here. 

I do - for Brian Sicknick and his family. And to Michael Fanone and what he has gone through having survived this bullshit.

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6 minutes ago, Bateshorn said:

Jesus. Some of y’all need to log off and get some fresh air.  The women is dead. She left behind family.  The situation is tragic. If you read articles about her, she was clearly troubled. 

The rioters were seditious and wrong and I hope as many of them as possible do hard time.  If they had been black, the National Guard and cops would have just opened up with automatic weapons fire instead of posing for selfies. The whole thing is horrible and emblematic of the rotten, broken corpse of the GOP.

But let’s try to have a little personal empathy here. 

Your first paragraph, total agreement. What I object to is the turning of her into a martyr by the very people who are responsible for stoking her activism in the first place. 

But yes, this country is in a mental health crisis and it's reaching its own level of pandemic. 

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1 minute ago, Bateshorn said:

I agree that the way Fox News and the GOP is martyr-ing her is disgusting and despicable.  

 

I just…….internet beating this women’s corpse isn’t going to make any of this better 

I would only do it here, because surly. In reality I take no pleasure in death, but yeah, martyrdome is fucking absurd, and on brand for today's right wing.

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3 minutes ago, Bateshorn said:

I agree that the way Fox News and the GOP is martyr-ing her is disgusting and despicable.  

 

I just…….internet beating this women’s corpse isn’t going to make any of this better 

I'm pretty sure she won't mind

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2 hours ago, Macanudo said:

Reading that Texags thread makes me wonder if living in this country is worth it.

I swear I can't help but venture in there.  And every time I do, I feel like I am in some sort of Bizzaro world.  Some alternate reality.  But what's frightening is there are LARGE swaths of or country who are in their camp.  

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2 hours ago, wildcat09 said:

I tend to agree, but Trump has already said the shooter (who they think is a black guy) should be lynched. So in this case, I think some worry about what Trumpers might do to him and his family is warranted. 

There's proof of this somewhere?

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She’s not a martyr, but a sad, pathetic victim of Trump and his movement. He and the other leaders of his movement killed her. In that moment, she had to be stopped, but I blame GOP leaders for her life and the lives of the dead and injured cops.

Those leaders sacrificed her life. They used her and are continuing to use her in her death. She’s ultimately responsible for the actions that led to her death, but without the movement, she’d be alive today ranting about more harmless madness.

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2 hours ago, Pato del Muerto said:

What is supposed to happen when you try to enter a room that’s been barricaded with furniture and people, with guns trained on the door and people yelling to get back?  Seems like you can expect to get shot if you continue forward. 

Just a poor innocent tourist lured into a trap.

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2 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

which part? that the shooter was black or trump called for his lynching. the first is pretty easy to discern from the many videos of the shooting. the other was reported, but I forget where.

The lynching part. That part was a bit too much to believe and I know Dotard has said some truly deplorable shit. I couldn't find it in a quick Google search. Believe me, I'd love to know he did actually say that.

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I agree they should have shot more of those fuckers. There’s absolutely no room for that fuckery in our society. I’m also confident if the races were reversed, King James would have tweeted the cops address out.  
Solid both sides there.
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1 minute ago, C-Man said:

The lynching part. That part was a bit too much to believe and I know Dotard has said some truly deplorable shit. I couldn't find it in a quick Google search. Believe me, I'd love to know he did actually say that.

IIRC, he said something like "if the roles were reversed then that officer would have been lynched". 

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8 minutes ago, Mole said:

She’s not a martyr, but a sad, pathetic victim of Trump and his movement.

Trump is 100% responsible for her death.  100%.  He might as well have pulled the trigger himself.

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3 hours ago, Anastasis said:

I tend to think that when a public servant is involved in a shooting, it should be part of the public record. There of course will be cases where that information might be used by people with bad intent, but imo, those situations would be far exceeded by cops covering up the identities of the individuals involved in bad shoots. 

Sucks that it has to be that way, but until the various police forces operating in our country have earned the level of trust needed to let them control the information, that's the way it should be imo.  

I agree.  Release his name, and get him a secret service detail.  You know, just in case more Trumpers want to FA&FO.

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1 minute ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

The officer that shot Ashli Babbitt should be given a medal. Those officers are armed for a reason. Mainly to protect the lives of our public officials. They're not supposed to wait until they see a rioter stabbing Mike Pence before they act.

Babbitt was breaking a window of a locked door, and climbing in to get closer to the public officials. It would be logical conclusion to think that Babbitt was up to no good and wanted to hurt people. The officer did exactly how they should act: put that person down. there are no warning shots. No shooting them in the leg to prevent their mobility. You shoot to take someone out as a threat. If they're not a threat, then you shouldn't be shooting them.

And guess what, I believe that the others in that area stopped their immediate actions as Babbitt was lying on ground dying. That officer did their job that day.

and the craziest part is people can watch the same videos I have and come to the conclusion, somehow, that she was a peaceful tourist and that police executed an innocent person. I don't understand how there can be two such disparate interpretations of reality, but here we are. it's clearly what gave us trump in the first place

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