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UF Jalen Kitna - arrested for kiddie porn


Gil Bang

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12 hours ago, Valmy77 said:

I hope Kitna gets the help he needs and kids are kept safe from him.

 

3 hours ago, Auto Driller said:

101 months average sentence means he can look forward to a long stay in prison.

Oh, he's going to get plenty of "help".  

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14 hours ago, TexasHooch said:

It's a few years old, but this suggests he'll do at least some time for it.

https://www.ussc.gov/sites/default/files/pdf/research-and-publications/quick-facts/Child_Pornography_FY19.pdf

This rather highly depends on whether his prosecution remains state or the feds take it over.  Seems it is very common for the feds to take it over.  State prosecutions of this kind of thing tend to lead to a short jail sentence, if anything, and probation with "treatment," and, of course, the obnoxious sex offender registration.

Federal sentences, on the other hand, tend to be longer than most actual "hands on" child molestation convictions, which still occur almost exclusively at the state level.

It's a real oddity in the criminal sentencing arena, and, unpopular opinion, I think it's wrong and an extreme example of our fucked up sentencing policies.  The US Sentencing Commission has gone on record to say that the guidelines in this area, which were dictated by Congress instead of being developed by the Commission, are FUBAR.

Federal judges are tending to agree, lately, which led to a most disingenuous questioning of Ketanji Brown-Jackson about her CP sentences by Cruz, Hawley, Cotton and other hacks.

Edited by TwiceHorn
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3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

This rather highly depends on whether his prosecution remains state or the feds take it over.  Seems it is very common for the feds to take it over.  State prosecutions of this kind of thing tend to lead to a short jail sentence, if anything, and probation with "treatment," and, of course, the obnoxious sex offender registration.

Federal sentences, on the other hand, tend to be longer than most actual "hands on" child molestation convictions, which still occur almost exclusively at the state level.

It's a real oddity in the criminal sentencing arena, and, unpopular opinion, I think it's wrong and an extreme example of our fucked up sentencing policies.  The US Sentencing Commission has gone on record to say that the guidelines in this area, which were dictated by Congress instead of being developed by the Commission, are FUBAR.

Federal judges are tending to agree, lately, which led to a most disingenuous questioning of Ketanji Brown-Jackson about her CP sentences by Cruz, Hawley, Cotton and other hacks.

What is their recommendation? I agree long jail sentences may not make sense but to me this is a broken brain situation. Having such a mind presents an ongoing threat to others simply as a creator of demand for the illegal and harmful content. 

From that perspective a supervised environment with no internet access makes sense. The fact that our prison system is shitty is a real but separate issue.

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32 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

What is their recommendation? I agree long jail sentences may not make sense but to me this is a broken brain situation. Having such a mind presents an ongoing threat to others simply as a creator of demand for the illegal and harmful content. 

From that perspective a supervised environment with no internet access makes sense. The fact that our prison system is shitty is a real but separate issue.

I think child molesters and people who look at kiddie porn should be castrated. Rapists too.

Edited by Pam Cummings
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Not trying to defend kiddie porn fans, but I get the argument that those who have sexual contact with children should get the harder sentences, not the easier. Nonetheless, for every kiddie porn image, there’s a kid that was abused, so handcuffing both varieties to a chain link fence and one .45 round to the back of the head sounds reasonable. I’m sorry they’re “broken” and I understand they were likely victims themselves but I can’t find it within me to care about the perpetrators.

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14 hours ago, Bevo in VA said:

 

Not sure it's a winning strategy for his attorney to be arguing that it's not child porn but rather "child erotica".  WTF man???

A brilliant play on the Supreme Court Justice who said, "I cannot define pornography, but I know it when I see it."

Perhaps his play is to say that the images are art rather than porn thus no crime. All he is actually doing is drawing suspicion to himself as another child porn monger. 

Bold move. We already see how it's working out.

 

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1 hour ago, Huckleberry said:

What is their recommendation? I agree long jail sentences may not make sense but to me this is a broken brain situation. Having such a mind presents an ongoing threat to others simply as a creator of demand for the illegal and harmful content. 

From that perspective a supervised environment with no internet access makes sense. The fact that our prison system is shitty is a real but separate issue.

This got me to wondering about the recidivism rate for child porn felons? National LIbrary of Medicine (NIH)

 

Quote

Considerable debate surrounds the topic of whether possessing or distributing online images of child pornography (CP) represents a new type of crime perpetrated by conventional sex offenders (e.g., child contact [CC] sex offenders), or whether individuals who commit these crimes differ from contact sex offenders in meaningful ways. The current study compares groups of Internet (CP) and CC sexual offenders, with each group's sexual offending history exclusively confined to its offense category. T tests were used to conduct bivariate comparisons of group demographics and criminal histories.

Rates of recidivism were examined using survival curves and Cox proportional hazard regression models. Results showed significant differences on demographic and criminal history variables, with CP offenders demonstrating a lower frequency of prior criminal offending and substance abuse, and higher rates of pre-incarceration employment and level of education.

Rates of recidivism were significantly different between the two groups, with CP offenders showing lower rates of re-offense for most measures of recidivism. When controlling for background characteristics and the timing of the event, CC offenders were at much greater risk for having an arrest for a new crime or a non-sexual violent crime than CP offenders. Treatment and policy implications are discussed, along with suggestions for future research.

Scientific American on recidivism rates for child contact (CC) offenders for comparison.

Quote

First, the notion that recidivism (repeat offending) is inevitable needs a second look. Recently sex crimes researcher Jill Levenson of Lynn University in Florida and her colleagues found that the average member of the general public believes that 75 percent of sex offenders will reoffend. This perception is consistent with media portrayals in such television programs as Law and Order: Special Victims Unit, in which sex offenders are almost always portrayed as chronic repeaters.

The evidence suggests otherwise. Sex crimes researchers R. Karl Hanson and Kelly E. Morton-Bourgon of Public Safety Canada conducted a large-scale meta-analysis (quantitative review) of recidivism rates among adult sex offenders. They found a rate of 14 percent over a period averaging five to six years. Recidivism rates increased over time, reaching 24 percent by 15 years. The figures are clearly out of alignment with the public’s more dire expectations.

...

Taking the research and its limitations into account, it is still likely that the public’s belief that very high recidivism rates are well documented is incorrect, although this verdict may change in the future.

It appears that we shouldn't lump child porn customers with actual child sex offenders. Perhaps a comparison would be assuming that someone who likes bodage/sado porn is actually running around, capturing victims, and torturing them.

In view of the slender amount of evidence I've reviewed (all of it included here), I do wonder if hysteria has made punishment for child porn possession offenders too extreme. It should surely be punished because it supports an exploitive, criminal activity to create said images. But eight years? No.

Our prisons are hell holes too inhumane even for the worst criminals incarcerated. We need to be judicious in assigning the amount of time we sentence someone to them. As a nation, we become flippant about prison rape and huge prison sentences. We keep it abstract. We puff in competition to display toughness. It's adolescent.

This guy deserves punishment when convicted. I don't know that he deserves destruction.

 

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Our prisons are hell holes too inhumane even for the worst criminals incarcerated. We need to be judicious in assigning the amount of time we sentence someone to them. As a nation, we become flippant about prison rape and huge prison sentences. We keep it abstract. We puff in competition to display toughness. It's adolescent.

Generally, I agree with this. We aren't doing the convicted or ourselves any good by sending them to crime college and expecting them to somehow reform there. However, because of the vulneability of children, and the life long impact this kind of shit can have on a completely innocent human, I see this category differently. Those who have no capacity to protect themselves should be protected and until I am convinced that there is zero chance of a person repeating the offense, that person should be apart from society where they would have access to children. I don't hate the offender so much as I don't want them fucking up the lives of innocent little kids.

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13 hours ago, RomaVicta said:

This got me to wondering about the recidivism rate for child porn felons? National LIbrary of Medicine (NIH)

 

Scientific American on recidivism rates for child contact (CC) offenders for comparison.

It appears that we shouldn't lump child porn customers with actual child sex offenders. Perhaps a comparison would be assuming that someone who likes bodage/sado porn is actually running around, capturing victims, and torturing them.

In view of the slender amount of evidence I've reviewed (all of it included here), I do wonder if hysteria has made punishment for child porn possession offenders too extreme. It should surely be punished because it supports an exploitive, criminal activity to create said images. But eight years? No.

Our prisons are hell holes too inhumane even for the worst criminals incarcerated. We need to be judicious in assigning the amount of time we sentence someone to them. As a nation, we become flippant about prison rape and huge prison sentences. We keep it abstract. We puff in competition to display toughness. It's adolescent.

This guy deserves punishment when convicted. I don't know that he deserves destruction.

 

Agreed.  In the final analysis, whether it creates a "market" for the images (I think this is dubious because I think the creators nowadays are non-commercial and just sick fucks under some compulsion), it's a far thing from actually laying hands on a child, in terms of culpability.  Yet, because most CP offenders end up in the federal system, they get longer sentences than many hands-on offenders who remain in the state system.

And, I think you may be spot-on about different types of porn not leading to actual commission of the acts depicted.  But, I can't really comprehend it, so I'm not going to make facile conclusions about it, either way.

I don't think the psychology of child porn offenders is well understood and a lot of the facile conclusions probably aren't accurate.  And, the evidence doesn't seem to support that they are child molesters in training.  There are certainly real, legit pedos that have it, but I think they wind up either having a criminal history or getting busted for some other, hands-on type stuff as often as not and get really harsh sentences.

I've seen something recently that put CP offenders among the lowest recidivism rates in the federal prison population, and that's even with them getting tripped up by the outlandish sex offender registry, which happens with pretty great frequency.

Edited by TwiceHorn
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22 hours ago, Huckleberry said:

What is their recommendation? I agree long jail sentences may not make sense but to me this is a broken brain situation. Having such a mind presents an ongoing threat to others simply as a creator of demand for the illegal and harmful content. 

From that perspective a supervised environment with no internet access makes sense. The fact that our prison system is shitty is a real but separate issue.

It's not a simple recommendation.  It's a complex web of factors that go toward lengthening the sentence that most agree don't have much to do with actual culpability, or relative culpability.  Like, using the internet is an enhancement of the sentence good for a couple of extra years, so it's actually better to order up a child porn mag and get it in the mail than it is to find some on the internet.  That don't make no sense.

 

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Also, because it seems like we're paying more attention to sentencing these days with all the 1/6 and Theranos and Chrisleys and all, this blog is really good on sentencing issues and criminal justice more broadly.  https://sentencing.typepad.com/

It may be too esoteric for non-lawyers, but I don't think so.

The broad consensus is that the federal sentencing guidelines, for all crimes, are a sort of experiment that has gone awry.  The child porn guidelines, which again were prescribed by Congress and not the Sentencing Commission, are often cited as a grotesque example of the guidelines gone wrong.

Edited by TwiceHorn
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23 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Federal sentences, on the other hand, tend to be longer than most actual "hands on" child molestation convictions, which still occur almost exclusively at the state level.

It's a real oddity in the criminal sentencing arena, and, unpopular opinion, I think it's wrong and an extreme example of our fucked up sentencing policies.  The US Sentencing Commission has gone on record to say that the guidelines in this area, which were dictated by Congress instead of being developed by the Commission, are FUBAR.

Is that a lesser known part of the “Hastert rule?”

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I lean towards eliminating any chance of recidivism.

SMDH at the hand-wringing over prospects for rehabilitating these sick fucks.  They already conceded their chance in life. 

Spend your empathy/ humanity on the victims.

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22 hours ago, RomaVicta said:

Perhaps his play is to say that the images are art rather than porn thus no crime. All he is actually doing is drawing suspicion to himself as another child porn monger. 

Would have had a better play saying it was midget pron. Since midget is offensive and little people is the preferred nomenclature, he became confused because the pictures clearly show they were little. Still digging a deeper hole, but a better insane argument.

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9 hours ago, RomaVicta said:

So life sentences for all such offenders? Try to be a human for awhile.

I don’t know the solution. There are lots of ways people can be broken and still find ways to fix themselves given time, a desire to change and some compassion. Like I said, I don’t have any faith in the criminal justice system. If the result of someone’s failed attempt to reform is having something stolen from me, that’s a risk worth taking. If the result is an 8 year old girl getting fucked on video, then no, the risk is too great. We can agree that there should be a better approach to trying to help the KP watchers and child molesters change, if they want to change. But the risk analysis is simple until that is a real thing.

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Crazy harsh sentencing has not only been shown to not be any type of deterrent but it also very quickly gets bastardized and used as a tool for racism/class discrimination. 

The 3 strikes law sounded like a good idea, was even signed into law by a democrat president who had a favorable reputation among the black community at the time, but instantly became a tool to decimate the black community with trumped up charges and other racist bullshit. 

I'm inclined to heavily follow the data on stuff like this. If decades of real world data say they don't re-offend at high rates then use more of a rehabilitation approach with a far harsher punishment for re-offenders. 

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Yeah, and pretending that kiddie porn/ diddling kids is like going on a trip and leaving your belt at home is also pretty fucking incongruent with reality.

One is a mistake.  One is a direct assault on the innocence/ existence of a child.

"Yeah, Holmes,  just don't do it again"  doesn't cut it.  I don't see why it would for some of y'all.

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38 minutes ago, slorch said:

 

"Yeah, Holmes,  just don't do it again"  doesn't cut it.  I don't see why it would for some of y'all.

No one is saying that, people are just saying that the punishment related to these things is  fucked.

Some guy in SA this year got sentenced to 8 years in prison for photoshopping children’s faces onto images of adults having sex. There’s people that have physically molested kids that receive lighter sentences than that. That seems wrong to me.

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1 hour ago, Hermanator said:

Crazy harsh sentencing has not only been shown to not be any type of deterrent but it also very quickly gets bastardized and used as a tool for racism/class discrimination. 

You failed to mention highly profitable for private prisons.

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3 hours ago, slorch said:

I lean towards eliminating any chance of recidivism.

SMDH at the hand-wringing over prospects for rehabilitating these sick fucks.  They already conceded their chance in life. 

Spend your empathy/ humanity on the victims.

I don't have such a short supply of either that I can't apply them generally. You don't either. 

Putting a person in prison for years for possession of even the worst kind of pornography is out of whack. Dismissing prison rape and utter brutality as the norm is facile and cruel.

But one does get the thrill of imagined toughness. There's that. 

Quote

Yeah, and pretending that kiddie porn/ diddling kids is like going on a trip and leaving your belt at home is also pretty fucking incongruent with reality.

I've seen that you've written this as well. Are you asserting than anyone on this thread has said anything of the like? If so, you're lying.

It's also dishonest to conflate kiddie porn possession with child sexual assault. Sexual assault was raised by me to compare recidivism rates. Child sexual assault is a crime akin to murder as far as I'm concerned; the impact on the victim is that great. Not one person is dismissing the gravity of child sexual assault.

 

Edited by RomaVicta
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12 hours ago, 1leggedduck said:

I don’t know the solution. There are lots of ways people can be broken and still find ways to fix themselves given time, a desire to change and some compassion. Like I said, I don’t have any faith in the criminal justice system. If the result of someone’s failed attempt to reform is having something stolen from me, that’s a risk worth taking. If the result is an 8 year old girl getting fucked on video, then no, the risk is too great. We can agree that there should be a better approach to trying to help the KP watchers and child molesters change, if they want to change. But the risk analysis is simple until that is a real thing.

Yeah, my experiences as a recovering alky make me think this way about redemptive things.  And it seems most of our criminal policy/thought/jurisprudence is based mostly on simplistic thinking that really was developed centuries ago before there was even the limited understanding of psychology and human behavior that we have today.

A lot of it just feels like "alcoholics have no willpower."  There are certainly degenerates out there and degenerate recidivists of sexual and other crimes, but trying to treat everyone the same by locking them up and throwing away the key just can't be right.

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On 12/2/2022 at 10:38 AM, RomaVicta said:

A brilliant play on the Supreme Court Justice who said, "I cannot define pornography, but I know it when I see it."

Perhaps his play is to say that the images are art rather than porn thus no crime. All he is actually doing is drawing suspicion to himself as another child porn monger. 

Bold move. We already see how it's working out.

 

AP_6705110119_0.jpg

Potter Stewart (1915–1985), associate justice of the Supreme Court from 1958 to 1981, is frequently remembered for his famous nondefinition of obscenity: “I know it when I see it.” Stewart began his service on the Court during an era when many justices still wrote their own opinions, and his pithy prose resulted in a number of famous quotations, such as the one on pornography.

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  • 7 months later...

Basically 6 months of probation for the whole mess. 

Quote

Five felony child pornography charges were dropped against former Florida Gators quarterback Jalen Kitna on Wednesday as part of a deal that resulted in him pleading no contest to two misdemeanor counts of breach of the peace.

Kitna, the sophomore son of former NFL quarterback Jon Kitna, will not be required to register as a sex offender and will not serve jail time.

He was sentenced to one year probation, which could be reduced to six months if he complies with the conditions of his parole. 

Full article

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On 7/5/2023 at 3:48 PM, Vertigo said:

Well Florida needs a QB soo....

Actually no, Mertz will do fine and Miller is a serviceable backup. He's got nothing to do with Florida anymore he's been dismissed and banned from the school soo......

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