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2024 Presidential Election Thread - Let's keep the party going.


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Posted
7 minutes ago, Orale said:

His message may have been broadly about the casualness of quitting marriage. But he did specify violent marriages. Nobody put words in his mouth or is disingenuously interpreting his message. Suggesting women (or men) should stay in violent marriages for the sake of the kids strikes me as insane. 

That’s pretty clearly not what he said, and any person who would ever consider voting for Donald Trump along with many  who won’t will understand that. He’s pretty clearly saying that the sexual revolution and no-fault divorce were sold to the public on the basis of freeing people from violence and unhappiness, and while those benefits were realized they came at a cost of broadly negative social and economic consequences. 
Please don’t make me defend JD Vance. 

Posted
5 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

Yea I dunno if a lot of VP picks have referred to the top of their ticket as “Hitler”. 

same same 

Quote

“Well, Hitler did a lot of good things," Trump allegedly saidduring a 2018 trip to Europe to commemorate the 100th anniversary of the end of World War I, the Wall Street Journal's Michael Bender writes in his book "Frankly, We Did Win This Election" and reported in The Guardian.

I’m pretty sure Trump sees this as a compliment sooooo……

Posted
1 hour ago, Rex Kramer said:

He absolutely did nail it. I’m wondering what the fuck he’s doing, ruining his political career like Pence. He’s unelectable as Kamala after this. And you know ‘28 will go to the Dems: modern politics has turned as shitty as a NFC East. Nobody wins that division consecutive times, because like both political parties, everyone is shitty. 

Absolute outliers. You people have lost your minds. 

There won't be an election in '28, though.

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Posted
12 minutes ago, rage-a-holic said:

Wait...a VP who previously made demeaning comments about the Presidential candidate that picked him for the slot?

THIS HAS NEVER HAPPENED IN US HISTORY!!!!!!! OUTRAGE!!!!!

Demeaning comments between politicians shouldn't come as a surprise.

Acknowledging the absolute truth about who Trump is and what he represents, and hitching your wagon to him anyway as a naked power grab should be cause for some concern in a sane world. 

But alas...

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Posted
29 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

I’m not going to defend JD Vance, but two things:

1) this is pretty clearly not what Vance is saying, the gist of which is that the the sexual revolution led to an explosion of divorce that has not been good for working families or middle class children on either a cultural or economic level. His audience will understand it.

2) second, he’s right. And I am certainly no fan of JD Vance or suggesting that people should stay in violent marriages. 
 

Affluent white progressives, who generally have the privilege of not living in economically depressed places or personally impacted by losing elections will no doubt jump all over this, and it will be wasted effort because they don’t understand the lived reality of middle class life in America. 
 

This biggest mistake Democrats have made in the last 35 years is not explicitly pushing economic policies that make single  incomes viable for middle class families. 

Did they not do this the...what...2 times they actually had control of the WH/Senate/House? Then the repubs screamed deficit (they created and dems reduced) only to have all positive momentum unraveled because people voted republican? Then we cut taxes for the very people who did not need it, ran up insane deficits, rinse repeat? It is tiresome. 

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Posted
4 minutes ago, Rex Kramer said:

Yes there will. At some point we will have civil war and government tyrannical overreach.  Doomers here will be very pleased to see a peaceful transition of power in Jan ‘29. Or maybe they won’t because they want to be pissed and see drama. 

If Trump wins, why would there be a peaceful transition of power in ‘29 when there wasn’t one in 21’?

Posted
33 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I'm referring to your quote, so pardon me if my low intellect somehow allowed me to conflate two different discussions (which I don't think actually happened, but whatever):

 

But do you what a plethora is ?

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Posted
Just now, hobbes2702 said:

If Trump wins, why would there be a peaceful transition of power in ‘29 when there wasn’t one in 21’?

It may not have been all that peaceful, but there was a transition of power. Should be fun, though.

 

Posted
10 minutes ago, HOOKEM4 said:

Did they not do this the...what...2 times they actually had control of the WH/Senate/House? Then the repubs screamed deficit (they created and dems reduced) only to have all positive momentum unraveled because people voted republican? Then we cut taxes for the very people who did not need it, ran up insane deficits, rinse repeat? It is tiresome.

You get elected to do things for the coalition that elects you. You don’t get to do things unless and until you win elections, and if you want to keep the ground you gain, you have to keep winning. True for people who want things to get worse also. 

Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, rage-a-holic said:

Wait...a VP who previously made demeaning comments about the Presidential candidate that picked him for the slot?

THIS HAS NEVER HAPPENED IN US HISTORY!!!!!!! OUTRAGE!!!!!

Also, imagine trying to dismiss a politician privately calling his own party the party of "low-income, low-education whites" and saying that the leader of the GOP is, at best, a useful idiot and, at worst, Hitler as normal political banter. 

Jesus fucking Christ man, have some fucking pride.

Edited by aggie08
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Posted
26 minutes ago, Rex Kramer said:

That was C-Man, you conflating ballsack

What the hell did I do?

 

11 minutes ago, The Hot Dog Buffet said:

There won't be an election in '28, though.

Was coming here to post this myself.

 

8 minutes ago, Rex Kramer said:

Yes there will. At some point we will have civil war and government tyrannical overreach.  Doomers here will be very pleased to see a peaceful transition of power in Jan ‘29. Or maybe they won’t because they want to be pissed and see drama. 

So you're saying we're headed to civil war and tyrannical government overreach somewhere down the road but there will be an election in '28 and a peaceful transition of power in Jan '29? I hope you're right but ...

i-dont-believe-you-whatever.gif

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

You get elected to do things for the coalition that elects you. You don’t get to do things unless and until you win elections, and if you want to keep the ground you gain, you have to keep winning. True for people who want things to get worse also. 

The issue is and always has been the message is weak. The facts don't match reality. We have been encouraged my entire life to look down and not up. Now we are looking down and at a fucking color. Once teams were solidified, it was over. You cannot have a team in life. You have to look at things objectively and admit that you may have been wrong and adjust. We lost that somewhere in the 80s and it has been downhill since then.

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Posted

I need a coconut tree to improve the context in which I live. Gonna resort to metaphysics and channel the ancestors to help guide America through this tumultuous era.  I have been drinking. 

Posted
2 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Also, imagine trying to dismiss a politician privately calling his own party the party of "low-income, low-education whites" and saying that the leader of the GOP is, at best, a useful idiot and, at worst, Hitler as normal political banter. 

Jesus fucking Christ man, have some fucking pride.

What the fuck does "having pride" mean here? I'm not defending Trump, I'm laughing/commenting over the histrionic posts about Vance hating on Trump. VP picks talking shit about the nominee is not new. And referring to Trump as "Hitler" is pretty standard these days.

Posted
4 minutes ago, rage-a-holic said:

And referring to Trump as "Hitler" is pretty standard these days.

Usually not from Republicans.

Have some pride that Vance thinks GOP voters are basically rubes, and you're sitting here like, "Oh, that's just politics."

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

If Trump wins, why would there be a peaceful transition of power in ‘29 when there wasn’t one in 21’?

Maybe not "peaceful" in the sense that the Republicans immediately acknowledge reality, ala the Conservative part in the UK earlier this month, but also not another January 6th.  I would think in that sense a "peaceful" transition happens in '29.

Trump would have served his two terms, spent that last four years making sure he wouldn't be dragged into court for whatever self enriching shenanigans he pulled, and can then continue grifting his base for as long as he stays alive.  He would quickly call whoever the Republicans nominated a weak loser that couldn't maintain what he built, and wash his hands of it.  He'd also spin that into being a consultant for the Republican party for the foreseeable future at a premium price, and his base would take the bait hook, line, and sinker.

 

Edited by Captain Obvious
Posted
Just now, aggie08 said:

Usually not from Republicans.

Have some pride that Vance thinks GOP voters are basically rubes, and you're sitting here like, "Oh, that's just politics."

Sure, I'm gonna lose sleep about a politician thinking their party is full of rubes and useful idiots, because that's strictly a Republican thing. 

Posted
1 minute ago, rage-a-holic said:

Sure, I'm gonna lose sleep about a politician thinking their party is full of rubes and useful idiots, because that's strictly a Republican thing. 

Maybe it's just me, but I wouldn't then vote for that person. Your mileage may vary.

Posted
1 hour ago, aggie08 said:

A huge consequence of the shooting is that the conversation and pressure for him to step aside are effectively over (until his next major fuck up). 

It will be back after the Republican convention. 

Posted
1 minute ago, aggie08 said:

Usually not from Republicans.

Have some pride that Vance thinks GOP voters are basically rubes, and you're sitting here like, "Oh, that's just politics."

It doesn't matter as long as they convince the rubes to vote Republican. But make no mistake - the Republican Party exists to protect the rich. That's it. Everything else is ancillary. They don't actually believe all that culture war bullshit.

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Posted
1 minute ago, WhatTheBuck said:

It will be back after the Republican convention. 

They missed their perfect chance to do the switch during the Republican convention.  Biden could have resigned effective immediately tonight making Kamala the president.  That would have taken all the press from the Republican Convention.  Then, every night Kamala could have done a press conference about something for the next few nights taking more eyes away from the Republican convention.  The night Trump is speaking she could have announced she is legalizing weed nationally during Trump's speech. It could have been greatness. 

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Posted
1 hour ago, Vegas64 said:

I guess I'll read Hillbilly Elegy now, just to see what exactly this guys has in experiences or what informs this Vice President's beliefs. I think it should be more or less an honest fascimile, given it was published before he was famous and/or a politician, right? By all accounts this guy was a reasonable guy (e.g. despised Trump, intelligent by way of Yale/law and not being born into it) but sold out for selfish ambition?

Here's a link to his Atlantic piece I mentioned. If it doesn't work, let me know, and I'll copy/paste the full text.

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Posted
6 minutes ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

They missed their perfect chance to do the switch during the Republican convention.  Biden could have resigned effective immediately tonight making Kamala the president.  That would have taken all the press from the Republican Convention.  Then, every night Kamala could have done a press conference about something for the next few nights taking more eyes away from the Republican convention.  The night Trump is speaking she could have announced she is legalizing weed nationally during Trump's speech. It could have been greatness. 

You wouldn’t give the Republicans the platform of the convention to campaign against your new candidate. You’d let them play their hand first then make your move. They’d scream bloody murder but it would be too late. 

Posted

Vance is dangerous in a unique way, not because he helps in the polls but because he is the distillation of undisciplined populist Trumpism into high-proof American authoritarianism. 
 

He has literally been groomed by our worst elites for this role; to cover unadulterated elite autocracy with a veneer of angry white American resentment. He reliably and readily sides with all of our nations’ worst enemies and wants to form common cause with them. He is devoid of any moral compass, and his prior criticism of Trump was only at a moment when he and his groomers believed Trump’s indiscipline served as a hindrance rather than a vehicle to further their own crystalline authoritarianism. 
 

He is young and he is being anointed as the successor to refine and develop DJT’s cult of personality into rigid and systematic juche for the next generations. 

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Posted
4 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Vance is dangerous in a unique way, not because he helps in the polls but because he is the distillation of undisciplined populist Trumpism into high-proof American authoritarianism. 
 

He has literally been groomed by our worst elites for this role; to cover unadulterated elite autocracy with a veneer of angry white American resentment. He reliably and readily sides with all of our nations’ worst enemies and wants to form common cause with them. He is devoid of any moral compass, and his prior criticism of Trump was only at a moment when he and his groomers believed Trump’s indiscipline served as a hindrance rather than a vehicle to further their own crystalline authoritarianism. 
 

He is young and he is being anointed as the successor to refine and develop DJT’s cult of personality into rigid and systematic juche for the next generations. 

...and he's really fucking goofy looking too!

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Posted
5 hours ago, C-Man said:

(Forget the fact the shooter Biden and the "Deep State" chose was booted from his HS rifle team for being such a terrible shot.)

That's actually perfectly on-brand for the DNC/Democratic Party.

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Posted
58 minutes ago, Captain Obvious said:

Maybe not "peaceful" in the sense that the Republicans immediately acknowledge reality, ala the Conservative part in the UK earlier this month, but also not another January 6th.  I would think in that sense a "peaceful" transition happens in '29.

Trump would have served his two terms, spent that last four years making sure he wouldn't be dragged into court for whatever self enriching shenanigans he pulled, and can then continue grifting his base for as long as he stays alive.  He would quickly call whoever the Republicans nominated a weak loser that couldn't maintain what he built, and wash his hands of it.  He'd also spin that into being a consultant for the Republican party for the foreseeable future at a premium price, and his base would take the bait hook, line, and sinker.

 

It’s not just about Trump at this point. The Republican Party has been pretty open about their disinterest in accepting elections going forward. 
I also don’t see any reason that Trump gives a shit about the two terms and I imagine scotus can lie their way into any ruling they want at this point. 
If Trump said nah fuck all that, what mechanism is actually going to stop him? He committed a fucking coup last time and he’s running again. Our system doesn’t seem to be willing or able to do anything about someone just ignoring the law. 

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Posted
46 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Vance is dangerous in a unique way, not because he helps in the polls but because he is the distillation of undisciplined populist Trumpism into high-proof American authoritarianism. 
 

He has literally been groomed by our worst elites for this role; to cover unadulterated elite autocracy with a veneer of angry white American resentment. He reliably and readily sides with all of our nations’ worst enemies and wants to form common cause with them. He is devoid of any moral compass, and his prior criticism of Trump was only at a moment when he and his groomers believed Trump’s indiscipline served as a hindrance rather than a vehicle to further their own crystalline authoritarianism. 
 

He is young and he is being anointed as the successor to refine and develop DJT’s cult of personality into rigid and systematic juche for the next generations. 

Vance as president would be a puppet for Peter Thiel. 

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Posted

I guess I'm not as convinced as many are of Trump being killed this past weekend touching off some sustaining civil war.    Would it have touched off stupid people running out and committing violence?  Absolutely yes but at the moment the government apparatus and military is still very much under Biden's control and I think stuff would be snuffed out.  So local violence but the mostly older and smaller demographics of MAGA isn't sustaining any "rebellion".  

What I think is a much more likely touch off of any sustaining conflict is if Trump becomes President and starts putting his boot down hardcore and the much younger, much larger segments of society begin to react....that's when shit gets real.  

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Posted
Just now, Surly Bevo said:

I guess I'm not as convinced as many are of Trump being killed this past weekend touching off some sustaining civil war.    Would it have touched off stupid people running out and committing violence?  Absolutely yes but at the moment the government apparatus and military is still very much under Biden's control and I think stuff would be snuffed out.  So local violence but the mostly older and smaller demographics of MAGA isn't sustaining any "rebellion".  

What I think is a much more likely touch off of any sustaining conflict is if Trump becomes President and starts putting his boot down hardcore and the much younger, much larger segments of society begin to react....that's when shit gets real.  

It would take 60s level civil unrest at a minimum and we are nowhere close to that. That's not to say it won't happen.

Posted
1 minute ago, Surly Bevo said:

I guess I'm not as convinced as many are of Trump being killed this past weekend touching off some sustaining civil war.    Would it have touched off stupid people running out and committing violence?  Absolutely yes but at the moment the government apparatus and military is still very much under Biden's control and I think stuff would be snuffed out.  So local violence but the mostly older and smaller demographics of MAGA isn't sustaining any "rebellion".  

What I think is a much more likely touch off of any sustaining conflict is if Trump becomes President and starts putting his boot down hardcore and the much younger, much larger segments of society begin to react....that's when shit gets real.  

Yeah, probably not a great treatment to the shape of our country that I totally agree with you that another Trump presidency brings us closer to civil war than a Trump assassination.

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Posted
1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

It doesn't matter as long as they convince the rubes to vote Republican. But make no mistake - the Republican Party exists to protect the rich. That's it. Everything else is ancillary. They don't actually believe all that culture war bullshit.

It's very clearly a haves vs have nots thing.  We all like to point out the constant racist bullshit they spew, but it's actually a big tent.  If you vote for us, we really don't give a fuck what you are.  Just tell us how you also hate librulllzzzzz.  Capitalism run amok.  

Also, it's why you see so many latinos in FL etc voting for Trump.  They all know exactly what it's about.  Not a huge secret, but still mind boggling how many they fool into voting against their own interests.  

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Posted

It is a bizarre statement but I'm strongly surprised she laid blame at the feet of the correct party.  She seems like the type that peel off the 20-30% Democrat vote in a place like WV or similar states/counties.  Saying what she needs to say so that she's not ostracized by her friends and family who are assumed predominately MAGA after having lost her husband.



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