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Hornius Emeritus

Jevan Snead story

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5 minutes ago, GreenspointTexas said:

Thanks for sharing

 

I didn't realize how brutal that hit during the game against Okie State was. That was one of the most violent impacts I have seen. Hard to believe he came back and played in the 4th quarter.

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Not that I had a choice having all girls but if I had a son, there's no way in hell I would've let my him play football. Shit is not worth it for the long term well being of any individual.

I remember when Ed Cunningham quit ESPN and announcing college football games over CTE. At the time, I thought it was dumb and naive to think that it made any difference. It still doesn't but at least he knows he's no longer part of the problem. 

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1) Very sad story

2) That hit would be a penalty today, both in CFB and in the NFL... even though a lot of us of a certain age were told to play that way, I think these changes are for the better 

3) There's no way his dad just organically decided to move to Stephenville and the first time they ever met aggy Chad was when he enrolled in high school

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Some bodies aren't suited to the sport.  Maybe someday science will find a screen for athletes who want to play brain danger sports.  

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I think football is either going to change massively or go away.  It just isn’t worth it.  Makes me feel a bit guilty for loving the sport so much.  No way I’d let my son play. No way.  

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I don't believe I will let my son play football. 

Enjoy football while it lasts boys.  

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25 minutes ago, PRONG HORN said:

Some bodies aren't suited to the sport.  Maybe someday science will find a screen for athletes who want to play brain danger sports.  

No human body is made to take the abuse from these kinds of hits, especially on a regular basis. Most are fortunate the resulting damage isn’t worse, but there are consequences to every player to some degree.

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I remember posting back on Hornfans that I wasn’t impressed by blindsided hits because they were like sucker punches. I was ridiculed by a few of the tough guys. 

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24 minutes ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

I remember posting back on Hornfans that I wasn’t impressed by blindsided hits because they were like sucker punches. I was ridiculed by a few of the tough guys. 

I have always thought this as well. 

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Sad story.

 

Was watching Last Chance U and some Mississippi codger said they ought to take the face masks off.  Said that would eliminate most of the head-to-head contact and  . . .  some other stuff about how tough guys think they are.  I think he might be right on the former.

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I’m surprised there haven’t been states that have banned tackle football yet for HS and younger. 

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12 minutes ago, 4th&Five said:

I’m surprised there haven’t been states that have banned tackle football yet for HS and younger. 

So, quidditch - but no brooms?

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3 hours ago, Hornius Emeritus said:

If it became more like rugby or flag football would you still watch 

yes

I don't watch to see guys get drilled. I watch for the crazy athletic plays on or with the ball

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Listened to a 30-40 min podcast from the NYT this week about a doctor in marshall pushing to ban tackle football 7th grade and younger. Looks like he was successful through the school board for a few years, but of course that didn’t last long. Pretty interesting read/listen, especially being from the area originally: 

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/16/sports/youth-tackle-football-marshall-texas.html

edit to add, this doctor guy has some pretty great East Texas colloquialisms is you find the podcast to listen to.  

Edited by Etexhorn13

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I think football is either going to change massively or go away.  It just isn’t worth it.  Makes me feel a bit guilty for loving the sport so much.  No way I’d let my son play. No way.  
I have a kid who just turned 11 in october and is already 5'3" and loves football and is studying the TE position hard on YT. We play catch 5 times a week. I know, yawn. Probably 5 other dads on my street doing the same.

I see where you are coming from, but I don't want to crush his dreams. Wants to play for either texas or tcu (mom) but wants to play. Need to work on the mean streak now though.

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I remember Jevan not being drafted as a bit of a surprise. I wonder now if he underperformed in interviews, mental and psychological evaluations, Wonderlic, etc. 

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i don't know if football will go away, or if it needs to. i kind of think of it like other high risk hobbies/sports (skydiving, handgliding, base jumping) and professions (commercial fishing, law enforcement, logging, etc).

the difference with football is obviously the the potential 'glory' and of course paycheck if you reach the highest level. 

education is key - making sure those that choose it KNOW what the risks are, completely. and childhood...i could see getting to the point where tackle ball at lower levels is prohibited, where players themselves make an educated decision later in life whether they want to move to 'tackle' ball.

but...i suspect there's also a good chance that many of these athletes, particularly those that came from poor families, where they may be the first and only chance to go to college and pull their family out of poverty, buy their mama a house finally...i bet a good number of those guys, even knowing the risk, would make the decision to do it anyway. i mean, those are different stories from the Jevans and Colts and Sams...

they really are modern day gladiators. 

i don't know if i'm articulating my point well enough...like, a kid looking at a lifetime of struggle...or hey, i'm really good at this, i can take this risk and possibly make a shit ton of money and lift my family out of poverty. or at the very least, get a good education and be the first in my family to attend college and have a good career.

it's a tough call. i really think education is key and should be mandatory.

maybe it already is? if so, then that kind of proves my point.

 

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I played tackle football from age 7 (I was a huge 7 year old) to age 17 when I was passed athletically by guys who could play at the next level. My middle son played from 7th grade through high school and could have played longer, though not at the highest level, and decided not to. I love the physical aspect of the game, but I was glad he decided he was done. Both of us sustained multiple concussions playing. All of that being said, I would still do it again, and would still allow him to decide for himself, if he wanted to play. It was a fundamental part of my experience growing up. Being a big kid, other sports are frustrating. Football is the sport where your shear size and strength can make you valuable. Along with the changes to the game there needs to be a reality check on the adults who treat high school football as a religion. In the town we lived in, my kid and his team mates were elevated to hero status, by a football crazed culture. It all adds in to it.

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I remember the news stories with the headline about 100% of NFL players in a study had CTE.  What was more shocking to me was that of players in the study who went no further than the college level, 90% of them had brains showing CTE.  Not a Jr Seau having played decades in the NFL.  People who had played high school and college ball only.  Maybe some pee wee and jr high ball.

There was a selection bias to be sure (relatives had to donate a loved-one’s brain posthumously and probably only did so if they had suspicions), but it still seems like you are running a heck of a risk playing football.  Even if the rate across all players at the college level winds up being low, if you lose the CTE lottery like Jevan looks to have, your life is completely wasted.

My kids are not playing football and we actively discourage the notion.

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I didn't have a son but my mind has changed over the years from thinking I wouldn't encourage him to play but let him if he wanted to,  to just not letting him play at all.  

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2 hours ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

I remember Jevan not being drafted as a bit of a surprise. I wonder now if he underperformed in interviews, mental and psychological evaluations, Wonderlic, etc. 

He had a terrible season before he went pro.  124 pass rating.  20 interceptions.  I was not surprised at all.  Also, he just was never very accurate.  55% completion rate in college.

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Sad story, but I think the story seems to have a couple inaccuracies in it.  Repeatedly characterizing the hit in the Cotton Bowl as a "helmet to helmet" hit is wrong.  He was hit on the shoulder, driven off his feet, and landed on the side of his head.  It was his head slamming into the ground that caused his helmet to come off and the concussion.

I also question this part of the article:

"Snead chose UT after graduating from high school in 2006. He believed famed quarterback Vince Young would be with the team for at least another year, giving him time to train and position himself to replace him."

I seem to recall that he originally committed to Florida, and it was only AFTER Vince announced for the NFL, AND Florida signed Tim Tebow that Jevan flipped to Texas.  Am I misremembering this?

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We won’t let our boys play Pee Wee. There’s just no reason for it. My 7th grader played tackle for first time this season and loved it. He’s a big kid (5’8” at 12) and just loved being able to block/tackle etc. 

Not sure how far he’ll want to go but it for him was a really good experience and one he truly enjoyed. 

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That's a very sad read.  And it's scary for me too.  I played tackle football for 6 years and suffered many injuries, including multiple concussions.  Now I struggle to walk and move about.  My orthopedist calls me the Noah's Ark of injuries because I have 2 of everything.  I was a defensive tackle and played the position very physically, including using my helmet as a weapon every play.  Back then, I was taught to put your facemask in the opponent's earhole when making a tackle and I also used my helmet inflict pain on blockers to help shed the block.  I would come home from games with severe headaches that wouldn't go away.  To go to sleep, I would lay on my back and hum loudly because that was the only way to get the pain to subside.  I thought little of it at the time, but now I have severe memory issues, much like was described in the article.  I used to have a great memory with the ability to retain tons of details.  Now I can't remember what I had for lunch an hour later.  A few years ago I had a MRI and was diagnosed with cerebral atrophy, which is a marker for dementia and possibly CTE.  I loved the experience of playing and still love the game today, but if I had a son, I would be super hesitant to let him play football now.  I'm sure with the information we now have, we can create new technologies and new techniques to mitigate many of the risks, but I'm not sure that even that is enough to make it worth the price you pay down the line.

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My kids are going to play golf. 

Football will be around for a while, but head injuries aren't going away. At some point it will lead to the demise of football. 

Oh well, I'll still be golfing. 

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48 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

He had a terrible season before he went pro.  124 pass rating.  20 interceptions.  I was not surprised at all.  Also, he just was never very accurate.  55% completion rate in college.

He didn't even really have an impressive SO year either.  All his hype pretty much centered around beating Florida and everyone assuming he'll take a giant step forward the next year.

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Sad story, but I think the story seems to have a couple inaccuracies in it.  Repeatedly characterizing the hit in the Cotton Bowl as a "helmet to helmet" hit is wrong.  He was hit on the shoulder, driven off his feet, and landed on the side of his head.  It was his head slamming into the ground that caused his helmet to come off and the concussion.
I also question this part of the article:
"Snead chose UT after graduating from high school in 2006. He believed famed quarterback Vince Young would be with the team for at least another year, giving him time to train and position himself to replace him."
I seem to recall that he originally committed to Florida, and it was only AFTER Vince announced for the NFL, AND Florida signed Tim Tebow that Jevan flipped to Texas.  Am I misremembering this?

That’s how I remember it too, and he transferred to Ole Miss when it was clear he wasn’t going to beat out Colt.

Some revisionist history in that article.

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Snead committed to Texas in the fall of 2005 a couple months before VY declared.  He was a spring enrollee, IIRC.  I think it is fair to say he probably thought VY would return for his senior year and then he would have a chance to battle Colt for the starting job in the Spring of 2007, lessening Colt's advantage of system familiarity.

I also recall Snead decommitted Florida not because Tebow committed.  But because Urban Meyer lied to him and told him that Tebow was committing as a linebacker, not a QB.

Colt had a pretty fantastic year before getting hurt late and had the job sewn up.  

Found a source on the Urban Meyer thing:

 

Just Funny: You can't tell the story about Jevan Snead enough (recounted in the book Meat Market).  The funniest thing I read in it concerned what Urban Meyer told Jevan Snead.  Snead had watched the Outside the Lines special on Tebow, which showed Meyer and OC Dan Mullen in the stands.  Problem was, Meyer had told Snead, committed at the time, that he was the only quarterback they were going after.

When Snead asked Meyer about it, Meyer responded, "We are recruiting him for linebacker."  I had heard that before, but got a big kick out of reading it in the book straight from Snead.

Edited by Johnny Sack

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4 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

He had a terrible season before he went pro.  124 pass rating.  20 interceptions.  I was not surprised at all.  Also, he just was never very accurate.  55% completion rate in college.

13-23 for 168 yards and 3 INTs in that final game in the Cotton Bowl certainly didn't suggest a pro future. There were rumors at the time that he had some serious interpersonal issues relating to his former GF at Ole Miss that may've led him to declare for the draft early.

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4 hours ago, Liquor and Poker said:

I remember being certain we were going to be fine after Vince Young because we'd recruited Jevan Snead.

With signing day approaching in 2005, i think most of us felt good post-Vince,  b/c of the kid from LA. (Reserve, LA).  When he de-committed at the HS All-Star game, Snead as a fall back really didnt register, I may be misrembering. 

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13 minutes ago, jdhorn92 said:

With signing day approaching in 2005, i think most of us felt good post-Vince,  b/c of the kid from LA. (Reserve, LA).  When he de-committed at the HS All-Star game, Snead as a fall back really didnt register, I may be misrembering. 

Snead was in the next class. Colt was in the class with Perrilloux.

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Folks on this board are still bitching about the pussification of football. 

The hit in the video wasn’t that bad. What was bad is his head slamming into the ground and bouncing like it did

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The hit in the video wasn’t that bad. What was bad is his head slamming into the ground and bouncing like it did

Exactly.

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Looked like helmet to helmet from that sideline view to me, then also head to ground.

And I’m not going to lie, all this info coming out about cte makes me question continuing to follow and support football.

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Without diminishing the importance of CTE, I get the impression that Jevan was dealing with some untreated mental illness of possibly unrelated origin.

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