The Rudy Thread

[Francisco 2.0 31567]

https://lawandcrime.com/uncategorized/rudy-giuliani-begs-bankruptcy-court-to-let-him-keep-his-florida-condo-so-he-can-keep-podcasting-to-pay-creditors/

 

Rudy Giuliani begs bankruptcy court to let him keep his Florida condo so he can keep podcasting to pay creditors

 

Quote

When Rudy Giuliani defamed two poll workers with bunk allegations of election fraud in 2020, it triggered a wave of threats so acute, one of the workers was forced to flee her longtime home in Georgia. Now, the ally to former President Donald Trump — and his co-defendant in the racketeering case in Fulton County — is experiencing some domicile difficulties of his own.

In a motion filed Thursday, Giuliani, who owes election workers Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss $148 million for defaming them, asked a bankruptcy court in the Southern District of New York to let him keep his Florida condominium, valued at $3.5 million, as he fights the judgment on appeal.

 

Quote

The former New York mayor’s attorneys wrote in the 12-page motion that the recommendation by the Committee on Unsecured Creditors that he sell the home since declaring bankruptcy was premature.

“It appears that the Committee is assuming that most if not all of the Freeman judgment will survive on appeal, and is proceeding as if all of the Debtor’s assets need to be liquidated now to satisfy a potentially inflated claim. The debtor could be irreparably harmed if the Florida residence is sold and later it turns out that the Freeman judgment is vacated,” the instant motion states.

The committee told him there was “no legal basis” for him to keep the property.

 

Quote

Giuliani does not oppose the sale of his property in Manhattan, however. That property could be sold so he could make his primary residence in Florida, he contends. His lawyers noted that the New York property is expected to be listed by Sotheby’s soon for $5 million.

With that home sold, Giuliani said he expects “his monthly expenseswill be significantly reduced.”

 

 

Spoiler

Though he claims creditors are accusing him of operating with “reckless abandon and improper judgment” in his attempt to hold onto the Florida property, Giuliani says he is “using sound business judgment” by acknowledging that one property must be sold while he keeps the other to “grow his broadcast income,” the motion states.

Debtors should not be forced to sell property where there is a “valid business justification,” he argues.

And as bankruptcy proceedings have been underway in recent weeks, Giuliani has emphasized repeatedly that his income flows from those broadcasting and podcasting businesses. As Law&Crime previously reported, the podcasts include Common Sense, which is distributed through YouTube, Rumble and Spike, as well as Uncovering the Truth, and The Rudy Giuliani Show. Giuliani streams those podcasts live on Instagram.

“Once the New York apartment is sold, the debtor will need a place to operate the Podcast from if he is to earn any money therefrom, the only remaining location would be from the Florida Condominium. The debtor is actually saving money as he does not need to pay for and maintain both a Podcast studio and his residence in both New York City and Florida,” his attorneys wrote.

In fact, they added, it was that income, and whatever future income he may earn, that would “only serve to benefit creditors.”

How profitable those future podcasts may be could be a bit unpredictable. Giuliani is still working to remain relevant on right-wing sites, though. To wit, on Thursday night during an appearance on the Rob Schmitt Tonight program for Newsmax, Giuliani railed about the judge overseeing Trump’s defamation case with writer E. Jean Carroll. He called the judge a “disgrace” and continued with his take on the judge’s findings.

“[Trump] was found not liable for rape,” he said. “It was sexual assault. Not rape. And second, you can be guilty of rape and still a person could be a whacko. That was the defamation — you’re allowed to defend yourself against defamation.”

Carroll claimed Trump raped and sexually assaulted her in a dressing room in the 1990s and at trial, she said he used both his fingers and penis to do so. The jury found he had only used his fingers, causing both immediate pain as well as long-lasting emotional psychological harm, as Law&Crime previously reported, but presiding Judge Lewis Kaplan explained even though jurors had not found Trump “raped” her under the technical definition — New York state law limits rape to the insertion of the penis into a person’s vagina — it “does not mean that she failed to prove Mr. Trump ‘raped’ her as many people commonly understand the word ‘rape.'”

“Indeed, as the evidence at trial recounted below makes clear, the jury found Mr. Trump in fact did exactly that,” Lewis wrote.

The “whacko” reference by Giuliani echoes similar commentary Trump used to describe Carroll in a 2022 deposition when he called her a “whack job” and “sick.” That deposition was played for jurors at the this year defamation trial and when asked by attorneys if he stood behind it in 2024, Trump replied: “100%.”

A spokesperson for Giuliani did not immediately respond to a request for comment Friday.

 

[Biff Tannen 44917]

Not dead. Disappointing bump. 

[Shut up Lou Holtz 1976]

41 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

Not dead. Disappointing bump. 

This 

[Underdog 27966]

Wait…. Rudy could be homeless… in Florida?  Bad timing, Rudy. 
 

On 3/24/2024 at 11:42 AM, tchookem said:

On 3/24/2024 at 10:26 AM, Bullneck said:

I mean, why don't they just sleep in their house?

 

[Bookman 4550]

On 3/17/2024 at 8:42 PM, Bullneck said:

Spotted in the wild while driving in Philly a couple of days ago.  Those were the salad days . . . 

 

[AnTiM 1629]

11 hours ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

https://lawandcrime.com/uncategorized/rudy-giuliani-begs-bankruptcy-court-to-let-him-keep-his-florida-condo-so-he-can-keep-podcasting-to-pay-creditors/

 

Rudy Giuliani begs bankruptcy court to let him keep his Florida condo so he can keep podcasting to pay creditors

 

 

 

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Though he claims creditors are accusing him of operating with “reckless abandon and improper judgment” in his attempt to hold onto the Florida property, Giuliani says he is “using sound business judgment” by acknowledging that one property must be sold while he keeps the other to “grow his broadcast income,” the motion states.

Debtors should not be forced to sell property where there is a “valid business justification,” he argues.

And as bankruptcy proceedings have been underway in recent weeks, Giuliani has emphasized repeatedly that his income flows from those broadcasting and podcasting businesses. As Law&Crime previously reported, the podcasts include Common Sense, which is distributed through YouTube, Rumble and Spike, as well as Uncovering the Truth, and The Rudy Giuliani Show. Giuliani streams those podcasts live on Instagram.

“Once the New York apartment is sold, the debtor will need a place to operate the Podcast from if he is to earn any money therefrom, the only remaining location would be from the Florida Condominium. The debtor is actually saving money as he does not need to pay for and maintain both a Podcast studio and his residence in both New York City and Florida,” his attorneys wrote.

In fact, they added, it was that income, and whatever future income he may earn, that would “only serve to benefit creditors.”

How profitable those future podcasts may be could be a bit unpredictable. Giuliani is still working to remain relevant on right-wing sites, though. To wit, on Thursday night during an appearance on the Rob Schmitt Tonight program for Newsmax, Giuliani railed about the judge overseeing Trump’s defamation case with writer E. Jean Carroll. He called the judge a “disgrace” and continued with his take on the judge’s findings.

“[Trump] was found not liable for rape,” he said. “It was sexual assault. Not rape. And second, you can be guilty of rape and still a person could be a whacko. That was the defamation — you’re allowed to defend yourself against defamation.”

Carroll claimed Trump raped and sexually assaulted her in a dressing room in the 1990s and at trial, she said he used both his fingers and penis to do so. The jury found he had only used his fingers, causing both immediate pain as well as long-lasting emotional psychological harm, as Law&Crime previously reported, but presiding Judge Lewis Kaplan explained even though jurors had not found Trump “raped” her under the technical definition — New York state law limits rape to the insertion of the penis into a person’s vagina — it “does not mean that she failed to prove Mr. Trump ‘raped’ her as many people commonly understand the word ‘rape.'”

“Indeed, as the evidence at trial recounted below makes clear, the jury found Mr. Trump in fact did exactly that,” Lewis wrote.

The “whacko” reference by Giuliani echoes similar commentary Trump used to describe Carroll in a 2022 deposition when he called her a “whack job” and “sick.” That deposition was played for jurors at the this year defamation trial and when asked by attorneys if he stood behind it in 2024, Trump replied: “100%.”

A spokesperson for Giuliani did not immediately respond to a request for comment Friday.

 

Beg for mercy, you crooked bastard.  Maybe somebody will hand you something to end your useless life with.

[Red Five 40108]

Hope it was worth it Rudy. Whatever "it" was. 

[C-Man 26535]

1 hour ago, Red Five said:

Hope it was worth it Rudy. Whatever "it" was. 

[Jack Straw 2953]

16 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

Not dead. Disappointing bump. 

while Rudy (or Trump, or any other Republican officeholder or Republican voter, for that matter) dying would certainly be worth celebrating, watching Republicans’ lives be completely destroyed in real time is a delicious consolation.  

[tx 3 putt 74766]

 

[C-Man 26535]

 

Pieces of shit. All of them.

Please start dying. Pretty please. With sugar on top.

[Dnaguy 11538]

9 hours ago, tx 3 putt said:

 

[WhatTheBuck 28574]

1 hour ago, Dnaguy said:

Do you pop out at parties? Are you unpoopular?

[atomheartbevo 88750]

2 hours ago, Dnaguy said:

 

Which redhead did it better.  I’m going with Bryce Dallas Chastain.

[Bookman 4550]

Indicted in Arizona. https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/politics/elections/2024/04/24/rudy-giuliani-mark-meadows-among-7-indicted-in-arizona-trump-fake-electors-but-not-yet-named/73446921007/

I hope this motherfucker dies in prison. 

[WhatTheBuck 28574]

1 hour ago, Bookman said:

I hope this motherfucker dies in prison. 

But not too soon. He deserves to be miserable and humiliated for awhile. 

[BamaATL 15728]

19 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

But not too soon. He deserves to be miserable and humiliated for awhile. 

I don't think he'll really notice.  He's been doing that on his own for at least a decade.  

[Disco Strangler 1865]

I hope that he trips and falls while walking past a stable of Clydesdale horses, rips the rear seat of his britches, and is fucked to death in the ass by every stallion in the barn. The only acceptable end to America's mare. 

[TeeDubya 3275]

2 hours ago, Disco Strangler said:

I hope that he trips and falls while walking past a stable of Clydesdale horses, rips the rear seat of his britches, and is fucked to death in the ass by every stallion in the barn. The only acceptable end to America's mare. 

Whelp, we’ve finally found the perfect reply for the “prepare your anus” reaction. 

[atomheartbevo 88750]

10 hours ago, Disco Strangler said:

I hope that he trips and falls while walking past a stable of Clydesdale horses, rips the rear seat of his britches, and is fucked to death in the ass by every stallion in the barn. The only acceptable end to America's mare. 

[Francisco 2.0 31567]

 

 

 

[bolverk 28885]

🎶 A message to you, Rudy! 🎶

Spoiler

Giuliani’s Spending: $43,000 a Month and a Lot of Credit Card Bills
Rudy Giuliani promised a bankruptcy court that he would limit his spending, but it didn’t take long before he broke that pledge, and by a lot.

Besieged by creditors and with his income drying up, Rudolph W. Giuliani laid out an austerity program of sorts in January for a federal bankruptcy court.

He would stick to a $43,000-a-month budget, he said in court filings, roughly in line with the income he drew from his retirement accounts and Social Security. That amount would cover, among other expenses, $5,000 in alimony payments to his ex-wife Judith Giuliani, $1,050 for food and housekeeping supplies and $425 for “personal care products and services.” He was also obliged to cover $13,500 in monthly nursing-home expenses for his former mother-in-law; she died in March.

Suggesting that he was mindful of the $153 million he owes to creditors, including two Georgia election workers he defamed in the aftermath of the 2020 election, he budgeted nothing for entertainment, clubs and subscriptions.

It did not take him long to blow his budget. In another bankruptcy filing, he said he actually spent nearly $120,000 in January. The accounting of his spending that he provided to the court was spotty and incomplete. He later provided more information to the creditors’ lawyers, listing 60 transactions on Amazon, multiple entertainment subscriptions, various Apple services and products, Uber rides and payment of some of his business partner’s personal credit card bill.

It is not clear whether he has pared back his spending to within his budget in the months since January, because he has failed to submit required disclosures to the bankruptcy court. But his spending, and his inability or unwillingness to give the bankruptcy court a fuller look at his financial status, have left his creditors suspicious and angry.

“These superfluous court filings are simply part of a larger effort to bully and intimidate the mayor through lawfare and a public smear campaign,” Mr. Giuliani’s spokesman, Ted Goodman, said.

Spoiler

Once the mayor of New York City and later the personal lawyer to former President Donald J. Trump, Mr. Giuliani filed for bankruptcy in December after a federal judge ordered him to pay $148 million to the two Georgia election workers for falsely accusing them of rigging the outcome in President Biden’s favor. (Mr. Giuliani plans to appeal that judgment.)

His filing listed $11 million in assets, including his Upper East Side apartment, which he put on the market last year for $6.5 million, took off the market this winter and plans to re-list, and his condo in Palm Beach, Fla., which he valued at $3.5 million.

Months into the bankruptcy proceedings, Mr. Giuliani’s financial disclosures have been incomplete, inaccurate and in some cases completely absent. His creditors have asked for more details and clarifications, hired a forensic accounting firm and made a broad request for information to see if he is hiding money and assets.

The creditors’ lawyers recently issued a slew of subpoenas for documents, communications and information to Mr. Giuliani, people who work or have worked for him and even his son.

Every additional penny that can be found in Mr. Giuliani’s pocket means a larger payout for his creditors, even if it is far less than what he actually owes them.

That is why they also want him to collect $2 million that Mr. Giuliani claims he is owed in legal fees from Mr. Trump for the work he did leading the effort to overturn the 2020 election results.

Mr. Giuliani lived a fairly frugal life during his mob-busting prosecutor and mayoral days.

“Giuliani and money is a story in and of itself,” said Andrew Kirtzman, who wrote two books on the former mayor. “It begins with him leading a very unpretentious life.”

But after leaving office, Mr. Giuliani began living a very different life, flying on private Gulfstream jets during the lucrative years of his private consulting and investment advisory businesses.

In 2007, when he was running for the Republican presidential nomination, he disclosed that his net worth was more than $30 million. A decade later, he and Judith Giuliani were spending $230,000 a month on their lavish lifestyle, including $7,000 on fountain pens and $12,000 on cigars.

These days, Mr. Giuliani brings in about $550,000 a year through disbursements from his dwindling retirement accounts and Social Security. His creditors want him to sell his properties in New York and Florida. But Mr. Giuliani recently told the bankruptcy court he would like to keep the Florida condo and live in it, suggesting that his creditors would not want him to be homeless.

His creditors are skeptical.

“It seems hardly worth pointing out that there is a vast gulf of housing options available between residing in an approximately $3.5 million Palm Beach condominium and homelessness,” lawyers for the creditors wrote in a court filing.

His creditors also do not trust that he is being honest about the assets he does disclose.

For example, Mr. Giuliani lists among his assets an undisclosed number of shares in Uber, the ride-share service. He declared that he has $30,000 worth of jewelry, but that includes three World Series rings from the New York Yankees that creditors estimate are worth about $15,000 each.

He also failed to disclose a publishing contract for his upcoming book, “The Biden Crime Family.”

“As my mother would say, they don’t trust Giuliani as far as they could throw him,” Bruce A. Markell, a bankruptcy law professor at Northwestern’s Pritzker law school, said of the creditors, based on the actions they have taken in bankruptcy court so far.

His spending report for January was incomplete, with a list of two dozen charges to his American Express card, but no details. Lawyers for the creditors say he provided them a more detailed account, but it was not filed publicly in the court, as missing details typically are. And as of April 26, Mr. Giuliani had not provided details for his Discover card charges in January. The U.S. trustee assigned to his case did not respond to a question about why the additional details were not filed publicly in the court.

One of the two Georgia election workers he defamed, Shaye Moss, was selected by Mr. Giuliani’s creditors to serve on a three-person committee to represent their interests throughout the bankruptcy case.

The other committee members are Noelle Dunphy, a former employee who claims that Mr. Giuliani harassed and assaulted her beginning in 2019; and Lindsey Kurtz, the general counsel at Dominion Voting Systems, one of the largest voting machine vendors in the country, which has accused Mr. Giuliani of peddling falsehoods about it after the 2020 election.

“The committee has no intention of letting the debtor drive his case and the creditors off a cliff,” the lawyers wrote in a recent motion.

Mr. Giuliani entered his bankruptcy proceedings with a poor track record responding to discovery requests. Last year, a federal judge told jurors he intentionally hid information about his finances to shield his assets and make his net worth seem smaller.

In bankruptcy, the debtor has an obligation to disclose all of his assets in such a way that his creditors can understand what he has and the transactions he is making, Professor Markell said. Incomplete filings and failing to file requested material could end with the case being dismissed, which would open a debtor to foreclosures and collections.

“The more there is a pushback and an ignorance of the ability to comply — especially from someone like Giuliani, who is a lawyer — the more concern there is that there is actually something being hidden,” the professor said.

Mr. Giuliani has missed the filing deadlines for his February and March spending reports. Weeks ago, one of Mr. Giuliani’s lawyers, Gary C. Fischoff, said some filings have been delayed because “the accountant got upset at one point and wanted out.”

“He’s calmed down,” the lawyer added, “and we persuaded him to stick with the case.” Mr. Giuliani’s accountants did not respond to a request for comment.

Mr. Giuliani’s unresponsiveness, the creditors said, “leads one to question what he is hiding.”

Bankruptcy law allows creditors to get even older information from the debtor as well as from his associates. Mr. Giuliani’s creditors have asked the court to use this broad discovery request to obtain details about his finances going back to 2019, as well as information from his associates.

This request could unearth details about Mr. Giuliani’s foreign work, which has previously drawn scrutiny from the F.B.I. The forensic accounting team hired by the creditors comprises former intelligence officials with experience in countries where Mr. Giuliani did business, such as Ukraine, Turkey, Venezuela and Qatar.

Mr. Giuliani’s age presents its own challenge to creditors getting paid.

His circumstance differs from that of Alex Jones, 50, the bankrupt Infowars conspiracy broadcaster. Depending on the outcome of upcoming bankruptcy talks, Mr. Jones could work for decades to pay hefty damages to families of the Sandy Hook shooting victims for spreading lies about them. Mr. Giuliani turns 80 in May, and his future potential income is hampered by suspended law licenses in New York and Washington, D.C.

The financial statements he filed in the court show he is losing money on his revenue-making businesses, such as his WABC radio show in New York.

Mr. Giuliani continues to need lawyers in and out of bankruptcy court where he faces additional lawsuits, including a criminal indictment in Georgia for his and others’ efforts to overturn the 2020 election results in the state. And he was recently indicted in Arizona, where he and others are also accused of trying to change the 2020 results.

Friends have set up two legal defense funds. One is a political action committee, and donors include Elizabeth Ailes, the wife of the late media mogul Roger E. Ailes; Arnold Gumowitz, a New York real estate developer; and James Liautaud, the founder of the sandwich chain Jimmy John’s. Another donor is Matthew Martorano, a Puerto Rico-based businessman who is a defendant in a federal fraud case.

The other fund, the Rudy Giuliani Freedom Fund, does not disclose the donors or the amount raised.

According to a court filing, as of the end of January, Mr. Giuliani had drawn more than $1.2 million from the two funds to pay his lawyers. The total amount raised from both funds has not been publicly disclosed.

His creditors’ lawyers have issued subpoenas for the names of the donors to his defense funds and receipts.

 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20299]

Everything Trump touches dies, example # 43,571. Things not going well for Rudy:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Pato del Muerto 51913]

I’m not up on current debtor law, mostly bird law, but I believe he has to go either to jail, to Georgia (ironically), or to Australia. 

[Gatorubet 29391]

I’m not up on current debtor law, mostly bird law, but I believe he has to go either to jail, to Georgia (ironically), or to Australia. 

I’m not gonna lie, I would pay money to watch Rudy box a kangaroo

[Fudge Nuggets 18825]

On 3/30/2024 at 9:27 AM, Red Five said:

Hope it was worth it Rudy. Whatever "it" was. 

Didn’t Borat suck his dick?

[dcbc 14179]

8 minutes ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

Didn’t Borat suck his dick?

Borat Subseequent Movie Film, actually.

[YGIFS 19443]

On 5/10/2024 at 4:18 PM, Pato del Muerto said:

I’m not up on current debtor law, mostly bird law, but I believe he has to go either to jail, to Georgia (ironically), or to Australia. 

Rudy, "See, if I move to Australia...all my debts become equity because it's all reversed in the Southern Hemisphere."

Me, "Yeah, that's not a thing Rudy.  Australia can just seize your assets all the same or extradite you back the United States."

Rudy, "I have, and am, the worst fucking attorneys."  

[Sawbonz 26735]

On 5/1/2024 at 10:37 PM, bolverk said:

🎶 A message to you, Rudy! 🎶

I don’t thing he can stop his foolin’ around or straighten right out

[Biff Tannen 44917]

29 minutes ago, YGIFS said:

Rudy, "I have, and am are, the worst fucking attorneys."  

fixed

[Gatorubet 29391]

On 5/10/2024 at 4:12 PM, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

 

I want to tell that guy, “ I know, man I love to see it too!”

[Underdog 27966]

^ Lead singer of the 80’s Billy Joel cover band? 

['stache 21489]

Hate when this thread is bumped and it not because he hung himself. It’ll come soon enough I suppose.

[atomheartbevo 88750]

4 hours ago, 'stache said:

Hate when this thread is bumped and it not because he hung himself.

In the closet of a Bangkok hotel room?

[Neonmoon 38126]

Can’t wait for this retarded penguin to die 

[Al Czervik 1204]

9 hours ago, Underdog said:

^ Lead singer of the 80’s Billy Joel cover band? 

[atomheartbevo 88750]

https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/14/politics/arizona-officials-giuliani-indictment-2020/index.html

Arizona prosecutors have tried for weeks – and so far failed – to serve Rudy Giuliani with notice of his indictment related to an alleged scheme to overturn the 2020 election results in that state.

Giuliani is among a group of former President Donald Trump’s allies indicted last month in Arizona alongside the 11 individuals who acted as fake GOP electors from the state in the last presidential election. But the former New York City mayor and one-time attorney for Trump is the only defendant prosecutors have been unable to serve with a summons, according to Richie Taylor, a spokesperson for the Arizona attorney general’s office.

The summons is a formal notice that Giuliani has been criminally charged and must appear before a judge on May 21, and a team of prosecutors and investigators working for Arizona Democratic Attorney General Kris Mayes has made multiple attempts to locate him, Taylor told CNN.

Giuliani, multiple associates have told CNN, is in Palm Beach, Florida, at his residence. According to two sources familiar with Giuliani’s movements, the former mayor has been traveling back and forth between Palm Beach and New York City where he has been alternating between working on a planned appeal of the $148 million defamation judgment against him, which a district judge denied Tuesday, and the sale of his $5.7 million New York City apartment, where prosecutors have tried for weeks to serve him.

According to Taylor, two agents for the attorney general’s office traveled to New York City with plans to hand-deliver the notice to Giuliani the day after the state-level grand jury handed up its indictment.

The agents believed Giuliani was likely in his New York City apartment because he had recently video streamed from there – which they determined by matching the setting of the feed with pictures of the interior of the residence from an old real estate listing.

But upon arriving at the building, a person at the front desk told the agents they were not allowed to accept service of the documents, according to Taylor, who added that the individual did not dispute Giuliani lived there.

“We were not granted access,” Taylor added, confirming details previously reported by the Washington Post.

While Trump is not among those charged in Arizona, the details in the indictment suggest he is “Unindicted Coconspirator 1.”

“In Arizona, and the United States, the people elected Joseph Biden as President on November 3, 2020,” the indictment reads. “Unwilling to accept this fact, Defendants and unindicted coconspirators schemed to prevent the lawful transfer of the presidency to keep Unindicted Coconspirator 1 in office against the will of Arizona’s voters.”

Trump’s former White House chief of staff Mark Meadows, his close adviser Boris Epshteyn, the Republican National Committee’s top lawyer for “election integrity” Christina Bobb and former Trump campaign aide Mike Roman are among those charged in Arizona alongside Giuliani.

All of the defendants except Giuliani have been served.

[Biff Tannen 44917]

Can one of you lawyers explain why this shit has to be hand delivered?  I really don’t know. It’s such an odd quirk of the judicial system. Among other infuriating and horrifying quirks. 

[bolverk 28885]

 

[atomheartbevo 88750]

4 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

Can one of you lawyers explain why this shit has to be hand delivered?  I really don’t know. It’s such an odd quirk of the judicial system. Among other infuriating and horrifying quirks. 

IANAL (I do anal, has nothing to do with this topic), but I'm assuming because otherwise people can claim they didn't get the notices (got lost in the mail).

[BamaATL 15728]

13 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

IANAL (I do anal, has nothing to do with this topic), but I'm assuming because otherwise people can claim they didn't get the notices (got lost in the mail).

[South Austin 51409]

4 hours ago, BamaATL said:

Yeah, sometimes the U.S. Postal Services loses mail.

[Fudge Nuggets 18825]

“Hey boss, we found him but the doorman won’t ring us in. I guess there’s nothing else we can do.”

Quite a difference from serving a no-knock warrant with guns blasting at the wrong location. Yeah, equal justice and shit. 

[TwiceHorn 30715]

7 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

Can one of you lawyers explain why this shit has to be hand delivered?  I really don’t know. It’s such an odd quirk of the judicial system. Among other infuriating and horrifying quirks. 

Usually, notice of a criminal suit is served by an arrest warrant, which can mean the whole swat type thing that we usually associate with a search warrant (that often includes an arrest warrant).

in some circumstances, usually for lower-level crimes, the defendant or attorneys are notified by the prosecutors and asked to being the defendant in to voluntarily surrender.  In very low-level cases, like traffic tickets and petty misdemeanors, a summons is simply mailed to the defendant.

The situation is complicated when the court is in one state and the defendant another.  LEO from one state generally cannot make arrests in another state.  So, this is one of those situations where contacting the defendant to arrange a voluntary surrender makes a lot of sense.  Otherwise, authorities in the charging state must go through channels to have an arrest warrant served where the defendant lives, and there will be an extradition proceeding.  Between states, extradition is usually pro forma, but it is something that happens.

In civil suits, which are far less serious, personal delivery is the usual standard, but there are many exceptions.  Failure to appear after valid service in a civil suit generally means you lose the civil suit. so it takes care of itself.

In the far more serious criminal context, personal service is a requirement to which there are few exceptions.  Failure to appear in a criminal case is a crime in and of itself, so we need to make damn sure the defendant has actual notice of the suit, whether by arrest and appearance, or personal delivery, or whatever.

It appears then, for whatever reason, Arizona authorities are not seeking an arrest warrant and extradition in NY or FL.  And presumably, they can contact Giuliani's multitudes of civil attorneys, but they are probably disinclined to accept service and arrange for surrender, being civil attorneys.  And Rudy is a fucking weird weasel that seems to be in full denial of the legal jackpot in which he sits.

Edited May 16 by TwiceHorn

[Nice Guy Eddie 13267]

Giuliani seems to be at the point that he’s not worried about civil suits because he can’t pay them back in 10 lifetimes. And for any criminal case, he might just be looking to delay delay delay. And then eventually claim health problems that keep him from helping in his defense, inability to be on court, etc.

[TwiceHorn 30715]

So, a fun fact in all of this that has been elided.

The filing of a bankruptcy petition halts all civil litigation by and against the debtor, by the "automatic stay."  That is intended to halt the "first come, first served" nature of securing and collecting judgments against the debtor, so the bankruptcy court can impose some order on the thing.  Some litigation, if necessary, can be continued, with court permission.  Some litigation gets to continue on in the forum in which it was brought, some has to continue in the bankruptcy court, without a jury.

But it also halts litigation BY the debtor.  In this case, Rudy wanted to appeal the judgment in favor of Ruby Freeman.  But the bankruptcy judge denied his ability to appeal, considering it both a waste or resources and a distraction from the task of reorganization.

So that's fun.

This judge, in the SD NY Bankruptcy Court, seems more aggressive than Alex Jones' judge, for example.  However, as flaky as Jones' businesses are, they are more legitimate income-producers than anything Rudy had going on.  And debtors are generally allowed to continue to operate businesses that are generating significant revenue.

[Degenerate Gardner 4057]

Put out an APB for RUDY:

Rudy Giuliani Is Missing, Last Seen In Palm Beach County

Quote

BOCA RATON, FL (BocaNewsNow.com) (Copyright © 2024 MetroDesk Media, LLC) — If you’ve seen former  New York City Mayor and one time Donald Trump advisor Rudy Giuliani, you may want call authorities in Arizona. Giuliani has seemingly vanished after his indictment in Arizona for election interference. He owns a condo in Palm Beach County.

 

Edited May 17 by Degenerate Gardner

[Born to Run 6186]

Yeah, sometimes the U.S. Postal Services loses mail.

I feel like it's exceedingly infrequent and more a function of people being dishonest to avoid setting debts etc.

[ohchaucer 1443]

Alright, Mr. Giuliani. I know you're in there. I know you can hear me. You win, okay? You win. I can't do it any more. What d'you want from me? Apology? Alright, I'm sorry. There, I said it, I'm sorry, I'm sorry.

[atomheartbevo 88750]

15 minutes ago, ohchaucer said:

Alright, Mr. Giuliani. I know you're in there. I know you can hear me. You win, okay? You win. I can't do it any more. What d'you want from me? Apology? Alright, I'm sorry. There, I said it, I'm sorry, I'm sorry.