Mass Shootings

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Overall Japan is a safer country from violent crime but they do have their own warts. Their culture is as extreme towards the end of the spectrum of "the individual only exists to serve the society" as the US is on the "I'm the only one who matters" side. They end up with similar suicide rates and mental illness issues as the US. 
Also they claim a 99%+ solve rate for violent crime but the dirty secret there is if they can't find the perpetrator they find "close enough". 
Societies should strive to be in the middle of basically every issue. Too far one way or the other creates massive problems. But the US will never achieve it with the polarization and extreme individualistic culture. 

Obviously no place is perfect and culturally we could never be the same as a largely homogeneous society like Japan. But there is a large swath of middle ground I wish we could strive for.

[totallynotabuttpirate 5294]

22 hours ago, Gap03 said:

Furk - I'm getting dragged to Orlando for a cheer competition at the end of April

[Gap03 3143]

9 minutes ago, totallynotabuttpirate said:

Shoulda known I'd regret that.  As a dad of a 12-yr old daughter, I definitely keep an eye out for the totallynotabuttpirates creeping around the competitions ...

[Biff Tannen 44917]

1 hour ago, Goredho said:

Not sure if this really belongs here because this dipshit was kind enough to get himself arrested before fully utilizing his stockpile of weaponry.

https://mailchi.mp/austintexas.gov/apd-detectives-arrest-a-man-involved-in-a-road-rage-incident?e=9d4c6e8b1f

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE                             March 31, 2023 APD Detectives Arrest a Man Involved in a Road Rage Incident

Case:                          23-0300830                   Time:                          3:25 p.m.   Date:                          Monday, January 30, 2023   Location:                    5700 Block of S IH 35 SVRD   Arrested:                    Austin Martin, White male, 23-years-old On Monday, January 30, 2023, at approximately 3:25 p.m., Austin Police Department (APD) officers responded to a call regarding a road rage incident in the 5700 block of S IH 35 SVRD. Someone called 911, stating that a man pulled a gun out and pointed it at two people in a different vehicle, including a child, while driving.   Aggravated Assault Unit detectives identified the suspect as Austin Martin. Martin was arrested and charged with two counts of Aggravated Assault with a Deadly Weapon.   As the investigation continued, detectives conducted a warranted search of Martin's residence. During that search on March 29, 2023, 19 firearms were discovered.

This happened in January.  Did they just find him now?

[Hermanator 6562]

27 minutes ago, Patricio Swayze said:

Obviously no place is perfect and culturally we could never be the same as a largely homogeneous society like Japan. But there is a large swath of middle ground I wish we could strive for.

Me too, but my point is the Japanese versions of us are also striving for that same middle ground

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Me too, but my point is the Japanese versions of us are also striving for that same middle ground

Their starting point seems a bit better. At least from the outside looking in.

[Bullneck 18617]

 

[Guest]

What a fucking week. Three children killed at school and I feel like it's the second or third biggest story of the week. 

[Mdhorn 5819]

Heard 4 dudes get shot the other day a few miles away.  Over 50 rounds, 3 dead and 1 wounded.  Strip club shooting that didn't make the national news.  I've only heard that one other time (associated with a shooting) and that was when I was outside talking to a neighbor and heard what I thought were firecrackers--so many of them.  Turned out a guy was shot over two dozen times by officers a few miles away.  They wanted him deader than dead.  I hear gun shots daily, but some are poachers and others just firing.  What's wild is that I hear similarly when I stay at a friends million dollar home in Dallas over Christmas.  Would think a nice neighborhood would spare you the noise from the plebes but nope.  Gunfire is just par for the course in an American's daily life.

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

 

Holy shit. Is there a way to send that dude money? I can’t believe he stayed so calm amongst those fucking pieces of shit. Not a single human among them. Vampires and ghouls. Laughing, making jokes.

Hey right wing fuckfaces, these are the people you elect that you think will make “sensible” gun laws.

Fuck y’all.

[aggie08 20210]

27 minutes ago, Bullneck said:

 

That dude knew every single person's name in that entire building. Every one. He's been talking to this elected leaders for months. Probably years. If more people had the courage, commitment, patience, and ability to stay calm (and I sure as shit don't) like him, we might actually get somewhere.

 

Edited March 31, 2023 by aggie08

[RomaVicta 29472]

6 hours ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

this gif irritates me.  he's clearly saying "i don't know"

[Eskimohorn 5544]

When "shall not be infringed" was written, this is what we were talking about from that dude's arsenal:

And also everyone had the right to bear arms as a volunteer in a militia to defend your community from “natives, foreign invaders, and armed factions” according to the Federalist Papers.

[Eskimohorn 5544]

Obviously no place is perfect and culturally we could never be the same as a largely homogeneous society like Japan. But there is a large swath of middle ground I wish we could strive for.

We can also toss out Switzerland as a comp to a gun-ownership country with low crime.

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

We can also toss out Switzerland as a comp to a gun-ownership country with low crime.

I don’t know much about Swiss gun laws, but I went and took a look at a few documents and articles. It appears they have better control of the acquisition of firearms. I don’t know how hard it is to get an exemption, but there appears to be quite a few forms and gates one must go through to be allowed to own automatic weapons and semi-auto with high capacity.

I am willing to bet that they also don’t have politicians that actively try to cut funding for public/mental health at every turn.

https://ultra.swiss/switzerlands-mental-health-care-is-this-the-secret-to-their-happiness/

[Biff Tannen 44917]

So at the end of the latest Pod Save America, they interviewed a Dem rep from rural Washington that beat a magat R in the last election. She is a 34 year old mom, owns an auto shop, very salt of the earth and I agreed with her on a lot. 
 

HOWEVER, when she was asked about an assault weapons ban, she said absolutely not. When pressed, she couldn’t come up with any reason other than it’s a constitutional right. He even probed further to see WHY she thought we needed access to them and she just couldn’t answer. Just stammered and hemmed and hawed.

Fucking rage  

 

Edited April 1, 2023 by Biff Tannen

[Goredho 17154]

5 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

So at the end of the latest Pod Save America, they interviewed a Dem rep from rural Washington that beat a magat R in the last election. She is a 34 year old mom, owns an auto shop, very salt of the earth and I agreed with her on a lot. 
 

HOWEVER, when she was asked about an assault weapons ban, she said absolutely not. When pressed, she couldn’t come up with any reason other than it’s a constitutional right. He even probed further to see WHY she thought we needed access to them and she just couldn’t answer. Just stammered and hemmed and hawed.

Fucking rage  

 

Do you think she would have been elected to office in rural Washington if she took a Betoesque hardline stance on guns?  It sounds like she does not.

[Lurch 5916]

Exactly. If you expect honest answers when they plan to run again, you’re missing the point of why they even did the interview

[hornmpa96 2516]

1 hour ago, Biff Tannen said:

So at the end of the latest Pod Save America, they interviewed a Dem rep from rural Washington that beat a magat R in the last election. She is a 34 year old mom, owns an auto shop, very salt of the earth and I agreed with her on a lot. 
 

HOWEVER, when she was asked about an assault weapons ban, she said absolutely not. When pressed, she couldn’t come up with any reason other than it’s a constitutional right. He even probed further to see WHY she thought we needed access to them and she just couldn’t answer. Just stammered and hemmed and hawed.

Fucking rage  

 

Define ban in your mind? Does it require current owners to turn in their existing ARs?

Personally, I’m for safe storage and red flag laws, licensing and registration for gun ownership and capacity limits. However, I generally stop short of a full ban especially a ban that converts current law-abiding citizens into criminals by virtue of their prior purchase of legally acquired assets.

Edited April 1, 2023 by hornmpa96
Added safe storage

[Biff Tannen 44917]

3 hours ago, Goredho said:

Do you think she would have been elected to office in rural Washington if she took a Betoesque hardline stance on guns?  It sounds like she does not.

Of course not.  The point is, they don't know WHY they want assault weapons.  She can't articulate it and neither can her constituents.  If you can't come up with a reason NOT to ban assault weapons, then spare me the histrionics.  

1 hour ago, hornmpa96 said:

Define ban in your mind? Does it require current owners to turn in their existing ARs?

Personally, I’m for safe storage and red flag laws, licensing and registration for gun ownership and capacity limits. However, I generally stop short of a full ban especially a ban that converts current law-abiding citizens into criminals by virtue of their prior purchase of legally acquired assets.

What was wrong with bringing back the ban we had in the 2000s?  Seemed to do ok.

[hornmpa96 2516]

13 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

Of course not.  The point is, they don't know WHY they want assault weapons.  She can't articulate it and neither can her constituents.  If you can't come up with a reason NOT to ban assault weapons, then spare me the histrionics.  

What was wrong with bringing back the ban we had in the 2000s?  Seemed to do ok.

The original ban grandfathered weapons already owned. Given the proliferation of these guns since the 2004 expiration, I don’t think a ban with grandfathering would have significant impact while all of the other potential mitigations would likely significantly reduce gun-related violence. Just my opinion.

[Jatrain 284]

23 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

Of course not.  The point is, they don't know WHY they want assault weapons.  She can't articulate it and neither can her constituents.  If you can't come up with a reason NOT to ban assault weapons, then spare me the histrionics.  

What was wrong with bringing back the ban we had in the 2000s?  Seemed to do ok.

I just went and listened to this and her response (lack there of) was pathetic.  Pretty disappointing of Jon (or Dan?  Not sure?) to not push her harder on it.  
 

That’s being said, I’m sure the actual answer is “Yes, I would support it but if I say that I’ll never get re-elected in this backward ass county I live in.”

Edited April 2, 2023 by Jatrain

[WhatTheBuck 28574]

26 minutes ago, hornmpa96 said:

The original ban grandfathered weapons already owned. Given the proliferation of these guns since the 2004 expiration, I don’t think a ban with grandfathering would have significant impact while all of the other potential mitigations would likely significantly reduce gun-related violence. Just my opinion.

I say we put it to the test. 

[GW Hayduke 1943]

10 hours ago, hornmpa96 said:

The original ban grandfathered weapons already owned. Given the proliferation of these guns since the 2004 expiration, I don’t think a ban with grandfathering would have significant impact while all of the other potential mitigations would likely significantly reduce gun-related violence. Just my opinion.

A prohibition on selling high-capacity, high-velocity, high rate-of-fire firearms with grandfathering isn’t expected to immediately solve the problem. It would need to work with other firearm control measures. It would however immediately be a sizable barrier for the acquisition by the young - those just turning of age - or those just experiencing a crisis and wanting to act out.  Over the course of time, that benefit would slowly increase as those type of firearms naturally decay. We can increase the speed of that benefit with either voluntary or mandatory buy-back programs.  The speed could be further increased over time with requiring a registration and permitting system (for those grandfathered) and prohibiting inheritance transfer absent a permit. We could also tack on required training to the grandfather permit.

No single measure should be expected to fix our problem. We would need an array of measures. 

[Captainant 26861]

34 minutes ago, GW Hayduke said:

No single measure should be expected to fix our problem. We would need an array of measures. 

And this is the crux of the bad faith progun argument. They will ALWAYS demand gradual, incremental action - and when there's no world changing results from that small change, they'll use that as a data point to support their argument that there's nothing we CAN do about it. 

It's all built around a toddler mindset of protecting their toys and exerting as much defiance as they can 

[Neonmoon 38126]

35 minutes ago, Captainant said:

And this is the crux of the bad faith progun argument. They will ALWAYS demand gradual, incremental action - and when there's no world changing results from that small change, they'll use that as a data point to support their argument that there's nothing we CAN do about it. 

It's all built around a toddler mindset of protecting their toys and exerting as much defiance as they can 

Exactly. 

So how many kids will be killed in the next shooting? 

[RomaVicta 29472]

On 3/31/2023 at 10:52 PM, Patricio Swayze said:

I don’t know much about Swiss gun laws, but I went and took a look at a few documents and articles. It appears they have better control of the acquisition of firearms. I don’t know how hard it is to get an exemption, but there appears to be quite a few forms and gates one must go through to be allowed to own automatic weapons and semi-auto with high capacity.

I am willing to bet that they also don’t have politicians that actively try to cut funding for public/mental health at every turn.

https://ultra.swiss/switzerlands-mental-health-care-is-this-the-secret-to-their-happiness/

Perhaps InuitHorn remembers something the way that I do. A long time ago, I read about the Swiss Army which functions as a highly trained militia whose soldiers kept their weapons at home for swift deployment. Maybe that's not the case anymore if it ever was.

Okay, a few molecules of initiative escaped their cell and forced me to google. From wikipedia:

Quote

The regulations of the Swiss militia system stipulate that the soldiers keep their own personal equipment, including all personally assigned weapons, at home (until 2007 this also included ammunition[4]), or in an armoury. Compulsory military service applies to all male Swiss citizens, with women serving voluntarily. Males usually receive initial orders at the age of 18 for military conscription eligibility screening. About two-thirds of young Swiss men are found suitable for service, while alternative service exists for those found unsuitable.[5] Annually, approximately 20,000 persons are trained in basic training for 18 weeks (23 weeks for special forces).

Looks like since 2007 they shouldn't have ammo. Still, up to that year, the Swiss had military level weapons in their homes with ammunition. Still serves as an example, I think.

[RomaVicta 29472]

3 hours ago, GW Hayduke said:

A prohibition on selling high-capacity, high-velocity, high rate-of-fire firearms with grandfathering isn’t expected to immediately solve the problem. It would need to work with other firearm control measures. It would however immediately be a sizable barrier for the acquisition by the young - those just turning of age - or those just experiencing a crisis and wanting to act out.  Over the course of time, that benefit would slowly increase as those type of firearms naturally decay. We can increase the speed of that benefit with either voluntary or mandatory buy-back programs.  The speed could be further increased over time with requiring a registration and permitting system (for those grandfathered) and prohibiting inheritance transfer absent a permit. We could also tack on required training to the grandfather permit.

No single measure should be expected to fix our problem. We would need an array of measures. 

Maybe we could make carrying in public a felony. I don't know, might stop this shit:

Or this shit:

I know the guys at the top are just using free speech, and the guy at bottom was determined to provide medical aid, I mean look at all the medical gear he's carrying.

Like the Jan 6 insurrection, all you need to know has been placed before the public's eyes. A public with any lick of common sense would be shouting to stop this shit. In my lifetime, GOPs, Dems, and the NRA would have likely joined together to make the above an impossibility.

Now two out of three of those organizations are hopelessly corrupt and malign. The public's reaction is to get a minute's worth of charge out of it, change the channel then thinks it's normal when they see it again.

I would venture to say that in a sane, non-gun culture that police would enforce the law I suggest by giving a single warning with clearance to open fire if compliance is not immediate. Those weapons are not much different than explosive vests once the gunman decides to use it.

I'm past the tipping point of losing my faith in rational thought and reaction changing much of anything or even recognizing what must immediately be addressed. I don't know how Greta Thunberg gets through her days.

"What are you idiots doing?"

 

Edited April 2, 2023 by RomaVicta

[RomaVicta 29472]

26 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Perhaps InuitHorn remembers something the way that I do. A long time ago, I read about the Swiss Army which functions as a highly trained militia whose soldiers kept their weapons at home for swift deployment. Maybe that's not the case anymore if it ever was.

Okay, a few molecules of initiative escaped their cell and forced me to google. From wikipedia:

Looks like since 2007 they shouldn't have ammo. Still, up to that year, the Swiss had military level weapons in their homes with ammunition. Still serves as an example, I think.

Enought to generate unprecedented claims of thinking and praying about the victims and their families. I'm the Republican scumbags are on their knees several times a day calling out to God and hardly able to conduct business because their thoughts are so consumed with the tragedy of high velocity bullets blasting holes in and blowing limbs off of children.

Show the pictures. This discussion is too abstract. The Washington Post published a sterile, animated recreation of the damage the bullets did and warned us all about the possible shock of seeing it. Do they know that we watch TV and movies? 

 

[Nuge 1945]

When America is finally "great" again will there still be school shootings? 

 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20299]

This is what freedom looks like in America.

[CooterBrown 17695]

I don’t know much about Swiss gun laws, but I went and took a look at a few documents and articles. It appears they have better control of the acquisition of firearms. I don’t know how hard it is to get an exemption, but there appears to be quite a few forms and gates one must go through to be allowed to own automatic weapons and semi-auto with high capacity.

I am willing to bet that they also don’t have politicians that actively try to cut funding for public/mental health at every turn.

https://ultra.swiss/switzerlands-mental-health-care-is-this-the-secret-to-their-happiness/

Every adult male has a military rifle as part of the national militia but all ammo is stored at police stations and would be distributed from there if there was a mobilization. There’s no private possession of ammunition.

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Maybe we could make carrying in public a felony. I don't know, might stop this shit:

Or this shit:

I know the guys at the top are just using free speech, and the guy at bottom was determined to provide medical aid, I mean look at all the medical gear he's carrying.
Like the Jan 6 insurrection, all you need to know has been placed before the public's eyes. A public with any lick of common sense would be shouting to stop this shit. In my lifetime, GOPs, Dems, and the NRA would have likely joined together to make the above an impossibility.
Now two out of three of those organizations are hopelessly corrupt and malign. The public's reaction is to get a minute's worth of charge out of it, change the channel then thinks it's normal when they see it again.
I would venture to say that in a sane, non-gun culture that police would enforce the law I suggest by giving a single warning with clearance to open fire if compliance is not immediate. Those weapons are not much different than explosive vests once the gunman decides to use it.
I'm past the tipping point of losing my faith in rational thought and reaction changing much of anything or even recognizing what must immediately be addressed. I don't know how Greta Thunberg gets through her days.

"What are you idiots doing?"

 

If those 3 dickheads have significant others, I’m willing to bet they have to fake every orgasm.

[henrygandorf 28608]

 

[jimmyjazz 45055]

I didn't realize some of their staff carried weapons.

I think this is one of the biggest lies promulgated on America -- the idea that a "good guy with a gun" is a serious deterrent.  If you gave me a pistol, my odds of taking out the bad guy are probably well lower than my odds of hurting myself or some innocent bystander.  It takes training, a LOT of training, to be effective in these situations.  Karen Kindergarten is not up for the task.

[Tuco 5003]

5 hours ago, GW Hayduke said:

A prohibition on selling high-capacity, high-velocity, high rate-of-fire firearms with grandfathering isn’t expected to immediately solve the problem. It would need to work with other firearm control measures. It would however immediately be a sizable barrier for the acquisition by the young - those just turning of age - or those just experiencing a crisis and wanting to act out.  Over the course of time, that benefit would slowly increase as those type of firearms naturally decay. We can increase the speed of that benefit with either voluntary or mandatory buy-back programs.  The speed could be further increased over time with requiring a registration and permitting system (for those grandfathered) and prohibiting inheritance transfer absent a permit. We could also tack on required training to the grandfather permit.

No single measure should be expected to fix our problem. We would need an array of measures. 

Yep.  Ban the sales.  Offer buybacks. 

For anyone saying x or y will not fix the problem, be sure to point out that the problem will absolutely continue to worsen without legislation.  Lethal firepower will continue to get more effective and cheaper as time goes on.  It is the inevitable conclusion to improving technology in design and production.  Every day we do nothing is a day we decide "it's not bad enough yet."  It will continue to get worse until we, as a society, decides it's gotten bad enough.  

If you ban the sales and offer buy backs, two things happen: guns get more expensive and no one invests in improving their lethality, because the is no longer a market. 

[henrygandorf 28608]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

I didn't realize some of their staff carried weapons.

I think this is one of the biggest lies promulgated on America -- the idea that a "good guy with a gun" is a serious deterrent.  If you gave me a pistol, my odds of taking out the bad guy are probably well lower than my odds of hurting myself or some innocent bystander.  It takes training, a LOT of training, to be effective in these situations.  Karen Kindergarten is not up for the task.

scroll to the 5 min mark to get this answered for you.

 

"the average security guard makes $16 an hour.  not a lot of wiggle room to be a fucking hero."

[WhatTheBuck 28574]

15 hours ago, henrygandorf said:

 

Obviously they needed more guns. 

[HamsterHookah 112]

19 hours ago, henrygandorf said:

scroll to the 5 min mark to get this answered for you.

 

"the average security guard makes $16 an hour.  not a lot of wiggle room to be a fucking hero."

Since we are posting comedy that cuts to the core of the issues:

 

[Guest]

I'm not a "make the schools into fortresses" guy. I will say that given our nation seems interested in doing jack shit about guns, having glass paned doors without wire embedded in them seems like a bad move. We saw this guy (and I believe Sandy Hook) just shoot through locked doors and crawl in. 

[Chuckie Finster 22252]

Jon Stewart sorta touched on this a bit in his recent viral interview, but the biggest tell that Republicans don't believe any of the shit they spew is to look at any scenario where a kid is caught with a gun in school and DOESN'T carry out a school shooting.

When this happens, while the solutions are varied, the reaction is consistent among all sides of the political spectrum.  This is bad, how could they let this happen, needs to be fixed, etc.  There's nobody who suggests that the school was in fact safer that day by the addition of another gun.  There's nobody who is asking why the student brought the gun and suggesting it was going to be used for protection.

The mere presence of a gun on school grounds is universally viewed as a threat when there are no political points to be scored.  The "more guns is the key to safety" only emerges when Republicans are forced to justify their inaction.  

Fuck 'em all.

[WhatTheBuck 28574]

3 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:

Jon Stewart sorta touched on this a bit in his recent viral interview, but the biggest tell that Republicans don't believe any of the shit they spew is to look at any scenario where a kid is caught with a gun in school and DOESN'T carry out a school shooting.

When this happens, while the solutions are varied, the reaction is consistent among all sides of the political spectrum.  This is bad, how could they let this happen, needs to be fixed, etc.  There's nobody who suggests that the school was in fact safer that day by the addition of another gun.  There's nobody who is asking why the student brought the gun and suggesting it was going to be used for protection.

The mere presence of a gun on school grounds is universally viewed as a threat when there are no political points to be scored.  The "more guns is the key to safety" only emerges when Republicans are forced to justify their inaction.  

Fuck 'em all.

There’s also the fact that whenever the NRA holds a big event or when the Republicans hold a large gathering, guns are strictly prohibited. Prohibited? They should be required. No one gets in without an AR-15 and at least 240 rounds of ammunition. That way they can ensure that the space will be extra super safe. 

[GreenspointTexas 9353]

Cant we just tax the fuck outta guns? Like, make an AR 15 like $10,000?

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

I do find the no firearms at NRA events very amusing and telling. I mean, can’t a convention center full of good guys with guns surely eliminate any threat? Are y’all/they scared someone will shoot up the place? Inquiring minds want to know.

[Longhorn_Fan68 33693]

59 minutes ago, GreenspointTexas said:

Cant we just tax the fuck outta guns? Like, make an AR 15 like $10,000?

nah, make ammo like $500/round

[hookemATL 11496]

8 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

nah, make ammo like $500/round

Gun is $100, trigger is $50,000.

[Longhorn_Fan68 33693]

1 minute ago, hookemATL said:

Gun is $100, trigger is $50,000.

sure, that works too

[Pancho 41815]

 

[RomaVicta 29472]

Those students impress me. Well done.

[Asithappens 974]

On 3/31/2023 at 3:16 PM, Bullneck said:

 

 

Republicans: Pieces of Giant Shit.

 

That's all one needs to say. Pieces of Giant Shit. Or Giant Pieces of Shit. Take your pick.