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Elon Musk: Officially a fraud and piece of shit. Official or unofficial war criminal?


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10 hours ago, chainsaw said:

Is leasing always bad? I haven't really heard the arguments and I've never leased a car but I have been curious about not "owning" a depreciating asset.

 

7 hours ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Leasing is better than buying a car every 5 years.  Assuming like most people access to a vehicle is a necessity to you, don't think of the car as the asset, the asset is not having to pay for it.  Of course that means being seen around town in an older vehicle, and a lot of people see cars as status symbols rather than a functional tool.

 

6 hours ago, choripan said:

Lot of cases, especially relating to tax treatment, where a lease makes sense. Especially for business owners.

In our personal case a few months ago, we leased a PHEV Jeep Wrangler in order to get the full $7500 EV credit, and then bought it out as soon as we could get a payoff from the leasing company. That's thousands of dollars in our pocket thanks to leasing 

If you are not going to drive a vehicle in the ground, and are going to want a new car every 3-5 years, a leasing structure is not a bad way to do it, especially since you generally get favorable cash flows vs. buying to own.  Also, leasing is an easy answer for a business owned becuase then you just deduct the lease payments vs. depreciation (or mileage depending on how you work it).  

Anyway, back to the discussion of what a piece of shit Elon is.  He really, really is.

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12 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Ended up behind a cybertruck today. And realized you can’t see out the back. At all.

be3119e8712231f7b6de7cc711cb1982.jpg

The solution? A camera display on the center monitor. Do you trust that? I mean, beyond the fact that it’s Austin, and NOBODY checks their mirrors anyway.

It’s a dumb fucking design. And everything I see or learn about it just makes it dumber.

your sticker reads DIP?  

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11 hours ago, F250 said:

What boggles the mind about the Cybertruck is the price. If I was going to spend that amount of money on a "truck" I'd just buy a King Ranch.

From a company that knows what a fucking truck should be.

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20 hours ago, Gene Parmesan said:

Of course that means being seen around town in an older vehicle, and a lot of people see cars as status symbols rather than a functional tool.

This is another example of poor financial skills.  And I realize you are not saying otherwise.

Edited by Fudge Nuggets
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55 minutes ago, Nivek said:

your sticker reads DIP?  

Parking sticker for the garage my daughter parked in when she was living and working here, and driving that particular set of wheels.  Driving that one while my wheels are in the shop.

MY parking sticker reads "DIPSHIT."

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Anyone know how much Tesla has spent on developing the Cybertruck? Given the lengthy delays it has to be a ton. I’m guessing the next few quarterly earning reports and investor calls are going to be ugly given the flagging sales of their (stale) core lineup and the shit reception of the truck.

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Bringing the thread back to reality, read this that makes the "pay package-gate" really interesting. Spoilering it but here is a link: https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2024-04-17/elon-wants-his-money-back?srnd=undefined

The tl/dr:

He had super ambitious goals set by the Board and he would be paid handsomely if he hit them. He had 10 years to hit them. He hit them in 3.

Today, in 2024, Tesla has backslid to where those goals are essentially "unachieved".

This is problematic for him because he's going back to the Board and asking them to re-vote on the original deal, but this time with full knowledge of everything that has happened since 2018.

This is quite hilarious.

Spoiler

I do not want to suggest that Tesla is purely Elon Musk’s personal piggybank, because that’s not true. It makes electric cars. It continues to invest in new projects. It has, historically, generated a whole lot of value for Tesla shareholders other than Elon Musk, though not as much recently. (It has lost more than 60% of its value since the peak in 2021.) But Telsa is also Musk’s main piggybank, and he has a lot of needs. Musk went and solved the (difficult, capital-intensive) problem of electric cars, and now Tesla is his main source of wealth for solving the many other difficult, capital-intensive problems that interest him.

You know the story: In 2018, to satisfy Musk’s Mars ambitions, Tesla’s board granted him a package of conditional Tesla stock options that would be worth something like $55 billion if Tesla succeeded wildly. It did: By 2021 Tesla was worth $1.2 trillion, Musk got all the options, and for a time they were worth more than $100 billion. He used his vast Tesla wealth — selling shares and borrowing against them[1] — to fund his various other projects, like buying Twitter and also I am sure something Mars-related. By this year, he was back asking Tesla’s board for more money. But meanwhile a disgruntled Tesla shareholder named Richard Tornetta had sued the company, arguing that Musk’s pay package was illegal, and in January that Delaware judge ruled that it was. And so Musk’s options disappeared, arguably making at least a theoretical dent in his ability to do Mars, AI, brains, tweets or whatever it is he’s up to now.

Today Tesla filed a proxy statement for its 2024 annual meeting, asking shareholders to fix that problem and turn the money faucet back on. There are two specific asks:

That Delaware judge ruled that Musk’s 2018 pay package was illegal in part because she found problems with the shareholder vote approving it. So Tesla is asking the shareholders to approve the 2018 pay package again, so Musk can get his options back.

It was a Delaware judge who ruled that Musk’s pay package was illegal, because Tesla, like most big US public companies, is incorporated in Delaware. Presumably a Texas judge wouldn’t do that, since Texas apparently loves Musk as a matter of state policy. So Tesla is asking the shareholders to approve reincorporating the company in Texas. 

Each of these raises some complications.

First, the economics of re-approving the 2018 pay package. In 2018, Tesla’s board granted Musk 12 tranches of stock options, each representing 1% of Tesla’s stock at the time. The tranches would vest based on performance targets, particularly market capitalization targets: The first tranche vested if Tesla hit a $100 billion market cap (up from about $59 billion at the time of the grant), and the other 11 tranches would vest at $50 billion increments, up to $650 billion for the final tranche.[2] He had 10 years to hit those milestones; he hit them in three. Today’s proxy says:

The Board in 2018 believed that the hurdles for performance were exceptionally high, and subsequently, Mr. Musk met — and exceeded — each and every key milestone in the 2018 CEO Performance Award, milestones that have resulted in remarkable value creation for our stockholders.

And it quotes shareholder letters saying things like[3]:

The requirements of the 2018 package were extraordinarily ambitious — and they were delivered. It is not reasonable for investors to expect to re-absorb the canceled options and consider all that value creation to have been delivered to us for no consideration.

And:

My choice for Tesla being my primary investment is because of the pay package selected for Elon Musk. No different tha[n] many sales personnel, when you perform, you are awarded, sometimes very handsomely for it. To the opposite of this, many CEO’s are awarded great sums even when the company i[n] many cases, drastically fails to perform for its shareholders which is why I looked at them years ago and didn’t choose them.

And, right, by 2021, all the milestones had been achieved. But Tesla’s market capitalization, as of yesterday’s close, was just a hair over $500 billion; it was lower this morning. Four of the milestones — covering roughly one-third of Musk’s options — have been un-achieved! Of course in 2018, shareholders could reasonably have said “if he gets this company to $650 billion, that will be amazing, and we should reward him,” and if later the market cap fell they’d have no argument for taking the rewards back. But they’re being asked to re-approve the grants in 2024, and “we need to reward Musk for making this a $650 billion company” is a bit of an odder ask when it’s actually a $500 billion company.

 

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3 hours ago, texasdago said:

Going to a car wash should not be complicated.  Good Lord.

Sir, I think you missed the fact that Cybertruck has the rare and amazing "Enable free roll" feature which is very hard to find these days.

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4 hours ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Videos in original thread are worth watching lulz. 

 

 

Do not wash your car...

So if I'm driving my truck through a downpour that then breaks out into sunlight I'm still okay right?

Unless someone happens to throw some soap on it as the downpour starts?

Just trying to keep track of the various Cyber-catastrophe situations.

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21 minutes ago, gofuckyourself said:

Do not wash your car...

So if I'm driving my truck through a downpour that then breaks out into sunlight I'm still okay right?

Unless someone happens to throw some soap on it as the downpour starts?

Just trying to keep track of the various Cyber-catastrophe situations.

I’m guessing cybertrucks won’t be sold in Jolly Old England,

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7 hours ago, GhostOfTomJoad said:

So a grown man wearing a Boba Fett shirt AND has a big Star Wars toy hanging in his garage bought a CT? Where's Triumph the Insult Dog when you need him?2f838a41883c7307fa1a435dedb72f06.jpg


A Triumph episode mocking the Tesla fan boys would be amazing.  So much material. 

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15 hours ago, aggie08 said:

What the fuck is "Car Wash Mode"?

 

Because I had to look it up:

https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/cybertruck/en_us/GUID-65384C1F-86F2-44E8-A8BC-8A12E7E00A40.html

Quote

If taking Cybertruck to an automatic car wash is necessary, Car Wash Mode closes all windows, locks the charge port, and disables windshield wipers, Sentry Mode, and walk-away door locking.

 

So, Tesla spent considerable R&D time, money and brainpower coding something that essentially a large swath of the population is going to take for granted at a car wash:  make sure the windows are up, don't open the charging (gas tank) lid, and don't run the wipers.  

 

 

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In looking at this photo:

83763525-13316825-image-a-112_1713374922

 

What's going to happen, warranty wise, when it rains on these vehicles, birds shit on them, etc?  Tesla has already explicitly warned against this kind of thing:

https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/cybertruck/en_us/GUID-65384C1F-86F2-44E8-A8BC-8A12E7E00A40.html

 

Quote

Cleaning the Exterior


To prevent damage to the exterior, immediately remove corrosive substances (such as grease, oil, bird droppings, tree resin, dead insects, tar spots, road salt, industrial fallout, etc.). Do not wait until Cybertruck is due for a complete wash. If necessary, use denatured alcohol to remove tar spots and stubborn grease stains, then immediately wash the area with water and a mild, non-detergent soap to remove the alcohol.

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Post Oak said:

Any of you fellas have to use Barkeepers Friend on your ride.

https://www.cybertruckownersclub.com/forum/threads/bar-keepers-friend-changed-my-cybertrucks-finish.14184/

 

 

My Cybertruck was delivered with quite a bit of staining on a lot of the panels. It’s looked to be from rain. I tried a bunch of softer cleaners first to get off the stains. Windex, waterless wash, full soap wash, generic stainless polish, etc.

None of that worked. So I tried some bar keepers friend that many other suggested. I tried it on a small area, and it looked fine. I then tried a door with lots of staining. I let it sit for one minute and then rinsed it off. The first time I applied very lightly and it dulled the stains, but didn’t remove them. The second time I scrubbed just a little more and it completely removed all the stains and created a perfectly uniform panel.

However, The door is now lighter in color and the finish is a bit more dull / less shiny. I don’t love this effect, but it appears I’m going to have to live with it since I already started. I followed the directions, didn’t let it sit too long and didn’t scrub hard. To help others to do this well and decide if this is for them, I would love some advice or feedback from others if they saw this, or if I did something wrong.

Pic: BKF used on rear door only

Important Edit: after finishing the whole truck, I noticed that the front panel in the picture below still doesn’t match the panel in the rear. I am thinking bar keepers friend didn’t change the panel as much as I thought. When both panels were done the same way they still look different. So if my post scared you away, don’t worry too much. The truck looks amazing with all panels done and I do prefer it better now.
 
Tesla Cybertruck Bar Keepers Friend changed my Cybertruck's finish! IMG_7932
 
Last edited: Apr 

It's more likely that the panels are different qualities or runs of stainless, and that's why the owner is seeing different surface finishes between treated panels. I think the acid in the barkeeper's friend is effectively doing a surface passivation - which is something Tesla should have done at the factory - which gives it a higher gloss and improved corrosion resistance properties. 

Edited by Captainant
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35 minutes ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

In looking at this photo:

83763525-13316825-image-a-112_1713374922

 

What's going to happen, warranty wise, when it rains on these vehicles, birds shit on them, etc?  Tesla has already explicitly warned against this kind of thing:

https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/cybertruck/en_us/GUID-65384C1F-86F2-44E8-A8BC-8A12E7E00A40.html

 

 

 

it's the absolute funniest part of this entire situation, they are essentially selling a truck that is going to look like shit due to, ya know, everything outdoors touching it.

and they are storing them outside an unknown period of time, because of this issue.

it's incredible. they are going to look so bad.

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@Brisketexan OK, we missed out on the Trump Bibles, but I have other horrible ideas. Cyber Pet Rocks. It is like a pet rock, but with wireless technology that connects you to the earth without the dirt.

Alternative plan, we get those little plastic/glass jewels from the dollar store, and repackage that has Cyber Soil: become a master of tech and terraform your kingdom with your favorite color. (Ad featuring Soleil Moon Frye)

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oopsie

Elon Musk says in email that Tesla sent ‘incorrectly low’ severance packages to some laid-off employees

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/04/17/tesla-says-in-email-it-sent-some-incorrectly-low-severance-packages.html
 

Quote

 

Tesla CEO Elon Musk sent an internal email on Wednesday, telling staffers that the company sent out some severance packages that were too low to a number of laid-off workers this week.

“As we reorganize Tesla it has come to my attention that some severance packages are incorrectly low,” Musk wrote in the brief email. “My apologies for this mistake. It is being corrected immediately.”

 

 

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30 minutes ago, Captainant said:

 

1 hour ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

In looking at this photo:

83763525-13316825-image-a-112_1713374922

 

What's going to happen, warranty wise, when it rains on these vehicles, birds shit on them, etc?  Tesla has already explicitly warned against this kind of thing:

https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/cybertruck/en_us/GUID-65384C1F-86F2-44E8-A8BC-8A12E7E00A40.html

 

 

 

Screenshot_20240418-091241.png.d8f32a7d95824f962bf12a39fd6cf608.pngScreenshot_20240418-091541.png.e1396ddc5d7233727737763a79deb483.png

Screenshot_20240418-091817.png.dbce98fd305d5bbeb3b9c1bd223938bd.png

Warranty voided.

Edited by Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand
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1 hour ago, Nivek said:

@Brisketexan OK, we missed out on the Trump Bibles, but I have other horrible ideas. Cyber Pet Rocks. It is like a pet rock, but with wireless technology that connects you to the earth without the dirt.

Alternative plan, we get those little plastic/glass jewels from the dollar store, and repackage that has Cyber Soil: become a master of tech and terraform your kingdom with your favorite color. (Ad featuring Soleil Moon Frye)

Take my money 

1 hour ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

In looking at this photo:

83763525-13316825-image-a-112_1713374922

 

What's going to happen, warranty wise, when it rains on these vehicles, birds shit on them, etc?  Tesla has already explicitly warned against this kind of thing:

https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/cybertruck/en_us/GUID-65384C1F-86F2-44E8-A8BC-8A12E7E00A40.html

 

 

 

Just don't go to HEB on a rainy day.

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Just now, InkaUtexas said:

Take my money 

Just don't go to HEB on a rainy day.

Luckily, HEB won't even be open that day.

And as for Elon and Tesla, they have reached "full aggy" status to me (and as they say, "never go full aggy").  By "full aggy," I mean that their comical, laughable stupidity....is no longer entirely laughable, because it is negatively impacting my fellow Texans in the real world.  Just like I could laugh at aggy as they squeezed their own nuts, and whined incessantly about the BOMC....but I quit laughing when they killed 12 of their own as a direct result of their aggy stupidity, and have harmed a university that is a public asset and resource of my state, educating the people of my state...Elon and Tesla are following the same path.

I've laughed as Elon has repeatedly shot himself in the dick, and as his cult has consistently cheered him on with "brilliant shot, good sir!"  But now....the largest employer in my community is taking it in the shorts because of his stupidity.  A shitload of my fellow Central Texans have lost their jobs...and more are likely to follow.  Elon's utter stupidity is now directly harming my neighbors.  And it fucking pisses me off.

The Elon knob-gobblers, including most of our state leadership, needs to tell him to quit focusing on being a pathetic fucking edge lord, and either start being an actual fucking businessman or clear the fucking way for someone who will be.

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