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Cairn Horn88

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45 minutes ago, The Dog said:

 

I am surprised at Meatball's lack of confidence in his ability to out-jackwagon Trump toe-to-elevated-toe. Cmon Ron, you are way more of an asshole than Trump. Trump's a clown, you're a mechanical wind-up toy goblin. Trump is a jibbering berserk soul, you are a dead-eyed thing.

Ron, Ronnie, Ronnie BooBoo, if you'd just believe in yourself, this could be epic, Werewolves vs. Vampires. Don't puss out. Puss. Gonna cry? Cry Puss. Pusssssssssss.

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5 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

Seems reasonable.  Is it legally correct?  Does the failure to prosecute similar crimes in the past render the law moot?

Take it to the extreme.  For instance, in Chesapeake VA, it is a misdemeanor for a person older than 14 to trick or treat.  Children younger than 14 must limit their trick or treating to the hours of 6 PM to 8 PM.  Otherwise, it's a misdemeanor.  These statutes are never enforced . . . does that imply they CANNOT be enforced in the future?

Full disclosure: I hate Halloween and I'm moving to Chesapeake if Johnny Law will start cracking down on these n'er do wells.

I have no idea why you picked Chesapeake, but I can assure you you don't want to move there, irrespective of your feelings about Halloween

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6 hours ago, Gatorubet said:

I get where you went now.  That said, I could argue that the nature of the doc might have some relevance to the issue of should you have known not to take it, and how did it get in your possession?  If a doc, as discussed by staff, would NOT have ordinarily been on his desk with the other stuff, you might have circumstantial evidence that it was taken by Biden some other way, and possibly knowingly 

But yeah, even way secret stuff unknowingly taken and immediately returned is a Gov prosecutor willful intent proof problem . 

 , 

Sort of a subpoint to all of it was that at some point, some tool like Charlie Kirk is going to start arguing that Biden docs were somehow worse than Trump docs.  That's not an argument someone without a security clearance can win, and even then . . . .

It's so irrelevant to conviction of the crime, or at least to elements of the crime.  It is conceivable that a jury that thinks the classified documents are trivial somehow might nullify.

So, don't sweat it, it don't make a shit.

Edited by TwiceHorn
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Just now, jimmyjazz said:

I was just looking for weird laws.

Broadly speaking, non-enforcement or dissimilar/selective enforcement of laws does not provide a defense to a crime.  It can be used to attempt to get a jury to "nullify," to ignore the jury instructions and acquit.

And, on a very rare occasion, that kind of thing, but usually much worse, can get a judge to dismiss charges on the ground of prosecutorial or governmental misconduct.  Very rare, but see Daniel Ellsberg.  RIP.

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3 hours ago, The Dog said:

 

Meatball Ron should answer the pledge question with, “ He says he’s innocent so why do we need to agree to pardon him?  If he admits guilt and drops out of the race I’ll consider it.”

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https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/16/politics/trump-lawyer-withdraw-jim-trusty/index.html

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A lawyer who was representing former President Donald Trump in his defamation lawsuit against CNN said Friday that he was withdrawing from the case, in the latest sign of the break-up of the Trump legal team since the lawyer, Jim Trusty, and another Trump attorney stopped representing the former president in the criminal documents case against him.

“Mr. Trusty’s withdrawal is based upon irreconcilable differences between Counsel and Plaintiff and Counsel can no longer effectively and properly represent Plaintiff,” Trusty said in a filing requesting the court’s permission to withdraw.

Quote

Trusty, along with attorney John Rowley, previously announced that they would not represent Trump in the charges that special counsel Jack Smith brought against the former president, related to the sensitive government documents he retained from his presidency and his alleged obstruction of the federal investigation into the handling of those materials.

 

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16 minutes ago, TexasEd said:

Meatball Ron should answer the pledge question with, “ He says he’s innocent so why do we need to agree to pardon him?  If he admits guilt and drops out of the race I’ll consider it.”

Yes but Rod is a bitch so that will never happen. 

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16 minutes ago, TexasEd said:

Meatball Ron should answer the pledge question with, “ He says he’s innocent so why do we need to agree to pardon him?  If he admits guilt and drops out of the race I’ll consider it.”

There could be blood in the water, and arguably there is, and Rod would be too scared to take advantage of it.

Casey though? She would not hesitate to. The more wounded Trump is politically, the happier she'd be, and the more she'd pile on.  She'd be subtle, but she'd be out there saying "I believe we should support Trump's right to defend himself in the courtroom.  Trump is a tough man and should have no problem standing up to Jack Smith in a courtroom!"

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23 minutes ago, TexasEd said:

Meatball Ron should answer the pledge question with, “ He says he’s innocent so why do we need to agree to pardon him?  If he admits guilt and drops out of the race I’ll consider it.”


that’s an alpha move, Ron isn’t an alpha 

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28 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Mr. Trusty’s withdrawal is based upon irreconcilable differences between Counsel and Plaintiff

Counsel wanted to be paid and plaintiff is a broke asshole?

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7 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

Seems reasonable.  Is it legally correct?  Does the failure to prosecute similar crimes in the past render the law moot?

Take it to the extreme.  For instance, in Chesapeake VA, it is a misdemeanor for a person older than 14 to trick or treat.  Children younger than 14 must limit their trick or treating to the hours of 6 PM to 8 PM.  Otherwise, it's a misdemeanor.  These statutes are never enforced . . . does that imply they CANNOT be enforced in the future?

Full disclosure: I hate Halloween and I'm moving to Chesapeake if Johnny Law will start cracking down on these n'er do wells.

 

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1 hour ago, Goredho said:

I think they want to eliminate the federal government outside of the military branches.  At least that’s what they want here in red-assed MAGA monkey country.  They are self-described libertarians who view the federal government as disconnectedly oppressive as the English monarchy was in 1776.  They identify with Randy Weaver and Cliven Bundy at a primordial level.

I can understand them feeling they don’t get a return on their tax dollars.  But the hardship these rural farmers and ranchers experience is 95% because time marches on, the world changes, and the only thing they produce or own that anyone cares about anymore is their land.  Yet they feel entitled to a life and livelihood that their grandpa had.

If they ever got what they are fighting for, they’d be without disaster relief when wildfires burned through.  The farmers and ranchers would lose their subsidies and most would fold.  They’d survive, but not as farmers or ranchers.  They would have to sell their farm or ranch and do something else.  The schools their kids go to would further decay, and their kids would get dumber and even less competitive in a world that passed their parents by.

And all of these people would be like:

7poat6.jpg

 

That is so well said.  Fucking infuriating.

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4 minutes ago, Goredho said:

their kids would get dumber and even less competitive in a world that passed their parents by

This is called locking in future republican votes.  
 

they already are too dumb and easily deceived to understand that the cause of their problems isn’t democrats or immigrants or minorities or the federal government, and all of that propaganda will continue working. 

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53 minutes ago, WBT said:

By next fall Ronnie is in need of a serious attitude adjustment.

Coach.jpg

 

And watch out with that other white nationalist group you been running with.  Don’t think I haven’t noticed!

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11 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

withdrawals phrased like that are almost always about a refusal to pay

We know Trump doesn’t pay. But we also know he’s the worst kind of client who doesn’t take his attorneys’ advice, talks too much, and lies constantly. 

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https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2023/06/aileen-cannon-judicial-career-trump-documents-case/674445/

 

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For many judicial nominees, a Senate confirmation hearing is one of life’s most grueling experiences—an hours-long job interview led by lawmakers who are trying to get them to face-plant on national television.

Not for Aileen Cannon. When the federal judge who will oversee former President Donald Trump’s criminal trial testified in 2020, the Senate Judiciary Committee didn’t go easy on her so much as they ignored her.

 

Quote

Cannon, then a 39-year-old prosecutor, appeared on Zoom alongside four other nominees, her face framed by a wall of diplomas on one side and an American flag on the other. Her opening statement lasted all of three minutes and sounded like an Oscar winner’s speech—lots of thank-yous and little else. She didn’t say a word about her legal philosophy or how she would approach the job of a judge. The senators didn’t seem to mind: None of them addressed a question specifically to Cannon for the rest of the hearing. The committee’s chair at the time, Senator Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, skipped the proceeding entirely, as did each of the five most senior Republicans on the panel. The hearing was over after barely an hour. Three months later, while Trump was beginning his effort to overturn his defeat in the presidential election, a bipartisan Senate majority (including a dozen Democrats) voted to confirm Cannon’s nomination as a federal judge in the Southern District of Florida.

 

 

Quote

For low-profile nominations like Cannon’s, perfunctory hearings aren’t unusual. But the scrutiny she was spared in the Senate is coming her way now. After just two and a half years as a judge, Cannon will soon preside over a trial with no precedent in American history. The defendant is the former president who appointed her, and her rulings during the investigation that led to Trump’s indictment have already prompted many legal experts to fear that she will tilt the trial in his favor.

 

Spoiler

But some of the Democratic lawyers who have appeared in Cannon’s courtroom don’t share those worries. They say that she is a smarter, more deliberate, and more even-handed judge than the early criticism of her would suggest. “I think the government should be very happy that they have Judge Cannon,” says Richard Klugh, a longtime defense attorney in Miami who has dealt with Cannon both as a judge and when she served as a federal prosecutor there. Klugh, a lifelong Democrat, told me that aside from her “narrow” rulings on Trump’s case last summer, he had heard no complaints about Cannon from either prosecutors or defense attorneys. “She’s very confident, very honest … and very thorough,” he told me. “She’s confident enough to go through things independently.”

That may be, but she’s extremely inexperienced. Since taking her seat on the bench, Cannon has worked mostly out of a courthouse in Fort Pierce, a two-hour drive from Miami and a town that one local lawyer described to me as “a backwater.” She has presided over just four trials as a judge, none of which covered crimes remotely similar to the willful retention of classified documents that the government has accused Trump of committing. (She is set to oversee a far more complex trial involving alleged Medicare fraud in the coming months.)

Cannon was born in Colombia and is the daughter of Cuban refugees. In her brief statement to the Judiciary Committee, she described how her mother, at the age of 7, “had to flee the repressive Castro regime in search of freedom and security.” Cannon graduated from Duke University, and by the time she earned her law degree from the University of Michigan, she had already joined the conservative Federalist Society. After law school, she embarked on a fairly conventional legal career: She clerked for an appellate judge, spent several years at a large law firm, and then became an assistant U.S. attorney in Miami. In written responses to the Judiciary Committee, Cannon wrote that she considered herself both an “originalist” and a “textualist”—two approaches long identified with conservative judges—but that she would follow all precedents set by the Supreme Court and other appellate rulings.

Two South Florida lawyers told me that they were struck by Cannon’s overt religiosity, which has seeped into her pronouncements in court. She routinely tells defendants “God bless you” after they enter guilty pleas, said Valentin Rodriguez, a lawyer who has appeared before Cannon. “In my entire 30-year career I’ve never had a judge mention God to a client ever,” Rodriguez told me. “She does that as a matter of course.”

Although presidents formally nominate all federal judges, they frequently appoint district-court judges at the recommendation of home-state senators. Cannon told the Judiciary Committee that she was first approached about filling a judicial vacancy by the office of Senator Marco Rubio in 2019, nearly a year before Trump sent her nomination to the Senate. Her appointment came at a moment when Trump and then–Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell were trying to reshape the federal courts by filling as many open judgeships as possible with young conservatives in their 30s and 40s. Three previous nominations for judgeships in Florida’s Southern District had gone to men in their 40s. “It made sense that Trump would select a woman with good credentials who also happens to be Hispanic,” a South Florida defense lawyer who knows Cannon told me. (The lawyer requested anonymity to speak candidly about a judge in their jurisdiction.)

At the time of her nomination, Cannon had virtually no public profile outside of the courtroom. On her Senate questionnaire, she said she had never given a speech, served on a panel discussion, or testified before a legislative body. She had never held public office and told the Senate she had never participated in a political campaign, although she and her husband each contributed $100 to Ron DeSantis’s bid for governor in 2018. The only interview Cannon said she had ever given for publication was for a photo feature on TheKnot.com about her wedding. Her relative anonymity has caused headaches for publications that have searched in vain for a public photo of Cannon that hasn’t already been used repeatedly; almost every story features the same Zoom screenshot from her Senate testimony in 2020.

Like most Republican-appointed judges in Florida’s Southern District, Cannon is known as a tough sentencer. But there have been notable exceptions when she has handed down a shorter prison term than she could have, Rodriguez told me. He mentioned a case in which a 21-year-old defendant, Artavis Spivey, who had been incarcerated on and off since he was 11, pleaded guilty to armed carjacking. He and another defendant committed the crime just 18 days after Spivey had been released from prison. Cannon sentenced Spivey to 15 years, but Rodriguez said she could have added many more years to his term. “She could have thrown the book at him, and I think she saw redeeming qualities in the young man,” Rodriguez said. Spivey had grown up in a troubled home without a father, “kind of given up by his parents,” Rodriguez added. “That experience tended to make me appreciate the fact that she could look beyond just the retribution and vengeance of a sentence and look at the person.”

Cannon also handed down a lighter-than-expected sentence to a 34-year-old man, Christopher Wilkins, who threw a chair at and threatened to kill a federal prosecutor after receiving a 17.5-year sentence on gun and witness-tampering charges. Cannon added six and a half years to his prison term, which was less than the sentencing guidelines called for. “I’ve heard stuff about tough sentencing. I can’t report that. I can report fair sentencing,” Wilkins’s lawyer, Jeffrey Garland, a Republican, told me.

Yet none of the decisions that Cannon has made in her young judicial career have stirred as much controversy as her rulings in the lawsuit that Trump filed after the FBI searched his Mar-a-Lago estate for unreturned classified documents last summer. Cannon initially appointed a special master to review the documents that federal investigators had collected, and barred the government from accessing some of them. The rulings were a gift to Trump at the time and delayed the FBI’s investigation. But in a sharp rebuke of Cannon, the conservative Eleventh Circuit Court of Appeals overruled her decisions and said she should not have even heard the case.

Some legal experts have cited those rulings and the fact that Trump appointed Cannon as reasons for her to recuse herself or be taken off the case. A few of the Florida defense lawyers I interviewed—who, it should be noted, routinely argue against the government’s position—characterized Cannon’s orders as understandable considering how unprecedented the case was. The defense lawyer who spoke on the condition of anonymity, however, was more critical. “That ruling was totally out of bounds,” the lawyer told me.

One of the most significant decisions Cannon now faces is whether to attempt to hold the trial in advance of the 2024 presidential election. Should Trump win the White House, he could quash the government’s prosecution of him. South Florida lawyers were dubious that Cannon could try the case before the election, noting the complexities surrounding classified documents that frequently slow down prosecutions at the federal level. Howard Srebnick, a Democratic defense lawyer on the Medicare-fraud case before Cannon, also praised her early performance on the bench. But he said that it still took 18 months for the Medicare case to get to trial even though it does not involve government secrets. “The notion that this case could go quickly? That’s absurd,” Klugh told me.

Still, Cannon has already issued her first order—one that could indicate she wants to move swiftly. On Thursday, she instructed lawyers who want to take part in the case to get security clearances by next week. That was the first of many decisions Cannon will make that, in ways big and small, will shape the first-ever federal criminal prosecution of a former president. They will change Cannon’s life, creating a reputation for favoritism or fairness where none existed. A young judge whose photograph had never appeared in a newspaper until last year is set to become a household name. As Rodriguez observed with a slightly nervous laugh: “She’s going to be famous for a long time.”

 

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2 hours ago, Goredho said:

I think they want to eliminate the federal government outside of the military branches.  At least that’s what they want here in red-assed MAGA monkey country.  They are self-described libertarians who view the federal government as disconnectedly oppressive as the English monarchy was in 1776.  They identify with Randy Weaver and Cliven Bundy at a primordial level.

I can understand them feeling they don’t get a return on their tax dollars.  But the hardship these rural farmers and ranchers experience is 95% because time marches on, the world changes, and the only thing they produce or own that anyone cares about anymore is their land.  Yet they feel entitled to a life and livelihood that their grandpa had.

If they ever got what they are fighting for, they’d be without disaster relief when wildfires burned through.  The farmers and ranchers would lose their subsidies and most would fold.  They’d survive, but not as farmers or ranchers.  They would have to sell their farm or ranch and do something else.  The schools their kids go to would further decay, and their kids would get dumber and even less competitive in a world that passed their parents by.

And all of these people would be like:

7poat6.jpg

 

This is great, but now do the Green Party.  I can't wait to read friends that feel like they're outliers for government going "Green" while enabling another Trump presidency.  

 

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2 hours ago, Goredho said:

I think they want to eliminate the federal government outside of the military branches.  At least that’s what they want here in red-assed MAGA monkey country.  They are self-described libertarians who view the federal government as disconnectedly oppressive as the English monarchy was in 1776.  They identify with Randy Weaver and Cliven Bundy at a primordial level.

I can understand them feeling they don’t get a return on their tax dollars.  But the hardship these rural farmers and ranchers experience is 95% because time marches on, the world changes, and the only thing they produce or own that anyone cares about anymore is their land.  Yet they feel entitled to a life and livelihood that their grandpa had.

If they ever got what they are fighting for, they’d be without disaster relief when wildfires burned through.  The farmers and ranchers would lose their subsidies and most would fold.  They’d survive, but not as farmers or ranchers.  They would have to sell their farm or ranch and do something else.  The schools their kids go to would further decay, and their kids would get dumber and even less competitive in a world that passed their parents by.

And all of these people would be like:

7poat6.jpg

 

Would auto-tuned Country still come out of the speakers?

Checkmate, Libtard.

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7 minutes ago, Mdhorn said:

This is great, but now do the Green Party.  I can't wait to read friends that feel like they're outliers for government going "Green" while enabling another Trump presidency.  

 

Chances that the Green Party will see a surge next year from morons thinking they are voting for marge?  

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1 hour ago, Pig Bellmont said:

withdrawals phrased like that are almost always about a refusal to pay


the case was too easy, defending a 100% innocent man. That lawyer just wants a real challenge 

or (puts on tin foil hat) trump knows that cannon is going to tank this entire case. So no need to pay his lawyer bills !

(takes off tin foil hat) 

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I'm late catching up on the thread, but didn't they take Trump's passports earlier?  Seems like they scooped them up when they raided MAL, and he groused about it.  I know they didn't return his diplomatic one, but did they give his general passport back?   

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6 minutes ago, pyrohornIII said:

I'm late catching up on the thread, but didn't they take Trump's passports earlier?  Seems like they scooped them up when they raided MAL, and he groused about it.  I know they didn't return his diplomatic one, but did they give his general passport back?   

He did everything right and they indicted him

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1 hour ago, pyrohornIII said:

I'm late catching up on the thread, but didn't they take Trump's passports earlier?  Seems like they scooped them up when they raided MAL, and he groused about it.  I know they didn't return his diplomatic one, but did they give his general passport back?   

Yeah, they gave the others back. Remember he went to his golf club in Ireland back in April during the rape/defamation trial in NYC and wound up cutting that visit short to come back and…defend himself? I’m not sure. For awhile there it looked like he wasn’t going to show up in court at all. I guess he just likes to be seen jetting around to his private resorts on his private plane whenever he’s in trouble with the law. But yeah, they returned his passports after they were taken by the FBI at Mar-a-Lago when they retrieved the stolen documents. 

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1 minute ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Yeah, they gave the others back. Remember he went to his golf club in Ireland back in April during the rape/defamation trial in NYC and wound up cutting that visit short to come back and…defend himself? I’m not sure. For awhile there it looked like he wasn’t going to show up in court at all. I guess he just likes to be seen jetting around to his private resorts on his private plane whenever he’s in trouble with the law. But yeah, they returned his passports after they were taken by the FBI at Mar-a-Lago when they retrieved the stolen documents. 

I'm sure he traveled there with "his" boxes 

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