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Just how down is ou?


TexArcher

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Nah, Nebraska is a special case.  They're a less attractive option than other B10 schools for the big midwest farm boys and other recruits and have lost that running game offense cachet they once had that no one wants to play in anymore.

Even when OU was bad, they still recruited Texas well.  Blake baked a pretty good cake for Stoops.

But, coaching hires involve a lot of luck, basically.  They got lucky, and maybe a little smart, with Stoops, and then Riley for a while.

Edited by TwiceHorn
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Did Riley leave the cupboard bare?  It’s obvious the guy can coach.  
 

Is Venables and the new staff just awful?   Too early to tell?  
 

For the players left behind do they feel rejected and demoralized having “their” coach leave for a bigger better deal?  Now they’re just playing out their dealt hand?  Is there deadwood to cut away?
 

When is the last time a Longhorn coach left for another job on his own volition?  Ever?  
 

Editor’s note:  I’m not concerned about nor worried for OU’s well being.  They could lose every game 5 years and I’d be pleased as punch. 

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13 minutes ago, deadshank said:

Did Riley leave the cupboard bare?  It’s obvious the guy can coach.  
 

Is Venables and the new staff just awful?   Too early to tell?  
 

For the players left behind do they feel rejected and demoralized having “their” coach leave for a bigger better deal?  Now they’re just playing out their dealt hand?  Is there deadwood to cut away?
 

When is the last time a Longhorn coach left for another job on his own volition?  Ever?  
 

Editor’s note:  I’m not concerned about nor worried for OU’s well being.  They could lose every game 5 years and I’d be pleased as punch. 

I think the consensus is that defensive recruiting was falling off and the offensive talent mostly went with Riley, or elsewhere.

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4 minutes ago, Goredho said:

I think there will be college football before 2021 and college football after 2021.  NIL, transfer portal, super conferences, all that is just getting started.  It is a tectonic shift for college football.

Agree with this.  It's clear that the SEC, ou, and probably some others were paying players before NIL.  Now that everyone can do it, and players can really build a brand, I believe that the future of college football lies in the sexier destinations that have bottomless alumni pockets.  NIL should be great for Texas, USC, Oregon, and even Miami.  It figures to really hurt ou, maybe Ohio State, and maybe even the SEC schools that aren't in Florida.  There's a reason Saban is pissed about all of this.  

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Nebraska isn’t their fate. OU will be fine if they hit on coaching hires. Venables is looking rough but I’ll wait until next year to fully form an opinion. Is a fair point that he was left a uniquely gutted program and he should probably get a pass to some degree for taking lumps in Year 1. But yeah, not tending well.

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I still can’t fathom that they hired the same dude they ran off as DC a few years ago. I am afraid that the stakes are too high with the conference move and that barring some miracle turnaround that he’ll be fired after next year.

Maybe they’ll fall for it again and hire Muschamp!

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One thing I saw yesterday that is true and that a great qb makes a world of difference. And they ain’t got one right now. Maybe they got through the portal again and probably will have too and get a great qb recruit in to develop behind him. That defense is dog shit too so they have a ton of work to do. 

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19 minutes ago, gmr548 said:

Nebraska isn’t their fate. OU will be fine if they hit on coaching hires. Venables is looking rough but I’ll wait until next year to fully form an opinion. Is a fair point that he was left a uniquely gutted program and he should probably get a pass to some degree for taking lumps in Year 1. But yeah, not tending well.

A big issue for Venables is the terrible staff he hired on defense.  If Lebby gets QBs, WRs and a decent RB their offense will get better.

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Maybe, but here’s something to think about regarding Venables and his staff. I haven’t seen the following mentioned anywhere, albeit I didn’t read the OU game thread after being at the game, but the OU staff stopped gathering the position groups into huddles on the sideline midway through the second half yesterday. They fucking quit as a staff with more than a quarter to play. That doesn’t bode well for a turnaround. 
When Mack Brown’s 1998 team went down big for a second straight game against UCLA, the whole staff and team did the opposite of what we saw from OU. That team kept playing and attempted a comeback against a superior opponent. They played all the way through the final whistle and the end result wasn’t fully disastrous. It also set a tone for the rest of that season that he and others have mentioned over the years. 
Similarly but even more absurdly, Stoops took his team into the Cotton Bowl in 1999 and they really believed they were winning that game. They went up big early and then tried to hang on. They were crushed when they lost and their fans on the boards proclaimed that Stoops was doing “big  things” and would bring them back to national prominence. We mocked them for it. 
Anyway, there was none of that fight in OU or their staff yesterday. If a puppy is going to be a big dog, he is going to bite you hard early. I don’t see that, again, gratefully, with Venables and crew. 

Didn’t catch that, but agree. They really did quit yesterday. It was very strange to see. I was pissed they got the ball back with two minutes left or whatever it was because I thought they had a good chance of scoring on Texas’s 9th string defense and ruining the shut out.

Running the clock out on the final possession when you have 0 on the board on the Cotton Bowl is… Something. One of several things from yesterday I can’t imagine the locker room will respond well to.
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Just now, gmr548 said:


Didn’t catch that, but agree. They really did quit yesterday. It was very strange to see. I was pissed they got the ball back with two minutes left or whatever it was because I thought they had a good chance of scoring on Texas’s 9th string defense and ruining the shut out.

Running the clock out on the final possession when you have 0 on the board on the Cotton Bowl is… Something. One of several things from yesterday I can’t imagine the locker room will respond well to.

I hope they lose the rest of their games but still beat OSU in bedlam for the sheer lulz of it

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55 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

The answer lies in the original post. The right coach fixes the problems at whatever school he’s at and the rest is largely bullshit. Get a high quality and the problems melt away.

I don’t know if Sarkisian is the guy and he’s still Seven Loss Steve until he isn’t, but I do feel like we can see what a difference he is in overall competence compared to Herman, Strong and even late stage Mack. I do feel like Venables measured against even early Stoops or Riley looks like Chuckles-level incompetent by comparison. That’s gratifying to witness and I hope they hang on to him for half a decade. 

I don’t want Venables gone until someone besides Castiglione is calling the shots. 

Sark is good at the most important thing to be good at in College football- offensive talent collection and play calling. You can’t win a national championship on that alone, and you need some other good traits (he seems to have the soft skills for this job, and everyone likes him) and someone competent on defense, but I really really hope you are going to have to retire this 7 win Steve bit (it’s fair until it isn’t) at the end of the year. It is kind of gutting to think he’d have hit his nickname in week 7 after beating ISU next week if not for an injury to the mulleted one. Long term I just don’t see how this doesn’t work out if Ewers and Arch stay healthy and in the fold and Sark reasonable approximates sobriety. 
 

longer term, you are right about the right guy making a programs problems go away. Coaching is so important at this level, and you can just see that anywhere can become a relevant program with the right guy. Mike Leech gets Tech to 11-1 and then gets Wazzu to big bowls and relevance before having Klan aggy looking like a top 10 team in year 3 (or is it 4). Fleck doing interesting things in Minnesota. Rutgers was good for a minute with the proper sociopath. Nobody should ever feel like a situation is hopeless but in the world of NIL where OU loses their strategic advantage in cheating that job has a much lower floor than it used to, and I’m super excited to see OU explore that floor over the next 2.5 years before they shit can BV- who was a terrible hire from the word go and in way over his head. 
 

Also, really looking forward to turning Alabama into Nebraska over the next decade. 

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6 minutes ago, gmr548 said:

Running the clock out on the final possession when you have 0 on the board on the Cotton Bowl is… Something. One of several things from yesterday I can’t imagine the locker room will respond well to.

I don't think we threw a pass after sometime around late 3rd quarter. Seemed like a mutual calling off of the dogs in the 4th. 

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34 minutes ago, The Dog said:

I’m just happy they finally made a bad hire. He’s John Blake bad.

He is a bad and like others have said they already ran him off before so, there’s a portion of OU fan base that wasn’t thrilled with his hiring from day 1.  I don’t know if he can ever recover from the Texas beat down yesterday.  That rotting dead fish will hang around his neck for a long time and OU fans will be hair trigger to see him go with more loses.

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Think the regression in the OL is also a big key to why they can’t do anything. I wonder how much of their prominence was due to Riley’s offense because they’ve looked awful this year. 
 

I don’t think Venables is the answer to their woes, but that roster is pretty thin at key positions. QB was essentially one person only and their secondary is a joke without Bowman (and even with him). 
 

glad that OU finally fucked up on a HC hire. 

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25 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

Maybe, but here’s something to think about regarding Venables and his staff. I haven’t seen the following mentioned anywhere, albeit I didn’t read the OU game thread after being at the game, but the OU staff stopped gathering the position groups into huddles on the sideline midway through the second half yesterday. They fucking quit as a staff with more than a quarter to play. That doesn’t bode well for a turnaround. 

When Mack Brown’s 1998 team went down big for a second straight game against UCLA, the whole staff and team did the opposite of what we saw from OU. That team kept playing and attempted a comeback against a superior opponent. They played all the way through the final whistle and the end result wasn’t fully disastrous. It also set a tone for the rest of that season that he and others have mentioned over the years. 

Similarly but even more absurdly, Stoops took his team into the Cotton Bowl in 1999 and they really believed they were winning that game. They went up big early and then tried to hang on. They were crushed when they lost and their fans on the boards proclaimed that Stoops was doing “big  things” and would bring them back to national prominence. We mocked them for it. 

Anyway, there was none of that fight in OU or their staff yesterday. If a puppy is going to be a big dog, he is going to bite you hard early. I don’t see that, again, gratefully, with Venables and crew. 

If a puppy is going to be a big dog, he is going to bite you hard early.  Year 2, Texas bit Bama hard, Texas strangled OU. 7 win Steve until he’s not, but no back to back losses this year, and two signature games - one the worst loss ever handed to Ou with an egg on the board? Sounds promising to me.

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2 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

I don’t know when I will feel like Sarkisian can win a national title at Texas, if ever. Maybe when Texas makes a CFP appearance. Maybe someday when Texas is discussed as relevant in the playoff discussion. Hell, maybe if he just wins the fucking conference. But that isn’t today and that’s the only achievement that I measure a coach at Texas by, for better or worse. I certainly think everyone’s personal excitement about how they’re experiencing things makes plenty of sense.

My hesitation in buying is simple still -we saw incompetence last year that wasn’t solely on talent of the roster. We saw it again in the second half against Tech. I am excited about what we’re seeing nonetheless. If Sarkisian leads Texas to a great finish this year, I’ll be as happy as anyone. I don’t pay for part of a suite, pay for part of and help invent an NIL model that the entire country is now replicating, and travel to watch Texas in order to permanently suffer, so fuck yeah, keep winning. The guy has the conference there for the taking this year, so here’s hoping he takes the opportunity by the horns, if you will. 

My bar is simple: prove you can field the best team in your conference.

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Not down enough for my tastes. Because of their ties to us they won't get to Nebraska level. But I want them so broken they can only get 2&3 stars from Texas. No decent big time recruit will want anything to do with them. They have lived off Texas long enough.

Also the last 3 weeks have proven that preseason rankings are trash and should not be used in any serious conversation. These bitches went into the season highly ranked on what exactly?

Fuck 0u!





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2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Nah, Nebraska is a special case.  They're a less attractive option than other B10 schools for the big midwest farm boys and other recruits and have lost that running game offense cachet they once had that no one wants to play in anymore.

Even when OU was bad, they still recruited Texas well.  Blake baked a pretty good cake for Stoops.

But, coaching hires involve a lot of luck, basically.  They got lucky, and maybe a little smart, with Stoops, and then Riley for a while.

And maybe Riley knew something the rest of us didn't when he cut and ran for the coast.  His cupboard may have been empty.  And he took what was valuable there with him.

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42 minutes ago, gmr548 said:


Didn’t catch that, but agree. They really did quit yesterday. It was very strange to see. I was pissed they got the ball back with two minutes left or whatever it was because I thought they had a good chance of scoring on Texas’s 9th string defense and ruining the shut out.

Running the clock out on the final possession when you have 0 on the board on the Cotton Bowl is… Something. One of several things from yesterday I can’t imagine the locker room will respond well to.

 

33 minutes ago, Red Five said:

I don't think we threw a pass after sometime around late 3rd quarter. Seemed like a mutual calling off of the dogs in the 4th. 

might could be but i was fucking shocked and kind of a little mad and disappointed at how they capitulated there at the end. 

i would be on the "fire whoever" bandwagon for that level of quit in that big a rivalry. jesus, it was kind of sad if it wasn't so fucking glorious

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6 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

I don’t know when I will feel like Sarkisian can win a national title at Texas, if ever. Maybe when Texas makes a CFP appearance. Maybe someday when Texas is discussed as relevant in the playoff discussion. Hell, maybe if he just wins the fucking conference. But that isn’t today and that’s the only achievement that I measure a coach at Texas by, for better or worse. I certainly think everyone’s personal excitement about how they’re experiencing things makes plenty of sense.

My hesitation in buying is simple still -we saw incompetence last year that wasn’t solely on talent of the roster. We saw it again in the second half against Tech. I am excited about what we’re seeing nonetheless. If Sarkisian leads Texas to a great finish this year, I’ll be as happy as anyone. I don’t pay for part of a suite, pay for part of and help invent an NIL model that the entire country is now replicating, and travel to watch Texas in order to permanently suffer, so fuck yeah, keep winning. The guy has the conference there for the taking this year, so here’s hoping he takes the opportunity by the horns, if you will. 

I’m barely in the don’t care anymore category. Very much a wait and see mode so I’m not projecting anything here.  I was simply stating that if evidence of winning big later is present early in future champions then this year at least has started with those embryonic positive outcomes. Will he win big? I’m not really that interested in spending mental energy on asking and answering it, I’d rather focus my intensity elsewhere and just go along for the ride here. 

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36 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Coaching is so important at this level, and you can just see that anywhere can become a relevant program with the right guy. Mike Leech gets Tech to 11-1 and then gets Wazzu to big bowls and relevance before having Klan aggy looking like a top 10 team in year 3 (or is it 4). Fleck doing interesting things in Minnesota. Rutgers was good for a minute with the proper sociopath.

Throw Josh Heupel in there as well. 18 months out from inheriting a smoking crater in Knoxville and they are hosting a matchup of undefeated top ten teams next week against Bama with a real shot to win it. 

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